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afterdeath
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"Lolita" 2006-01-22 23:27:26 Reply

As some of you may already be aware, the book "Lolita" is pretty much being pulled from school library shelves in Fla., while I've not read the book, I hear it's about some elderly gentlman that takes a sexual fancy to a 12 yr. old girl. It was written about 50 years ago by a (believe) Russian man, I don't have the link right now, I'll post it later. But, my question is, do you think it should stay? why or why not? Don't forget to use your SRE/T charts when planning your answer.

RedSkunk
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-22 23:55:40 Reply

What's an SRE/T chart?

I can't say I've read it either, but I know that it's an established, legitimate novel. It's not smut, these sorts of relationships did and do happen, and it's an issue. It should remain if we are talking about school libraries of high schools (and not preschools).

But even if it was on preschool library shelves, the damn kids wouldn't understand any of it, so it'd still be safe.

Leave the fucking libraries alone, you cocksuckers.


The one thing force produces is resistance.

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LadyGrace
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 00:01:47 Reply

At 1/22/06 11:55 PM, red_skunk wrote: Leave the fucking libraries alone, you cocksuckers.

Not just that, but I'm never one for banning books. Censorship is never a good thing. First they'll say "this is bad," and then take something as harmless as Harry Potter and call it smut and ban it. It's all about limiting freedom. And Lolita is about the self destruction of both characters. The man's loss of self in this little girl and her corruption because of him. It's not harmful unless you simply look at it at face value. But then again, you can claim anything is smut by that logic.


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MoralLibertarian
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 00:12:39 Reply

Sounds like another problem we wouldn't have if we didn't have public schools.

Limon
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 00:16:30 Reply

Because Private Schools never censor anything.

If the book is just a porn then I don't see any reason to keep it in school libraries, I mean it's not like it's banned from purchase. If it has a story that teaches life lessons, then I would push for it to be in the library. I haven't read it, but a good example would be if it taught that child porn was wrong. Then maybe SevenStar would still be here with us. I wonder what he would say on this topic anyhow.

MoralLibertarian
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 00:19:57 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:16 AM, Limon_ wrote: Because Private Schools never censor anything.

not the point. Parents have the choice to send their child to a prudish school that teaches creation science or the choice to send their child to a private school that has Lolita and evolution in the curriculum.

The parents would have the choice, but no, education is a giant government monopoly. That being said, if parents only choice of school curriculum is the public school without assistance from government, why shouldn't parents have the ability to decide through representative democracy what kind of curriculum is taught?

RedSkunk
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 00:22:48 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:12 AM, MoralLibertarian wrote: Sounds like another problem we wouldn't have if we didn't have public schools.

Yes, and humanity would have absolutely no problems at all if we all just killed ourselves. Stellar logic.


The one thing force produces is resistance.

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fli
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 04:00:08 Reply

I've read Lolita about 3 times. It's perversive, but the romance is more real than Romeo and Juleit.

Anyways,
even if it is on selves...

I don't believe kids will read it in general.

morefngdbs
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 10:05:36 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:01 AM, LadyGrace wrote:
At 1/22/06 11:55 PM, red_skunk wrote: Leave the fucking libraries alone, you cocksuckers.
Not just that, but I'm never one for banning books. Censorship is never a good thing. First they'll say "this is bad," and then take something as harmless as Harry Potter and call it smut and ban it. It's all about limiting freedom. And Lolita is about the self destruction of both characters. The man's loss of self in this little girl and her corruption because of him. It's not harmful unless you simply look at it at face value. But then again, you can claim anything is smut by that logic.

;
Nicely said.
Censorship is 100% wrong.
I DO however believe in having Censor ratings Ex: pornography, not legally available to children. or a PG or a XXX rated movie ,they are necessary ,in my opinion.


Those who have only the religious opinions of others in their head & worship them. Have no room for their own thoughts & no room to contemplate anyone elses ideas either-More

gumOnShoe
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 10:33:16 Reply

At 1/22/06 11:27 PM, afterdeath wrote: As some of you may already be aware, the book "Lolita" is pretty much being pulled from school library shelves in Fla., while I've not read the book, I hear it's about some elderly gentlman that takes a sexual fancy to a 12 yr. old girl. It was written about 50 years ago by a (believe) Russian man, I don't have the link right now, I'll post it later. But, my question is, do you think it should stay? why or why not?
Don't forget to use your SRE/T charts when planning your answer.

So you want us to do your homework for you????? --- obviously taken from sort of text question you were given.

