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lemon party sig owns xD

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At 9/23/05 01:13 PM, MagicPrincessSCHALA wrote: but I feel that our police forces should be given access to firearms, in order to help tackle the more serious gang-related crime, which is encountered by forces on a daily basis, as well as terror threats and the like.

I agree. I guess that paragraph was the worded the worst.

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At 9/23/05 01:15 PM, Sodium_01 wrote: hey earfetish whered u get it btw?

You've been invited. I'd be rude not to show up...

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At 9/23/05 01:39 PM, Freakish_Beast wrote: lemon party sig owns xD

Lemonparty > lesbians

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Hmm ... I hope you're not lumping people together. Remember that leftists, on average, are more open-minded and can consider alternative ways of thinking :) Trust me, most of them have thought things through.

At 9/22/05 06:29 PM, Earfetish wrote: And anyway, I completely believe that this is all anti-corporation sentiment - 'omgsh let's find more reasons to have a go at big business'.

I don't think it's entirely corporations' fault the earth is warming. It's more the huge amount of people driving around in their cars for every single little thing during their day. Even so, companies can produce loads of trash and pollution more efficiently. I admit, some corporations have began manufacturing their products using more environmentally friendly methods, although this is not actually about taking responsibility for their actions, it's about keeping a better image of the company among customers.

Big business is bad: Without big business, we'd have no iPods, no personal computers, no cars, no booze, no cigarettes, no modern-day buildings with plumbing - nothing.

In our current system, that's true. However, if the left could have had its way all along, we could have achieved just as much as we now have in capitalism, through collective, collabouring economy rather than competitive economy. The state could also work as a provider of various consumer products, just as it can efficiently provide various welfare services.

(The only ones of the products you mentioned that I've ever had use for are computers and the buildings.)

It may well be that big business isn't good for the little man and that they exploit their workers, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're bad - it just means that they have bad points, which could easily be resolved.

To resolve them, we should have a means of making the businesses more ethically aware. We cannot let money decide. Money likes to go where there's already lots of it.

Capitalism has done a lot for you, it just needs to be made fairer.

What type of actions do you have in mind to make it fairer?

Big business has an important place. It gives us a solid economy, too

I disagree. I think we have a very conjuncture-sensitive economic model. For example, whenever there's a major disaster (like the recent hurricanes), it has vast economical effects, and that seems to be all people care about. It wouldn't be this way if our economy was more collective, because we'd could prepare for these events more easily and rebuild using our collective fund, and thus recover quickly. It would help us carry on, through good times and bad.

Religion is open opportunity to argue about

Yes, it is. I don't think majority of leftists think it's "inapproriate to show disrespect by questioning people's faith". I think our laws protect religions too much. (But those muslims should be allowed to keep their veils in French schools!)

as far as being offensive to races goes, surely every group in society should be able to express themselves

Yes, they should. I also think whoever they're expressing their opinons to, should listen carefully what they have to say, and then argue their points in a civilized manner, even if he's being shouted at or insulted. (If you've seen "Louis and The Nazis", you know what I'm talking about.)

24-hour drinking - pubs shouldn't be open at 8AM when kids are walking to school.

I don't like alcohol either. Our government recently passed a legislation which lowered the taxation on alcohol. It has already increased the youth's drinking and is causing huge social problems for the future as we speak.

And yes, giving the police guns is the first step towards a police state, but we can still stop them if they make any more.

It would nicer if they didn't need them, though. But I agree that currently we have no other option. Until we can find efficient ways of lowering the crime rates, police can have guns, in my opinion. But if the situation improves, there's no need for them.

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Bush sucks because, like, the media say so.

(also, he does suck.)

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Yeah, uhm, what Aapo said.

Anyway, on global warming and disasters, these things bring out the little social-darwinist in me who thinks it's for the better since humans, lacking a natural enemy, are now overpopulating, and though it is slowing down, the nature can't bear us much longer.

I suggest collective genoide.

I'm a socialist, but everyone at my party would be really "Oh no you just didn't" about what I said.

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At 9/23/05 02:06 PM, Aapo_Joki wrote: The state could also work as a provider of various consumer products, just as it can efficiently provide various welfare services.

I don't know. It is possible that everyone could work for the state, who would then sell products to other countries and to the people who produced them... but that's still exploitative with the state and Government controlling the entire populace.

To resolve them, we should have a means of making the businesses more ethically aware. We cannot let money decide. Money likes to go where there's already lots of it.

Correct. Business does need to increase minimum wages, increase worker's rights, put an end to sweat-shop labour, give money to charitable causes... but I believe that it should still exist.

What type of actions do you have in mind to make it fairer?

Yeah, increased minimum wages, whatever I said up there. A less capital-orientated Capitalism. Perhaps still with the pursuit of money as a goal, but with a strong moral ethic.

I disagree. I think we have a very conjuncture-sensitive economic model. For example, whenever there's a major disaster (like the recent hurricanes), it has vast economical effects, and that seems to be all people care about.

Yeah. I agree that there should be less focus on getting money, and money should be less important, and occasionally people should concern themselves with the greater good.

When it comes down to it, I'm a leftist too. A Socialist, no less.

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At 9/23/05 02:20 PM, Earfetish wrote:

At 9/23/05 02:06 PM, Aapo_Joki wrote: The state could also work as a provider of various consumer products, just as it can efficiently provide various welfare services.

I don't know. It is possible that everyone could work for the state, who would then sell products to other countries and to the people who produced them... but that's still exploitative with the state and Government controlling the entire populace.

A fun passtime of mine are whatifs. What f all inventing had been dictated by common good instead of private profit? The world would be different, that's for sure, but how?

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At 9/23/05 02:24 PM, JohnnyWang wrote: A fun passtime of mine are whatifs. What f all inventing had been dictated by common good instead of private profit? The world would be different, that's for sure, but how?

Surely it was the pursuit of private profit that pushed our respective countries through the Industrial Revolution, and the world would be incredibly less advanced if it wasn't for that.

The people working on cures for AIDS and cancer are doing it for money, really. There's no doubt in my mind that the thoughts of them being fantastically rich keeps them going in the labs.

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I demand that this thread gets locked because it implies bigotry and prejudice against left handed people.

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At 9/23/05 02:40 PM, NGWOAnarchyPenguin wrote: I demand that this thread gets locked because it implies bigotry and prejudice against left handed people.

Ahah. I noticed that quite soon after I made it, but you're the first person to pick up on it.

They're messed up too. We should go back to the older teaching and writing methods, when we'd cane people and force them to write with their right hand. People shouldn't be different.