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Blow the whistle!

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shazzam
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 10:23 PM Reply

The whistle is a great idea, but I dont like the idea of telling on people, there are certain codes. We are gonna a have a bunch of tatletellers.

roguelancer
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 10:41 PM Reply

I think this is a great way for people to view and judge on what it's really worth...This is great but sometimes this will lead to bad things or not. May be but maybe not. Who knows, do YOU????

shade-v2
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 10:45 PM Reply

This is just massive over kill. The idea of a Blow the Whistle button is insulting and ridiculous. Let me get this straight: You can't trust the users to vote fairly and impartially but you can trust them with a button that will - if clicked enough - rip a submission from the pages of NG? Ok, yeah...?

Look, ya'll made some changes to newgrounds - some people liked them, some didn't, and some, like me, had problems with certain specific aspects of the changes. But now your just solving problems with more problems. Your taking a massively reactive role and casting aside any proactivity.

Part of the beauty of the Blam system is that, if the movie is malicious, stolen, or excessively offensive, we'll take care of it. The people will get rid of it without the involvement of overseers. In fact, I'll bet anything that the initial concept of Newgrounds had a lot to do with developing a website that would be completely self contained requiring almost no supervision by administrators. Now we've got panic buttons, temporary removals, and most importantly - extensive responcibilities of the administrators to not only recieve these "Blown Whistles" but to contact those who claim a rule has been broken, recieve a rebuttal from the author, and possibly play email tag with a number of people.

Now, I'm the one who said that blocking the reviews within the first 100 votes would be harmful to newgrounds, but now we've gone one step beyond harmful. At this point I'm starting to think that y'all just put a lot of time and effort into a lot of coding and, despite it's pitfalls you'll do anything to keep that code alive.

I guess, at this point I have to say: I can get used to the reviews being hidden - I'll deal with that loss - so long as I don't have to deal with the Blam Club or the Clockcrew ganging up on authors they don't like and smacking the shit out of the "Blow the Whistle" button every time they release a movie. Theres far too much fueding and sectorization of users on NG to give people the power to, if even just temporarily, remove a film only on their scouts honor.

Your patching broken pipes together with toilet paper, here.

MsHoneyBear
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:03 PM Reply

Someone said:"There are many accidental clicks on the web. There should be a message such as, "Are you sure you want to report this movie/game for being Stolen?" and you click Okay"

That would definitely be a good idea!

Also having an author rate the movie for content (G,PG, etc..) was a good idea too. BUT THINK ABOUT THIS FOR A SECOND.... YOUR ON NEWGROUNDS WHAT DO YOU EXPECT!! haha have fun with it!
Anyway bravo for the changes, cant wait for the server upgrade!!

kevr1
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:06 PM Reply

At 12/5/02 10:45 PM, shade_v2 wrote: This is just massive over kill. The idea of a Blow the Whistle button is insulting and ridiculous. Let me get this straight: You can't trust the users to vote fairly and impartially but you can trust them with a button that will - if clicked enough - rip a submission from the pages of NG? Ok, yeah...?

Look, ya'll made some changes to newgrounds - some people liked them, some didn't, and some, like me, had problems with certain specific aspects of the changes. But now your just solving problems with more problems. Your taking a massively reactive role and casting aside any proactivity.

Part of the beauty of the Blam system is that, if the movie is malicious, stolen, or excessively offensive, we'll take care of it. The people will get rid of it without the involvement of overseers. In fact, I'll bet anything that the initial concept of Newgrounds had a lot to do with developing a website that would be completely self contained requiring almost no supervision by administrators. Now we've got panic buttons, temporary removals, and most importantly - extensive responcibilities of the administrators to not only recieve these "Blown Whistles" but to contact those who claim a rule has been broken, recieve a rebuttal from the author, and possibly play email tag with a number of people.

Now, I'm the one who said that blocking the reviews within the first 100 votes would be harmful to newgrounds, but now we've gone one step beyond harmful. At this point I'm starting to think that y'all just put a lot of time and effort into a lot of coding and, despite it's pitfalls you'll do anything to keep that code alive.

I guess, at this point I have to say: I can get used to the reviews being hidden - I'll deal with that loss - so long as I don't have to deal with the Blam Club or the Clockcrew ganging up on authors they don't like and smacking the shit out of the "Blow the Whistle" button every time they release a movie. Theres far too much fueding and sectorization of users on NG to give people the power to, if even just temporarily, remove a film only on their scouts honor.

Your patching broken pipes together with toilet paper, here.

