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At 2/22/06 01:51 AM, Mighty_Genghis wrote: Now how does that look to you? To me it is extremely Leftist.

The 25 point plan was leftist. However, I believe that was drawn up when Anton Drexler was leader and before they became the Nazi Party.

As soon as Hitler got in charge he campaigned on whatever would get him votes. He preached socialism to the working class, nationalism to the middle classes, and conservatism to the Elites.

Yes, if you look at these thigns it does appear as though he was leftist, but, for example, the fact that Hitler assainsated Rohm, a socialist member, in the night of long knives and at least one of the Strasser brothers ( Gregor I think), who was the Socialist leader of the Nazis, and the only real challenge rot hitlers position as leade. If he was a leftist then he wouldn't have had eithe rof those two people killed as they would have represetned what he believed in.

And he hated communists, if he was socialist, then he wouldn't have that much of a problem with them.

And look at how that turned out today...

At 2/22/06 01:15 AM, Velocitom wrote:

At 2/22/06 12:38 AM, redskvnk wrote: but Nazi Germany directly killed more than six million civilians.

Civilians, yes. Jews, no.

Most people claim that 6 million jews were killed, but actually only 5 million were killed. And I know that doesnt seem like much of a difference, but is rougly 20% or 1 million off.

I never made any distinction between Jews and "Other People." Your point is a nonpoint, really.

And Bush is a Republican, doesn't mean all Republicans would go to war on unreliable intelligence does it? What point are you trying to make?

At 2/22/06 05:06 PM, TehChahlesh wrote: And Bush is a Republican, doesn't mean all Republicans would go to war on unreliable intelligence does it? What point are you trying to make?

There's a difference between Republican and Neocon.

Everybody only counts the 6 million JEWS.but in the concnetration camps another 3-5 million others including gypsies,homos,people of faith,communists were killed.

So I would say altogether the Nazis wasted about 10-15 million people.

Since we're arguing about word semantics, I thought I would whip out the ol' google dictionary. Notice the part saying that fascism is most similar to nazism. Since we all agree that fascism is extreme right-wing, the meaning of nazism would be too, and thus Hitler would be extreme right-wing. But as RedSkvnk said earlier, it would be arbitrary to assign an idealogy to him, because he was such as extremist he would make anything look bad.

for against
abortion atheism
capital punishment capitalism
censorship communism
Christianity "degenerate" art
eugenics democracy
euthanasia feminism
genocide Freemasonry
gun control gypsies
Leni Riefenstahl films homosexuals
racial purity Jehovah's Witnesses
vegetarianism Jews
labor unions
miscegenation
nudism
pacifism
Poles
pornography
prostitution
psychoanalysis
Slavs
smoking

At 2/22/06 06:16 PM, lordkau wrote: Dumbshit I didn't do right.

http://www.rotten.co..o/nazi/adolf-hitler/

*yawn*

Typical conservative bullshit.

Hitler was a monster, not a liberal, conservative, libertarian, homosexual, or a leftist.

At 2/22/06 05:42 PM, muteecho wrote: Everybody only counts the 6 million JEWS.but in the concnetration camps another 3-5 million others including gypsies,homos,people of faith,communists were killed.

So I would say altogether the Nazis wasted about 10-15 million people.

The ONLY figures I have ever heard are 6 million jews killed and 5 million others.
That is a lot of people.

At 2/22/06 12:13 PM, Tri-Nitro-Toluene wrote: Yes, if you look at these thigns it does appear as though he was leftist, but, for example, the fact that Hitler assainsated Rohm, a socialist member, in the night of long knives and at least one of the Strasser brothers ( Gregor I think), who was the Socialist leader of the Nazis, and the only real challenge rot hitlers position as leade. If he was a leftist then he wouldn't have had eithe rof those two people killed as they would have represetned what he believed in.

I agree that Hitler was more right than left, but I must point out that he assassinated Rohm because Rohm wanted to use the SA to wipe out the German army. Hitler knew he would need the support of the army, so he simply changed all the leadership of the SA.

Just as a side note, Strasser spread many of the 'one testicle,' 'sexual deviant' and syphillis rumors about Hitler that still survive today.

I didn't read the article, but I wonder if Hitler was such a leftist, why did he take such inspiration from the fascist regime of Benito Mussolini? He abolished unions (great idea), and brutally suppressed the left, often using them as scapegoats (Reichsdag fire, burning books with Bolshevik taint, etc.). He invaded Russia as an ideological campaign, as much as, or more than, for Lebensraum.

I understand why some would see his strong altruistic stance as socialism, particularly when it comes to the peasants, but in the cities he preached a life of luxury that arguably lost him the war, since he allowed peacetime goods to be produced until 1943. As Tri-Nitro already stated, he represented the ideal for every class, which is not universally left or right, but I tend to think he leaned a little more to the right in practice.

As already pointed out, the polar extremes of the political spectrum end up meeting, think of it as an ellipse (one of the reasons both Nazi Germany and Stalin Russia looked to Sparta for inspiration).

And as already pointed out, who really cares what political identity Hitler was. I'd rather talk about what was going through his head, so we can find out how to exterminate total disasters of the human race like him.

Mighty_Genghis was a Leftist...

* oh yes, i went there*

I think this explains it:

He wasn't at all.

Nazism doesn't fir on the left-right scale.

His party did collaborate with the Communist party a few times, it also collaborated with the Conservatives. In fact, Hitler never gained complete control, the Conservatives famously shot down one of his orders.

They can't brush this on to the left.

