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At 9/20/05 08:17 AM, drah wrote:

i heard of that.
wasnt there a guy who survived something cus he was all like "god's gonna save me (/my sorry ass)

Dude ever hear metallica's osngg "the God that failed"??? Its about that.. James HEtfield's mom got really sick and she refused medical attention because she said her faith alone could save her..... So yea her God failed her....

At 9/20/05 07:47 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/20/05 08:17 AM, drah wrote:

i heard of that.
wasnt there a guy who survived something cus he was all like "god's gonna save me (/my sorry ass)

Dude ever hear metallica's osngg "the God that failed"??? Its about that.. James HEtfield's mom got really sick and she refused medical attention because she said her faith alone could save her..... So yea her God failed her....

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

At 9/20/05 09:35 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

At 9/20/05 07:47 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/20/05 08:17 AM, drah wrote:

i heard of that.
wasnt there a guy who survived something cus he was all like "god's gonna save me (/my sorry ass)

Dude ever hear metallica's osngg "the God that failed"??? Its about that.. James HEtfield's mom got really sick and she refused medical attention because she said her faith alone could save her..... So yea her God failed her....

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

Oh yea.. because its not like everytimre christians get togther they dont sing about their belifs.. BEEN to church lately ass!? They all do that!!!!!!

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

Oh yea.. because its not like everytimre christians get togther they dont sing about their belifs.. BEEN to church lately ass!? They all do that!!!!!!

So "Enter Sandman" is one of your deepest beliefs?

At 9/20/05 09:49 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

Oh yea.. because its not like everytimre christians get togther they dont sing about their belifs.. BEEN to church lately ass!? They all do that!!!!!!

So "Enter Sandman" is one of your deepest beliefs?

The song is question was "The God that failed", and I didnt say it stemed one of my belifs.. I said it ws a real woman, who instead of using logic and going to doctors to get help, she depended on faith and died for it... she said God would save her life, and so he god failed her.. the message isnt in the song its in that real event..... I dont base my belif system off music, but If I find music I already relate to I like it... I base my belifs in evidence.. Not something that was recorded by other ppl and that cant be verified....

At 9/20/05 10:01 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/20/05 09:49 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

hey, im an atheist, and i dont really listen to a lot of music, perhaps a little here and there, most of it is what i hear in class......
so i dont pay attention to music JUST cus im an atheist.

Oh yea.. because its not like everytimre christians get togther they dont sing about their belifs

well, christians do sing about their beliefs other places, and sometimes they get together without the singing, it happens at my town.

.. BEEN to church lately ass!?

no, not really, atheist. :-)

They all do that!!!!!!

not really, no.

So "Enter Sandman" is one of your deepest beliefs?

enter whatman?

At 9/20/05 09:35 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

At 9/20/05 07:47 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/20/05 08:17 AM, drah wrote:

i heard of that.
wasnt there a guy who survived something cus he was all like "god's gonna save me (/my sorry ass)

Dude ever hear metallica's osngg "the God that failed"??? Its about that.. James HEtfield's mom got really sick and she refused medical attention because she said her faith alone could save her..... So yea her God failed her....

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to their stupid music.

I think you missed the point about the mother feeling that God would heal her. You're making a general rationalization again based on no fact. People of all faiths/beliefs can listen to, get meaning from, and enjoy music. People don't think "I'm and atheist" all the time when searching for a good tune. I'm not an atheist, and I love to listen to music. It's something people can be passonate about.

At 9/21/05 11:08 AM, ScaryDeadGirl wrote:

At 9/20/05 09:35 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

At 9/20/05 07:47 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/20/05 08:17 AM, drah wrote:

i heard of that.
wasnt there a guy who survived something cus he was all like "god's gonna save me (/my sorry ass)

Dude ever hear metallica's osngg "the God that failed"??? Its about that.. James HEtfield's mom got really sick and she refused medical attention because she said her faith alone could save her..... So yea her God failed her....

Further proving my point that ahteists pay WAY too much attention to theirmusic.

I think you missed the point about the mother feeling that God would heal her.

i did?