You make some valit points, but I think you may be missing the bigger picture. Even if people gang up on clock crew or Blam Club or whatever it is still up to an administrator to determine if the request to pull it is valid. As for the people that insist on carelessly "blowing the whistle" just because they do not care for the author, (from what I understand) will be ignored on future "whistles". I don't know if this is a better solution than putting the reviews back. I mean does it really matter if people are able to view reviews before they vote.. if people are going to vote on a movie based upon its review and review only they are retarted. Some of the people that write reviews have nothing constuctive to say, such as "wtf" as so on. Alot of the time movies that will get saved got horrible reviews just because of hatered of the author, or an inability to understand what good flash is.

karr420
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:11 PM Reply

why all these changes like blow the whistle and crap! I mean just cuz you have a few complaints about not being able to view the score or reviews you slap this "blow the whistle stuff?" I mean this is potentially not good for soem authors of flash. some ppl take reviews personally so they will stalk your profile and do this blow the whistle stuff on all the author's movies. Is this really neccesary. I mean, arent we the one's responsible for taking the shit out of the portal. I don't care about reading the reviews until 100 votes but why not try a more rational decision, like let the authors be able to view the reviews from they're grounds gold menu. that way ppl won't freak about not being able to read the reviews b4 the swf gets blammed. Newgrounds is getting alittle more complicated each day and may drive some ppl to noteven bother coming back.

I appreciate all you who run newgrounds for trying to improve this great website for us fans, but think about the so called "improvements a little more b4 you decide to avtually slap it in.
-Clifton

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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:12 PM Reply

Now when you click VIEW ALL on the portal, it does not show any movies under 100 votes. now all of the old movies that have not been blammed or protected surely will be lost forever.

So I guess now blam club's only hope lies on the most recent.

THIS IS THE WORST UPDATE EVER!


you don't know if i'm joking or not

thougar
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:15 PM Reply

hurray for the new system!!!
im not getting blammed quite as fast now, my movie got to over 100 views! (this means i must be getting better!)

Kaymon
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:15 PM Reply

People that vote just for points are asshats.

iOcide
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:36 PM Reply

MEH LIKE!

FrozenAssassin
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 5th, 2002 @ 11:42 PM Reply

Sounds Good but i don't quite get the blow the wistle. Can someone explain it to me better. i have a new sn. FrozenArchangel. if someone could im me and explan it i'd appreciate it.

RKO420
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 12:00 AM Reply

ok man

Blow the whistle!

creamyspy69
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 12:21 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 06:58 PM, Shoopuf_Rider wrote: I love this new feature!! NG just keeps getting better every day!

I hate this new feature!! NG just keeps getting worse every day!

creamyspy69
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 12:34 AM Reply

P.S. This shit is beginning to feel like fucking rocket science. Can we please just go back to the way it used to be? 25th, 50th, 75th, 100th votes get you a blam. No protections, no nothing. Pico animation kicks in and you got your happy fucking blam. Jesus Christ we can't ALL be geniuses like the Fulp Bros. and liljim!!!!!!!!!!

creamyspy69
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 12:49 AM Reply

P.P.S. These rules are plain and simply goddamn insulting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

neo-catalyst
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 12:57 AM Reply

My system has been working tip top round here =)

Nightshadeplus
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 01:13 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 07:08 PM, MonsPubis wrote: And what the hell qualifies as "excessively pornographic"?

I guess it has no redeeming value. I know that sounds vague but that's the only answer I can come up with.

humpfre762
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 02:13 AM Reply

i noticed that when you blow the whistle, it counts as a vote of 0. What if you vote 0 on the movie and then blow the whistle. Does it count as two blams?

Compdude
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 03:06 AM Reply

I applaud your continued efforts to make the voting system as fair and equitable as possible. You have all put in a great deal of effort recently to make this new system work!

Blow the whistle!

vgamer47
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 04:22 AM Reply

Blow the whistle... good idea!

anyway, I was just wanting to point out that the experiece point window that pops up says this:

"As a registered user, you can accumulate up to ten experience points per day by voting on movies. You can deposit once per day - any points you acquire after your deposit will carry over for the next 24 hours, into the following day."

but I don't think the experience does carry over anymore, fix this please

liljim
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 04:49 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 10:45 PM, shade_v2 wrote: This is just massive over kill. The idea of a Blow the Whistle button is insulting and ridiculous. Let me get this straight: You can't trust the users to vote fairly and impartially but you can trust them with a button that will - if clicked enough - rip a submission from the pages of NG? Ok, yeah...?