At 2/22/06 01:51 AM, Mighty_Genghis wrote:

It was the Left who were on Hitler's side, not the conservatives. And the Left were on his side because he was one of them.

The ones on his side were the ones he didn't kill. Anyone who wasn't on his side ended up dead.

http://jonjayray.netfirms.com/hitler.html

[ Despite the blatant Conservative bias in this paper, he's right, Hitler and the Nazis were mostly Leftists. What I find hard to believe is how a man who was brave, intelligent, serving the interests of his people, and an environmentalist can be disliked by anyone who actually knows the truth about him. ]

Gee, how can we dislike Hitler? I mean, he ONLY enslaved part of the world, and he only INSTIGATED the genocide, it's not like he did it himself. Many look at political beliefs as being a line graph, with left and right. However, it is more accurately described as a circle, with conservative and liberal values being an x axis of sorts and libertarian and fascism being y axis. Hitler was fascist, not liberal or conservative. He had ideas that were liberal, and ideas that were conservative. Then he had the crazy ideas like: let's kill all the jews!

At 2/23/06 01:00 PM, WolvenBear wrote: Hitler was fascist.

Some scholars like to seperate Nazism from Fascism.

Nazism holds the race above the state, whereas Fascism preffers the state.
Nazism holds that it is unethical for the state to have control over religion (Hitler never considered Judaism a religion) and Fascism doesn't object to there being a state sponsored religion.

There were other differences, but I can't recall them.

Liberal/democrats are far closer to Nazis than conservative/republicans,.

Here are some facts to chew on:

1a) Nazis were famous for burning huge piles of books that contained views that dissented from theirs.
1B) College liberals burn (and steal) huge piles of conservative newspapers because they contain views that dissent from theirs.

2B) Liberals are rabidly anti-tobacco and want to abolish it.
3B) Hitler was rabidly anti-tobacco calling it the “red man’s revenge on the white man” and wanted to abolish it.

3A) Hitler, the penultimate nazi, was a Vegetarian who believed in animal “rights”.
3B) Most (if not all) vegetarian, tree hugging, animal “rights” activists are avowed democrats.

4A) Hitler labeled certain peoples as “sub-human” (untermenschen) and didn’t bat an eye when millions were killed.
4B) Liberals label unborn babies “sub-human” and don’t bat a eye when millions are killed.

5A) NAZI stands for the National “Socialist” German “Worker’s party “.
5B) “Socialists” always vote democrat, which, incidentally, is often referred to as the “Worker’s party”.

6A) Hitler hated jews, killed jews and thought they should be wiped off the face of the earth
6B) Liberals support Palestinians, who hate jews, kill jews and think they should be wiped off the face of the earth.

7A) Hitler had Reni Riefenstahl to make blatant propaganda for him that masqueraded as film.
7B) The Democrats have Michael Moore to make blatant propaganda for them that masquerades as film.

8A) Nazis had the “Hitler Youth” program to indoctrinate impressionable young minds.
8B) Democrats have college professors (90% of whom consider themselves liberal) to indoctrinate young minds.

9A) Nazi’s were germans who hated both America and the American president.
9B) Many germans today including their fuhrer, Herr Gerhard Schoder, hate America and the American president.

10A) Hitler had hate and disdain for organized religion, especially judaism and christianity.
10B) Liberals have hate and disdain for organized religion, especially judaism and christianity.

11A) Many of the top Nazis were homosexuals.
11B) Homosexuals vote overwhelmingly democrat.

Without a doubt, Adolph Hitler, with his anti-tobacco, anti-Israel, anti-religion, pro-animal rights, pro-government intrusion would find success as a modern day liberal.

Prehaps, a liberal of the John Kerry variety, one who, for 20 years, voted MORE liberally than anyone in the senate.

But yet you liberals continue to play “pin the donkey's tail that belongs to me on the other guy" (and not well, I might add).

I reminds me of of a certain Newgrounds user who accused me of being a “jackass” (name-calling, the second favorite game of the libs) for having republican/conservative views.

The fact is, the symbol of the GOP party is an elephant, while the symbol of the democrats is...

Well, no sense beating a dead horse (or should I say donkey?).

Facts are such stubborn things, aren’t they?

We don't classify animals into the political spectrum, only humans.

And Hitler wasn't human, so we have no need to fit him into a political stance.

Nuff said, end thread.

At 2/23/06 01:14 PM, SirLutefisk wrote: Facts are such stubborn things, aren’t they?

You Jews are so silly.

At 2/23/06 08:49 AM, Der_Lowe wrote: I think this explains it:

It's inaccurate. The left-right scale is baws.

At 2/23/06 01:33 PM, ZeroAsALimit wrote:

At 2/23/06 08:49 AM, Der_Lowe wrote: I think this explains it:

It's inaccurate. The left-right scale is baws.

Baws?

I think that graph makes more sense than trying to say he was "left" or "right."

He was a fucking fascist. And yes, I know that there are differences between Nazi fascism and your plain jane fascism. The former is just... more specific, imho.

At 2/23/06 01:14 PM, SirLutefisk wrote: Prehaps, a liberal of the John Kerry variety, one who, for 20 years, voted MORE liberally than anyone in the senate.

Oh my God. Someone casting their honest opinion? There is no place for that in America. Think of the children, they might grow up to think for themselves.

I reminds me of of a certain Newgrounds user who accused me of being a “jackass” (name-calling, the second favorite game of the libs) for having republican/conservative views.

It's funny how you should bring up the issue of name calling when you refer to homosexuals as "...two faggots sucking each other's dicks and putting their dicks up each other’s shit holes..." in your only other post on this forum. Quotes are such stubborn things, aren't they?