You're making a general rationalization again based on no fact.

fact?

People of all faiths/beliefs can listen to, get meaning from, and enjoy music.

or hate it, but thats not your point.

People don't think "I'm and atheist" all the time when searching for a good tune.

true, thats not the regular persons way.

I'm not an atheist, and I love to listen to music.

me too, if its good, i mean, sometimes i could throw a chair at my classmates for playing shit throughout the breaks.

It's something people can be passonate about.

you mean passionate, right?

God created man in his image
|
man is said in the bible to be born under sin
|
Therefore God must have some capacity for sin or
a: That its a load of bull shit
b: That some alien was on crack
c: God really doesn't care/ Gods really a stoner < Lookit the platypus!>

At 9/22/05 08:08 AM, Ugasen wrote: God created man in his image

according to THE BIBLE!
dont ask me if Allah did the same, i dunno, read the book!
(Allah means god, GASP)

|
man is said in the bible to be born under sin
|

he/she was?
sorry, i never READ the entire thing

Therefore God must have some capacity for sin

yuppers.

a: That its a load of bull shit

ill give it 66 and a third percentage of truth

b: That some alien was on crack

aliens know crack?

c: God really doesn't care

he seemingly doesnt.

Gods really a stoner

undoubtably.

< Lookit the platypus!>

platypus(sy)?

15 pages of pathetically twisted logic in order to somehow justify a lost cause. If you think hard enough, you can twist ANYTHING in order to make your side look good. Enough with the pitiful minor contradictions, it's old.

"Der well this says this, and this says this, therefore der der der." No, there is no "therefore", you're twisitng words to support your belief in nothing.

At 9/22/05 11:50 PM, Redbob86 wrote: 15 pages of pathetically twisted logic in order to somehow justify a lost cause. If you think hard enough, you can twist ANYTHING in order to make your side look good. Enough with the pitiful minor contradictions, it's old.

"Der well this says this, and this says this, therefore der der der." No, there is no "therefore", you're twisitng words to support your belief in nothing.

What would have been helpful, is perhaps some examples of what you feel was twisted logic, and then in turn your evidence/beliefs as to why those particular posts were so false. Because as of now the same argument can be turned on you to say you're just twisting words to support your belief in something.

well, me being a christian, I do believe that man is given free will and that God is not evil. okay. The thing is, if you actual read the Bible (not necessarely all the books, chapters, verses) there is a limitation as to what you can do and/or gives situations as to show what is okay to do. For example, in the Bible there is a chapter where it talks about how married couples should not divorce (if there is anyone christian please help me by finding this verse, it's somewhere in the new test. I believe) but it also says that if they can not change their spouses beliefs in God, they can divorce from them. Also, if they are being abused by their spouse, they can also divorce. Or (a perfect example who believe that christians should keep to themselves), there is another few lines where it says that christians should pray in their house. HOWEVER!!!, it says prior to that verse, that christians should also talk and praise about Jesus/God
So while I am not intentionally pressing my religion on anyone, Christianity is not a brainwash (b/c there's proof that there was a Jesus that was crucified).

At 9/22/05 11:50 PM, Redbob86 wrote: 15 pages of pathetically twisted logic in order to somehow justify a lost cause. If you think hard enough, you can twist ANYTHING in order to make your side look good. Enough with the pitiful minor contradictions, it's old.

"Der well this says this, and this says this, therefore der der der." No, there is no "therefore", you're twisitng words to support your belief in nothing.

Yea I would like to see you give some evidence of this "twisted logic". But wait a minute! You dont give a shit about evidence.. you follow Faith, which basically says Stick your head up your ass and then wondr why other people arent. You say twisted logic, I say well at least tis some form of logic.. you give nothing, you have nothing, your belifs are based in assumptions, and you trying to prove what you say is true, by twisting evidence to a point where it supports what your saying. Here you want me to prove God is evil I can! I can prove it Right now!

