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At 8/18/05 06:46 AM, Five3 wrote:

You're Right Martyr18, I Was Brought Up As A Catholic & Not Hindu, But A Year Ago I Dropped That Title & Now Consider Myself A Christian. As I Found Out The Additional Things Catholism Adds To The Bible. I Consider My Beliefs Valid Over Hinduism ...

Okay I picked hindusim at random, and I agree the things they believe are not very logical, but when confronted with their religion not being logical they use the concept of faith just as the christians do; therefore both are equally valid ideas....

:Because Many Events In The Bible Are Historically Documented Just Like In Today's History Books: Rome's Rule Over The Jews, The Stories Of Passed Day Egypt, The Fall Of Babylon, Present & Passed Day Prophecy That Has & Continues To Be Fulfilled. If You Study The Bible & History Itself You Would Take Note To These Things. And If You Choose To Dismiss Them As Pure Coincidence, Then That Is Your Choose.

I agree.. there are many historical accuricies that we know for fact happend, but none of the more "miraculous" things the bible mentions has been proven... and in factt old egyption mythologies had many accuracies, but no one believes those today... Just because of historical accuracies dosent mean it is truth... I mean the people who wrote these scriptures were alive when these things were going on... Look at another case... Alexander the great, thought he was the son of God, was believed to be the son of god by many, declared a God by Egyptions, he did many things some would consider "miraculous"..... Dosen't that kind of remind you of someone?

:Also You Mentioned You Never Looked Into Hinduism, So If You Are Really Curious I'd Tell You To Check It Out. They Believe In 300,000+ gods. They Believe That Things In This World Are In Fact gods, i.e. River Spirits, Animals, Idols, Statues, etc. I've Never Prayed To A River Before, Nor An Animal, Or A Statue, But If I Did I'm Not Sure They'd Ever Respond.

Lol well a good argument to that would be that God as never responded to me.. and when I have spoke to him I think i was talking to myself...

:I Do Know & Those That Know Me As Well Have Seen My Life Change After I Started A Realtionship With Christ At 17. You Don't Have To Take My Word For It, As I Have Nothing To Gain By Sharing It With You, But I Know I Prayed To Him & That's When Things Started Changing. Anyway, If You Want To Know More Fact Or Even Just My Opinion Feel Free To Hit Me Up. Grace N Peace.

Well your one of the nicier ones on these forums.. You don't present your oppinions and evidences like your the messiah yourself.. Like many do on these forums....

i have a few things to say to this.
no god (if he or any similar thing exists) isnt evil, he created us and he hasnt done anything for a some hundred years.
then there was a question about where big bang came from.
i cant tell that, but i can reuse the thing against the god is real thing.
where did god came from?
or rather, where did the first thing of everything come from?
i mean, nothing existed.
so if god does exist, has he been around for ever?
and the justice thing, god making crime things to get people to hell/heaven and such, well, if thats the case, then why doesnt he find out if mankind likes his "justice"?

About "who created God if there was nothing". I have thought about this long and hard, and I have come to understand how this is possible. Remember, before God there was nothing, including the laws of physics. There is no basic law or logic of the universe in the time before God, so ANYTHING can happen, no matter how little it makes sense. So in this time of nothing, including basic physical rules of the world, it would be possible for God to create himself out of nowhere.

Prove existance of God then will settle matter of his evil or not lol

but everyone has rite to there beliefs

Why not forget about whether a god exists or not and just be a good person. There's no reason you need an all powerfull, omniscient diety to govern what you feel is right and wrong. C'mon people stop squirmishing over its existance and look for the deeper meaning...

At 8/19/05 04:48 AM, SoldAsFreedom wrote: Why not forget about whether a god exists or not and just be a good person. There's no reason you need an all powerfull, omniscient diety to govern what you feel is right and wrong. C'mon people stop squirmishing over its existance and look for the deeper meaning...

Does life really have to have some great meaning... I say there really is no meaning; so we as humans define our own meanings....