I am not going to go into the full details of how the system works, but the movie is not pulled completely from the site - it is put to one side until one of the administrators have had a chance to check the movie out and assess whether the users who've reported complaints are rightfully doing so.

This saves time for the people who're voting, since flagged movies won't show up in the Portal listing in the first place. People won't feel that they have to open a review window up and fill in the details with "Hey, this is stolen" - they will simply have to click the link.

Authors aren't really punished for any of this: movies that are wrongfully removed from the listing will be returned to the listing if there's nothing wrong with them, and all future flags against those movies will be ignored. To sum up:

If you're an author and you're uploading your own work and it follows the submission guidelines in the Portal (which you have to agree to before you can upload your work!), you have nothing to worry about.

If you're someone who's voting in the Portal and you see something that potentially violates the rules in the Portal, you have nothing to worry about - all you so is click!

I don't know what your definition of "overkill" is, but this is less taxing on the system and less harmful to authors - I can imagine it being quite disheartening for them to get reviews like, "This is stolen!" - when in fact it's not.

_shadow_: did you even read my first post? I said that the list would be fixed at some point over the weekend.

Fourchinnigan, RiftMaster: thanks. :)

MisterMarkos
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 04:52 AM Reply

Error - the server is under extreme load at the moment and is unable to deal with your request. Please check back later! Please go back and try again.

I get this error when saying a movie is "extremely pornographic" but I'm online at 11 o'clock in gmt +1 so it can't be the heavy traffic...

archwimil
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 05:04 AM Reply

There are too many good changes!:) Slow down:) JOKE:D

http://gud.us/en/?Archwimil

Mini3D
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 05:20 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 10:45 PM, shade_v2 wrote: This is just massive over kill. The idea of a Blow the Whistle button is insulting and ridiculous. Let me get this straight: You can't trust the users to vote fairly and impartially but you can trust them with a button that will - if clicked enough - rip a submission from the pages of NG? Ok, yeah...?

Look, ya'll made some changes to newgrounds - some people liked them, some didn't, and some, like me, had problems with certain specific aspects of the changes. But now your just solving problems with more problems. Your taking a massively reactive role and casting aside any proactivity.

Part of the beauty of the Blam system is that, if the movie is malicious, stolen, or excessively offensive, we'll take care of it. The people will get rid of it without the involvement of overseers. In fact, I'll bet anything that the initial concept of Newgrounds had a lot to do with developing a website that would be completely self contained requiring almost no supervision by administrators. Now we've got panic buttons, temporary removals, and most importantly - extensive responcibilities of the administrators to not only recieve these "Blown Whistles" but to contact those who claim a rule has been broken, recieve a rebuttal from the author, and possibly play email tag with a number of people.

Now, I'm the one who said that blocking the reviews within the first 100 votes would be harmful to newgrounds, but now we've gone one step beyond harmful. At this point I'm starting to think that y'all just put a lot of time and effort into a lot of coding and, despite it's pitfalls you'll do anything to keep that code alive.

I guess, at this point I have to say: I can get used to the reviews being hidden - I'll deal with that loss - so long as I don't have to deal with the Blam Club or the Clockcrew ganging up on authors they don't like and smacking the shit out of the "Blow the Whistle" button every time they release a movie. Theres far too much fueding and sectorization of users on NG to give people the power to, if even just temporarily, remove a film only on their scouts honor.

Your patching broken pipes together with toilet paper, here.

Ok i'd like to get somethings str8 about the clockcrew for you.

#1 we don't vote high on all of other clock movies, we vote on what it deserves

#2 We don't attack certain "users" or "movies" what's the point of wasting are time hunting down some guy when we're working on flash or busy with are own lives.

#3 Clocks are just like normal users

#4 Clocks help the NGs staff with ideas, most of this is QuaterMelonClock's idea.

Just relax dude. The clock crew just makes movies we don't vote on certain things. Check out the site you might learn more about us www.clockcrew.cc :)

{{{{{{{{{{{{shade_v2}}}}}}}}

nbh-old-movies
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 07:06 AM Reply

This new thing sucks cos we dont see how our movie is doing during the underjudgement process! but the portal looks a shit load better!

JudgeDredd
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 08:01 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 09:29 PM, CokeAddicT wrote: ahhh.. the portal gets better and better.. Blow the whistle?? hmmm.. why not make it so that only the Portal Police can blow the whistle? or is it asking to much? hey, it's just a suggestion...

And a very good suggestion!!! (ihmo)
..but i feel swy for the administrator who have to watch all that krap ;O)_*

"BTW", thanks for getting the terminology right!

ramagi
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 09:02 AM Reply

At 12/5/02 11:12 PM, _shadow_ wrote: Now when you click VIEW ALL on the portal, it does not show any movies under 100 votes. now all of the old movies that have not been blammed or protected surely will be lost forever.