In christian Theology God is incapable of a mistake. To purposely bread evil is in itself evil. If you create something, and you know its prpose then that was part of your intention for creating it. God creates people that he knows are going to hell. If he cant make a mistake, then one of the purposes of creating these people was for them to go to hell and suffer eternally. Now if you want to call this twisted logic be my guest, but Ill just thinkl your an ass. If you want to use logical evidence to prove what I am saying is wrong, then I might listen to you, and I might even start to consider you a rational human being.

Damn where is the all knowing nitor when we need him?

Still, regardless, I don't think you should be bashing christianity, or let alone any religion. Now obviously there are some idiots that say that they're doing things because God/Allah/Budda/etc. "told them so" or that they actually believe that that is bibically correct to act/say things(various criminals, Pat Robertson, radical muslims, etc.) but I think that those people either take their scripts too literally. And while it is true that God made Adam and Eve, currently He does not make humans, we do. Think about it, if everyone stopped havings sex, I could definitly believe that 50+ years from now there will not be a human race. ...
Look, if you are going to bash another religion, not even just christianity, at least read their scripts with an open mind. At least try come with a logical, unopinionated, unbias reason as to why people believe in that religion. Me, as a christian who at least tries to look at other religions, not to bash them, but as to try to figure out their "logic".

At 9/24/05 12:08 AM, Kahl612 wrote: Still, regardless, I don't think you should be bashing christianity, or let alone any religion. Now obviously there are some idiots that say that they're doing things because God/Allah/Budda/etc. "told them so" or that they actually believe that that is bibically correct to act/say things(various criminals, Pat Robertson, radical muslims, etc.) but I think that those people either take their scripts too literally. And while it is true that God made Adam and Eve, currently He does not make humans, we do. Think about it, if everyone stopped havings sex, I could definitly believe that 50+ years from now there will not be a human race. ...
Look, if you are going to bash another religion, not even just christianity, at least read their scripts with an open mind. At least try come with a logical, unopinionated, unbias reason as to why people believe in that religion. Me, as a christian who at least tries to look at other religions, not to bash them, but as to try to figure out their "logic".

You make some good points, but if Adam and Eve existed, God knew of every child that would spring ffrom their union, and everyone of thos children's children, and so on. He also knew all of their actions in advancee. So if it it is impossible for God to make a mistake, then Sin was in his original plans, and so was everyone he is going to burn in hell for eternity. Lets take a look at sucidists, people who want to end their suffering... Long ago God knew these ppl would be born he creates them into this world filled with suffering, and then when they decide to end their suffering, he makes them suffr even more..... My only reply to that is... Wow what an ass.

As for bashing other religions, this toopic is ment top be used to show evidence that the chrisstian God is evil, if people want to refute evidence shown with evidence of their own that is fine.. But so far it seems that all their oing is coming in here and saying "Your wrong, but I cant explain why, because my belif that your wrong is based on no credible evidence." If they just come here to say that then they are contributing nothing.

PS. In my last post I ment the al knowing Nitro*

Thats true: He is a sadistic bastard. Likes to play with lesser beings and i quess world is just a giant-sims game for him.
Well.... This would only be true if he existed but The God is just a fictional character.

Also there are about 5 posts about God/Christianity in a day so whats the point?

just wondering though, how many of those forums, when being written about religion and/or God, are they actually being critical about. Or if you don't think that this thread is critical (not saying that it is), like saying "SuchandSuchreligion/SuchandSuchreligion's god is evil, crap, not real, etc." I mean, while I do know that there are pagans, atheists, buddists, satanists, etc. couldn't we all just agree as to not talk about religion, considering how many other people get pissed off about it?

It should be a scholarly presentation of evidence.. not a battle of name calling..

At 8/4/05 11:33 AM, billytheradponi wrote:

Man is evil, he is greedy, savage and never thinks before he acts, the Bible also states that man is an image through God (or something like that) so God is evil too.

God made earth so we can live, but after realizing that we aren't going to listen to what he says, he'll just leave us to it. Why should he do anything if we aren't going to listen?

And another thing: If god is evil why are we here?

P.S.Fuck off.