Anyway, there is a line as to what younger kids should read in school, but I belive by tenth grade students can handle reading about sex if they can be taught about it in sex ed


Newgrounds Anthology? 20,000 Word Max. [Submit]

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Montgomery-Scott
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 11:28:18 Reply

Censorship is a growing force in our society. If is subversive to our way of life, or, as in this case, people are just massive idiots and don't see what an amazing piece of art the book is, books will get banned. And MoralLibertarian, private schools won't prevent censorship. On the whole, private and parochial schools are more conservitive than the public school curruculum (with many major exceptions, of course, but I'm talking about on the whole.) So if parents don't want censorship, they will send their kids to the non-censoring schools. Supply and demand will kick in, and the prices of the non-censoring schools will skyrocket, while the censoring schools will go out of buisiness. Then there won't be any non-censoring schools that the vouchers will cover, and not even any conservative schools left. By far the easier sollution to that problem than turning the schools into a free maket economy is parents just joining the schoolboard and helping determine the curriculum, what books are read, etc.

x-Toadenalin-x
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 12:44:04 Reply

I don't understand why a book about peadophillia should be censored... it's not as if pretending it does not exist will 'un-write' it, and its not as if knowing about peadophillia will be harmful for children

Furthermore, any person intelligent enough to read the book is probably intelligent enough not to use either of the characters as role models

RedSkunk
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 13:45:13 Reply

At 1/23/06 10:33 AM, gumOnShoe wrote: So you want us to do your homework for you????? --- obviously taken from sort of text question you were given.

I want to see him write, "Leave the fucking libraries alone, you cocksuckers," on his response.

Anyways, wtf is a SRE/T chart?


The one thing force produces is resistance.

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MortifiedPenguins
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 18:04:40 Reply

Saw the movie by Stanely Kubrick, a bit wierd but nothing horrible.

Anyways, i condone against book banning. Hell if we could even get kids to read books, it would be great.

But a question remainds, Where will this End.


Between the idea And the reality
Between the motion And the act, Falls the Shadow
An argument in Logic

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Gunter45
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 18:48:02 Reply

It's a 1st Amendment issue in my mind. This book is not pornography, not by a long shot, and is therefore protected under Freedom of Speech. Sure, the book is graphic, but no more graphic than what you can watch on TV any given evening.

I'm all for censorship of pornography to minors, but this is not pornography. A censorship of this book is ridiculous and a step towards the ability to ban anything that somebody happens to find offensive at the time simply due to brutal realism (like what happened with the Grapes of Wrath in California).


Think you're pretty clever...

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HighlyIllogical
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 18:52:06 Reply

Censorship is crap. It's indemocratic and anti-American, but Florida supported Bush, so that's your comeuppance.

HighlyIllogical
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 18:54:10 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:16 AM, Limon_ wrote:
Because Private Schools never censor anything.

WTF?!!! I'm taking journalism this year and even I know that private schools don't have even the Hazelwood standard applied to them! Private school students have no constitutional protections from censorship! That's 1 of the MANY reasons why public schools are nearly infinately better, at least where I live.

RedSkunk
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 20:25:23 Reply

It was an ironical statement, you fool.


The one thing force produces is resistance.

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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 20:54:49 Reply

At 1/23/06 01:45 PM, red_skunk wrote:
At 1/23/06 10:33 AM, gumOnShoe wrote: So you want us to do your homework for you????? --- obviously taken from sort of text question you were given.
I want to see him write, "Leave the fucking libraries alone, you cocksuckers," on his response.

Please...this is nothing like that, I would think...It's a reasonable question to ask. But seriously, that's basically the most logical response available and one that most people will understand.

MoralLibertarian
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 21:00:18 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:22 AM, red_skunk wrote:
At 1/23/06 12:12 AM, MoralLibertarian wrote: Sounds like another problem we wouldn't have if we didn't have public schools.
Yes, and humanity would have absolutely no problems at all if we all just killed ourselves. Stellar logic.

Not everybody, only the non-master races.

RedSkunk
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 21:04:13 Reply

At 1/23/06 09:00 PM, MoralLibertarian wrote:
At 1/23/06 12:22 AM, red_skunk wrote: Yes, and humanity would have absolutely no problems at all if we all just killed ourselves. Stellar logic.
Not everybody, only the non-master races.

But then who would wash their cars and wipe their asses?


The one thing force produces is resistance.

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MoralLibertarian
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 21:11:29 Reply

At 1/23/06 09:04 PM, red_skunk wrote:
Not everybody, only the non-master races.
But then who would wash their cars and wipe their asses?