At 8/18/05 11:46 AM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 8/18/05 06:46 AM, Five3 wrote:

Also You Mentioned You Never Looked Into Hinduism, So If You Are Really Curious I'd Tell You To Check It Out. They Believe In 300,000+ gods. They Believe That Things In This World Are In Fact gods, i.e. River Spirits, Animals, Idols, Statues, etc. I've Never Prayed To A River Before, Nor An Animal, Or A Statue, But If I Did I'm Not Sure They'd Ever Respond.

Lol well a good argument to that would be that God as never responded to me.. and when I have spoke to him I think i was talking to myself...

Patience Is Key. Also If You Pray You Can't Be Demanding Things From God, He Responds In His Time & His Will. If He Cured Everyone From Disease & Gave Everyone Riches Then What More Would We Have To Gain. And If Those Aren't The Things Your Asking For I Appalogize, That Just Seems The Norm When I Talk To People About Prayer. Anywho, I Feel Your Opinions Bro & As I Don't Have Time To Share My Life Story & The Fact That No One Would Want To Hear It Haha, I Say Again, When You're Feeling Your Loweset Or Even Your Happiest Or Whatever, Shoot One Up To Him Again & Wait On It. If You're Not Feeling It Then Leave It, Just Don't Look Over The Simple Blessings In Life. Grace N Peace To All.

At 8/19/05 05:03 PM, Five3 wrote:

Patience Is Key. Also If You Pray You Can't Be Demanding Things From God, He Responds In His Time & His Will. If He Cured Everyone From Disease & Gave Everyone Riches Then What More Would We Have To Gain. And If Those Aren't The Things Your Asking For I Appalogize, That Just Seems The Norm When I Talk To People About Prayer. Anywho, I Feel Your Opinions Bro & As I Don't Have Time To Share My Life Story & The Fact That No One Would Want To Hear It Haha, I Say Again, When You're Feeling Your Loweset Or Even Your Happiest Or Whatever, Shoot One Up To Him Again & Wait On It. If You're Not Feeling It Then Leave It, Just Don't Look Over The Simple Blessings In Life. Grace N Peace To All.

Well your very kind about your oppinion and Ill commend you for that.... But again I say have you ever taken the time to talk to one of those hindu Gods? Im sure you havnt, but if you did, and you had enough patience Im sure it would give you the same rewards as christianity.... What Im really trying to say is its not your religion that gives you these feelings, it is the fact that you have a religion... Ive never questioned faith's ability to make people feel good, Ive only questioned its ability to find the truth...Me I try to find the positive sides to the things I know are real and this makes me feel good.. Its mostly about how you precieve the world...

I Feel You Man. I've Dabbled In Drugs Before & For Some People Drugs Are 'Their god.' Glad To Hear Some Positive Kats Out There. No I Haven't Prayed To Other gods & Never Will, I've Found My Joy In Jesus As Others Have Found It In Their Beliefs... But I Know What You're Saying, I Just Try To Share With People What Has Brought The Joy I Have Today. Stay Up Dude, Peace.

At 8/19/05 07:04 PM, Five3 wrote: I Feel You Man. I've Dabbled In Drugs Before & For Some People Drugs Are 'Their god.' Glad To Hear Some Positive Kats Out There. No I Haven't Prayed To Other gods & Never Will, I've Found My Joy In Jesus As Others Have Found It In Their Beliefs... But I Know What You're Saying, I Just Try To Share With People What Has Brought The Joy I Have Today. Stay Up Dude, Peace.

Well keeps you happy, gives you a good set of morals.. Good for you man... As long as you dont push those morals unto others, but Im getting into a new subject there...