At 9/27/05 03:18 PM, ChurroNG wrote:

At 8/4/05 11:33 AM, billytheradponi wrote:

Man is evil, he is greedy, savage and never thinks before he acts, the Bible also states that man is an image through God (or something like that) so God is evil too.

God made earth so we can live, but after realizing that we aren't going to listen to what he says, he'll just leave us to it. Why should he do anything if we aren't going to listen?

And another thing: If god is evil why are we here?

P.S.Fuck off.

If God isnt evil, and he is al knowing, why does he create peeople he knows are gonna die and go to hell? Hmmmmm? it even says they would have been better off if he hadnt created them... so ultimately that means they owe him nothing.

At 9/27/05 04:08 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/27/05 03:18 PM, ChurroNG wrote:

At 8/4/05 11:33 AM, billytheradponi wrote:

Man is evil, he is greedy, savage and never thinks before he acts, the Bible also states that man is an image through God (or something like that) so God is evil too.

God made earth so we can live, but after realizing that we aren't going to listen to what he says, he'll just leave us to it. Why should he do anything if we aren't going to listen?

And another thing: If god is evil why are we here?

P.S.Fuck off.

If God isnt evil, and he is al knowing, why does he create peeople he knows are gonna die and go to hell? Hmmmmm? it even says they would have been better off if he hadnt created them... so ultimately that means they owe him nothing.

If God was evil, you'd be burning right now.

The people that go to hell bring it on themselves. You were all told what the rules were, you knew what they were, and yet for reasons only of your own you decided to say "fuck it" and break them anyway. Consequences, pal. It's your fault if you choose to kill somebody.

Evil=Sin God hates sin God wont let sin in his presence thats why satan is in hell we are in the holy spirits presence so God obviusly loves us enough that he will personly wash us of sin

so god loves us a great deal and when you say that the lawyers gave you money not God because of the foot thing your half right the lawyers were lead to give you that money by the good in this world (God) but kicking your foot was something you did God didnt lead you to do that

At 9/27/05 07:00 PM, Redbob86 wrote:

If God was evil, you'd be burning right now.

The people that go to hell bring it on themselves. You were all told what the rules were, you knew what they were, and yet for reasons only of your own you decided to say "fuck it" and break them anyway. Consequences, pal. It's your fault if you choose to kill somebody.

Its also my fault if I create something that I know is gonna kill somebody kills somebody... Say I build an intelligent Robot, and it goes and kills you, and I knew it was gonna, then it was the same as me pulling a gun trigger and killing you myslf; therefore, when God creates someone, which he knows is gonna sin, even if he tells em not to, he knows there gonna do it anyway, it is the same as him sinning, if you see any flaw in my logic please inform me... Also you didnt really respond to what I was saying.. I was saying he created people even though he knew they would suffer in life, turn from him, and inevitably face eternal damnation... and that is most certaainly wicked, when they would have been bvbetter off had he not created them, and he knew that.. so they owe him nothing, because all he gave tthem wwas eternal damnation.... YOu may yap about how he gave them the gift of freewwill, but even in the bible it says those who go to hell would have been better off not being born... so that gift, free will, was ultiamtely in no way worth it, and since hell will be eternal, the value of freewill will only diminish into nothing........

At 9/27/05 10:02 PM, klik_klik wrote: Evil=Sin God hates sin God wont let sin in his presence thats why satan is in hell we are in the holy spirits presence so God obviusly loves us enough that he will personly wash us of sin

so god loves us a great deal and when you say that the lawyers gave you money not God because of the foot thing your half right the lawyers were lead to give you that money by the good in this world (God) but kicking your foot was something you did God didnt lead you to do that

Wait so in your belif God s an anthropomoorphic representation of good? Or are you a person who acredits all bad things men do in life to theeir own freewill, and all the good things they do to God, because honestly that makes no sense.....