So I guess now blam club's only hope lies on the most recent.

THIS IS THE WORST UPDATE EVER!

NO I think the updates are Valid. And if you paying attention to the target list I am submitting older stuff I coleected before they did all there updates. SO I was a little prepared for this.

I do miss the under judgement in the most recent view. sicne I rarley used the main portal page for accessing new movies.

Jenn
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 09:35 AM Reply

These updates are great. Removing the scores and reviews until 100 votes was the best idea yet. The "whistle" thing is a great idea, but I have a feeling that people are really gonna abuse it. (particularly on the clock stuff becuase so many seem to completely belittle those movies without even watching them) But you gotta try it I guess. You can always tweak it if lots of people are abusing.

fifthsurvivor
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 10:04 AM Reply

Mmmm .... reviews.

shade-v2
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Response to Blow the whistle! Dec. 6th, 2002 @ 10:51 AM Reply

At 12/6/02 04:49 AM, liljim wrote: I don't know what your definition of "overkill" is, but this is less taxing on the system and less harmful to authors - I can imagine it being quite disheartening for them to get reviews like, "This is stolen!" - when in fact it's not.

Fourchinnigan, RiftMaster: thanks. :)

First I want to say that I've been posting fairly harsh criticism's lately. I can see how this could be somewhat insulting to those of you who work to keep newgrounds at top performance. Insulting you was, in fact, my intention, but only so much as I might catch your attentions. Now that I see I've been heard, I'd like to apologize if anything I said might have been too critical. I have great respect for the NG crew.

That being said, let's get started on a whole new line of slanderous insults, shall we? ;)

In my last post I went through all the various details and reasons why this "Whistle Blowing" system will cause more complications and why it's basically a superfluous addition to the site. I was very specific and painted graphic situations that WILL arise in the next 3 months. (Mark my words.)

But all my details and specifics fell shy of conveying the real point. So here it is in black and white:

Newgrounds is ours; The users are the admin's. We own it and we run it. We control the horizontal, we control the vertical - Not Tom, not Wade, not even lilJim.

It is the ultimate democracy and that's why it's so popular. We submit the content, we throw out the shitty submissions, we decide -- with our votes -- who deserves to make the front page and who deserves to fall into obscurity. WE have the power of GreySkull motherfucka's!

And when I saw the reviews disappear on new submissions, I saw a little bit of that democracy die. We lost the ability to communicate with each other, to respond to each others thoughts, to warn each other of a mailicious movie, and we lost the option of telling a fellow user to "Go suck a dick, This movie's the shit," until such time at which the administrative services decide we can once again speak to each other.

Frankly, I was pissed. I thought it unnecessary - I figure that having hidden the current score was enough. And basically, I think that if you weigh the pro's and con's of either leaving reviews visible or hiding them, you come up undenyably on the side that would leave them for all to see.

In any case, I bounced around the portal for a while to get a feel for the new system and, though even now I'd still like to see it gone, I was getting used to it. I was becoming at ease with it...

Then, out of nowhere, comes the perverbial, "PANIC Button." This "Whistle" to be blown in the event of malfeasance....

And suddenly, I looked around and Newgrounds was no longer a straight forward and honest democracy - it was nolonger a land where everyone could have their say and we all collectively made the decisions. Rome had fell, as it always has, to politics.

It is amazing to me, that in three days so much power could be taken out of the hands of the people. Nolonger do we warn each other of a malicious movie, now we just report if to the bacon. Nolonger do WE decide if a movie is excessively pornographic by blamming it, the Illuminati will make that decision for us.

NG is getting dangerously close to becoming a political mock up of so-called American "democracy". This "Blow the Whistle" shit opens up very interesting possibilities for special interest groups. Hell, you might even start to see a Christian Coallition form now that a lesser number of people can choose for the rest of us whether something is overtly racist, pornographic, or otherwise mentally unsanitary. (Don't put it passed those Christians, they'll do anything for media attention!)

Well... You can pick apart my words and list the rebuttals for the details of my argument - trust me, I know them better than anyone.

But all those details and ideas are just a frame; a support structure built around a pre-existing truth that is evident to anyone who opens their eyes. The users - the people who support this site - the proletariat - is being robbed of their influence. The masses are losing their votes because the few have abused our freedom.

hmmm... That sounds familiar... I wonder if Osama is behind all the blamming at Newgrounds too?