At 8/4/05 01:35 PM, thecrimsonsidewalk wrote: GOD,ALLAH,JAWHE... sometimes help people , sometimes not, depends on it
if GOD doesnt help , like you say , it will happen in the afterlife.
GOD does help alot, you just dont now it , like your computer ,you got luckie you cant affrod one,in africa poor childeren cant afford one, but they still get helped ,by people who believe in god they will be alright in the afterlife.
GOD .... evil ? think aigan

i myself think religions are scams and propoganda yes some will h8 me for this comment but there ever sinse the begining theres been religious wars, sects and
extremistes all religious and i lok back i say wtf!!!

in the middle ages relegion was an incredeble power/bully taking peoples money and time if u didnt pa u were exiled or imprisonned the church could even shut up the emperor the preists always saying repent repent or go to hell the stench of the fear of hell was umberable

even now the churchcould probably send us in to a new crusade o by finishing my point i dont think god is good or evil if he creats monsters he is a monster sothere we go
peace out

I understand you are mad but god gave us a choice and we chose evil

At 8/19/05 11:02 PM, crossfire_X wrote: I understand you are mad but god gave us a choice and we chose evil

Yes, but christians believe that God creates every individual.. and before he creates them knowing full well what there life choices will be... Because he is all knowing.. Therefore when he creates them he knowingly creates an evil being, that he will someday condemn to eternal torment...It would be like me creating an atom Bomb I knew was gonna blow everyone up and then wondering why they were so pissed off about it....

I don't believe God is evil. However, I don't believe Him to be as perfect as people say. I don't think that he knows all thing that we put. In the Bible it does say that God made a mistake. When the Israelites were sinning when Moses was in the mountain. He later smited them with lightning bolts of fury. Moses had to remind God that He said that He would protect the Israelites and not hurt them. Also, if He was all powerful... Lucifer would of never been a problem. He would of said, "Good bye sucka" and Lucifer would of been gone. I believe we have added alot of bullshit to God's image.

how could god create himself from nowhere?
well i guess your right!
gj u made my brain explodes!

At 8/20/05 02:54 AM, drah wrote: how could god create himself from nowhere?
well i guess your right!
gj u made my brain explodes!

Scroll up and read the last post I made.

i did, thats what made my head blow up.
wait.
i still have my head.
nvm thats what caused my headache.
btw u got something against that?

I'm pretty open about different opinions but I think God gave us free will. It is our own choosing that we allow ourselves the humans to fall apart. We are corrupted. Let's say there is no God who are you now to blame about the problems of the world?

At 8/19/05 10:52 PM, gimpylegz wrote: i myself think religions are scams and propoganda

The Protestant Christian beleifs alone were all formed when Henry VIII needed some cash so decided he wanted to strip the churches of riches. I am sure that all these religions have some reason for being created as they cannot just be out of the blue, with someone being given a bible/holy book and being told "make them beleive in me!" Surely they must have something that made them begin...

At 8/20/05 04:31 AM, AnzRage wrote: I'm pretty open about different opinions but I think God gave us free will. It is our own choosing that we allow ourselves the humans to fall apart. We are corrupted. Let's say there is no God who are you now to blame about the problems of the world?

That last part is a decent point.. But if you believe that God is all knowing and you believe he creates every individual, then you believe that he knowingklly creates ppl he knows will turn from him and commit sin.. therefore everything they do it was his intention for them to do or he would not have created them... Its like I said.. If I createan atom bomb thsat has the power to kill everyone in the world, and know for a fact thats what its gonna be used for, then it is my fault civilization was destroyed not the bomb's... Lol and to add to that little anaology it was god's fault for creating me knowing I would do it...