Robots

MortifiedPenguins
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 21:14:00 Reply

At 1/23/06 09:11 PM, MoralLibertarian wrote:
At 1/23/06 09:04 PM, red_skunk wrote:
Not everybody, only the non-master races.
But then who would wash their cars and wipe their asses?
Robots

Actually i read in some website that this is a end of the world scenario, though i forget the name.

Something monday or something like that.


Between the idea And the reality
Between the motion And the act, Falls the Shadow
An argument in Logic

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ironmaiden233
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-23 21:27:35 Reply

you should read the book "reading lolita in tehran" its about people reading that book durning khomeni(hope he rots in hell) they are risking there life to read this book. banning that book is denying freedom of spheech.

IllustriousPotentate
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-24 17:34:38 Reply

At 1/22/06 11:55 PM, red_skunk wrote: What's an SRE/T chart?

I googled it. The sixth result:

"NG BBS - Search
What's an SRE/T chart? I can't say I've read it either, but I know that it's an
established, legitimate novel. It's not smut, these sorts of relationships ...
"

This says two things. 1. It's not well-known, and 2. Google indexes pages extremely rapidly.

Odds are, it's some type of new age reading/comprehension/idea presenting strategy, similar to CRISS reading strategies, where instead of just saying or writing your ideas, you bundle them into useless, inane charts.

As for the actual issue, I can't say I have any real problem with the removal of it, as long as school libraries contain all the references and works of literature a student needs to successfully advance their education.

Obviously, Lolita isn't exactly required reading. It's not like they're taking out the works of Darwin or Marx. Not only would few students be concerned at all about its removal, it would still be available at say, public libraries.

The benefits, therefore, of keeping the book in the library are outweighed by the benefits of shutting up some whiny parents. As long as this practice doesn't become so prevalent that many imporant works are kept out of school libraries, then it really isn't that big a deal.


So often times it happens, that we live our lives in chains, and we never even know we had the key...

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DaRKNeZz1
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-24 19:08:08 Reply

Highschool yes, anything below that hellz no.

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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-25 02:47:45 Reply

At 1/23/06 12:16 AM, Limon_ wrote: Because Private Schools never censor anything.

If the book is just a porn then I don't see any reason to keep it in school libraries, I mean it's not like it's banned from purchase. If it has a story that teaches life lessons, then I would push for it to be in the library. I haven't read it, but a good example would be if it taught that child porn was wrong. Then maybe SevenStar would still be here with us. I wonder what he would say on this topic anyhow.

A rare glimpse of nostalgia regarding SevenStar's demise, what a find ! but don't worry , the 16 year-old pedophile is alive and well as a mod of one of the Star Syndicate's more obscure and ultra restrictive forums hiding in the murky depths of the internet away from the FBI , it's quite hard to find him I'll tell you that but he's still around, he's one shady fella. He could still be lurking in NG in a diff. alt there's no way anyone can tell!

T-H
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-25 11:13:30 Reply

At 1/22/06 11:27 PM, afterdeath wrote: As some of you may already be aware, the book "Lolita" is pretty much being pulled from school library shelves in Fla.

There was raging debate in the OK over a book by Melvin Burgess(Trainspotting) called "Junk". It was effectively a teenager's novel, and dealt with heroin use(surprise surprise Melvin) in 15-16 year olds. One sequence involving a girl prostituting herself out in order to raise funds for a fix.

Anyway, there were numerous petitions by teachers all over the place, and eventually the DE was pressured into restoring it to schools.

If that can happen for a fairly average slurry of colloquialisms and some of the most eloquant language in Burgess' vocabulary (namely "fuck" and "cunt") then I would imagine there would have to be some sort of outcry for one of the most critically acclaimed and world renowned works of literature in history?

T-H
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-25 11:15:24 Reply

At 1/25/06 11:13 AM, T-H wrote:
At 1/22/06 11:27 PM, afterdeath wrote: As some of you may already be aware, the book "Lolita" is pretty much being pulled from school library shelves in Fla.
There was raging debate in the OK

LOL read:"UK"

mjairlax
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Response to "Lolita" 2006-01-25 21:41:35 Reply

Censorship is wrong period. First its Harry Potter then its Lolita before any once know it the will be banning the Constitution, Platu, works by Marx and Darwin. If we don't say that banning this book is wrong people will ban books a lot more important then Lolita. Some of the most oppresive societies use book banning as a way to block ideas