At 8/13/05 08:42 PM, Dacheater wrote: God isn't evil. If God was evil, we would be in pain every second of every in every day. He would see no reason to create "useless" thing like love, friendship, etc , he would not bother wasting his time with a race who constally squabbles with itself, nor would he waste time giving them a good how to live guide, or dieing for us.
If God was evil, people who try their hardest to follow him, and emulate Jesus, would be evil as well. I mean look at Mother Tresha. She was a devoted follower of God, and what does she go around doing? And Pope John Paul? Wouldn't Pope John Paul have supported the war on Iraq if he was following an evil God? Wouldn't christans as a whole approve of sucide bombmers as opposed to a bunch of idiots mostly made up of angsty teens and bastards exploting said angsty teens, who thought they may know the Korean off by heart have absoulty no understanding of the nature of a god that existed (I mean honestly, why would Allah make a bunch of "infidels" just for them to die? What about those who kill fellow worshippers? Evil or not, anyone capable of creating the universe can't be stupid). You can't blame members of a relgion for those who manipulate gulliable people into doing evil things.
Their needs to be some evil in the world or free will is meaningless. What is the point of choice when all outcomes result solely in good, when their is no consquence to any given action? Satan was created as an oppostion force for man kind.
And really, the world seems like too much trouble for an evil God to go to all this trouble to make. And where hardly a perfect lifeform by anyones strecth, wouldn't an evil God just throw us away and make something "better"?

I notice no one has any counter to this. Does this mean I'm right?
As for the Lucifer thing, yeah some arrogant moron who thought he could beat someone all powerful and spens his days rotting in a fiery place being a sadistic loser really must have had the right idea. Go meet some Satanists. I've only met a few, an I've noticed their all a little unhinged (like some guy who came to a christan board, tried to flood, and when i dealt with him in the way I deal with all trolls, came after me, virused me, and he screwed up and took use both down (from which I was easily able to recvoer from, but he has NEVER been able to). Yeah Satan really must know what hes doing when his followers are so clued up!!!!!

At 8/20/05 10:12 PM, Dacheater wrote:

I notice no one has any counter to this. Does this mean I'm right?
As for the Lucifer thing, yeah some arrogant moron who thought he could beat someone all powerful and spens his days rotting in a fiery place being a sadistic loser really must have had the right idea. Go meet some Satanists. I've only met a few, an I've noticed their all a little unhinged (like some guy who came to a christan board, tried to flood, and when i dealt with him in the way I deal with all trolls, came after me, virused me, and he screwed up and took use both down (from which I was easily able to recvoer from, but he has NEVER been able to). Yeah Satan really must know what hes doing when his followers are so clued up!!!!!

I think the satansts are hoping to be the devils angels or something because the bible says that satan and his angels rule in Hell.... I dunno could be entirely wrong about that.. Satanism is a very odd "religion"...

yup, satanism sure is weird.

Stanism is full of shitheads that have seen The Omen too many times.

At 8/21/05 02:58 AM, Redbob86 wrote: Stanism is full of shitheads that have seen The Omen too many times.

stanism?
anyway i think your right.

Christians are scared, they are scared of the truth, that there would not be life after death or something, so they try to escape from it, by inventing some fantasies.

Oh, and back to the topic. It would be too easy if god would stop wars and all. I agree that everyone, everything should be responsable for their doings.

Bah, humans lived in paradise without war, violence or anything like that, but then god a
dispossed us, because we didn't obey him. Why we should be feared of god, isn't god an understanding being whom nobody should be scared? Why we should be slaves of god, whom we should obey, why we shouldn't be free beings, whose have the will tho do what they want?

He doesn't exist.

END!

At 8/21/05 07:02 AM, AmebaMan wrote: Bah, humans lived in paradise without war, violence or anything like that, but then god a
dispossed us, because we didn't obey him. Why we should be feared of god, isn't god an understanding being whom nobody should be scared? Why we should be slaves of god, whom we should obey, why we shouldn't be free beings, whose have the will tho do what they want?

This world is but a passing journey and simply a test. We'll be here for 100 or so years, big whoop, paradise is eternal. We are not to be slaves, if he wanted us to be slaves he wouldn't have given us free will. God knew humans would mess up at the start, do you really think someone who is all knowing would not plan everything out?

Heres a funny little joke, at least in my opinion.

A boy asked from his mother:
"Mom, is god almighty?"
Mother answered: "Yes, my child."
Boy asked another question:
"Can He then create a weight so heavy he can't lift it?"

At 8/21/05 02:58 AM, Redbob86 wrote: Stanism is full of shitheads that have seen The Omen too many times.

God damn those evil Stanists! Why can't they accept the love of Gord?