At 9/27/05 10:21 PM, TheMartyr18 wrote:

At 9/27/05 10:02 PM, klik_klik wrote: Evil=Sin God hates sin God wont let sin in his presence thats why satan is in hell we are in the holy spirits presence so God obviusly loves us enough that he will personly wash us of sin

so god loves us a great deal and when you say that the lawyers gave you money not God because of the foot thing your half right the lawyers were lead to give you that money by the good in this world (God) but kicking your foot was something you did God didnt lead you to do that

Wait so in your belif God s an anthropomoorphic representation of good? Or are you a person who acredits all bad things men do in life to theeir own freewill, and all the good things they do to God, because honestly that makes no sense.....

no i acredit all bad things to sin and for good things i am not saying that, i am saying that there are sinful and unsinful things if there was no sin life would like in the garden of eden and if there was no good it would be hell so the lawyers gave the money but if God didnt exist then there would be no good in the world and no one would dream of "giving freely of themselves" he is not good its self but he made it like if you made designer pants you made them(God made good) so with out you they would not exist and you always wear them to promote sales(God is always good) but you arent pants you just wear them(God is good but not good its self)

At 9/28/05 12:43 AM, klik_klik wrote:

no i acredit all bad things to sin and for good things i am not saying that, i am saying that there are sinful and unsinful things if there was no sin life would like in the garden of eden and if there was no good it would be hell so the lawyers gave the money but if God didnt exist then there would be no good in the world and no one would dream of "giving freely of themselves" he is not good its self but he made it like if you made designer pants you made them(God made good) so with out you they would not exist and you always wear them to promote sales(God is always good) but you arent pants you just wear them(God is good but not good its self)

Yes, but where does sin come from? and if you say man, or Lucifer where did they come from? and who gave them the capacity to sin? Plus I dont blieve God and often do good, selfless things, just for the sake of being a good persomn, I try to be someone I would like to know. There were good people before the coming of Judaism and Christianity.... Plus if you really think about it, even being a good person is being selfish... BEcause if your a christian and you do good your doing it because you want to get into heaven, and if your someone else and you do good, you doing it because it makes you feel good to do good, or some other personal reason.... I do Good because it makes me feel good.... Since I believe all we have is here on earth I want to accomplish as much as I can here, and I want to live a virtuous life, but I want to do it for my own reasons.... I didnt need god to do the good things I do in my life....

Yes, but where does sin come from? and if you say man, or Lucifer where did they come from? and who gave them the capacity to sin? Plus I dont blieve God and often do good, selfless things, just for the sake of being a good persomn, I try to be someone I would like to know. There were good people before the coming of Judaism and Christianity.... Plus if you really think about it, even being a good person is being selfish... BEcause if your a christian and you do good your doing it because you want to get into heaven, and if your someone else and you do good, you doing it because it makes you feel good to do good, or some other personal reason.... I do Good because it makes me feel good.... Since I believe all we have is here on earth I want to accomplish as much as I can here, and I want to live a virtuous life, but I want to do it for my own reasons.... I didnt need god to do the good things I do in my life....

I say that at the beginning sin came from man satan just helped out we gave ourselves capacity to sin when we ate from the tree we have free will and Adam and Eve used their free will to screw things up for the rest of us and while some of us only do good things to get into heaven (They probly arent Christans but im not trying to judge people) the majority of us do because God says so I hate to use analogys but it might be like describing to your little brother what it feels like to ride a bike but he cant now for sure until he does no matter how good you explain it and I can try toexplain it but it would just sound weird its like a feeling that you just want to do what God says and that you dont need God to do good things is partialy right God didnt force you to do anything but if God didnt make good it wouldnt exist i.e. you couldnt ride you car to the store if noone invented cars but the person who invented cars dosent make you drive

Don't bother talking to the atheists. They need to think about every possible contradiction so they can sleep at night thinking the Earth is flat and that there are no consequeces for their actions. I was reasonable a couple of pages back, but the children of this thread seem to have an almost unrelenting lack of tolerance, patience, and acceptance for someone else's beliefs. This thread is ALWAYS bumped back to the top by some 13-15 year-old who needs to complain as much about religion as possible. It's amazing, not only do they seem to not like religion, but they appear to be almost psychologically repulsed by the concept. So now I do not feel the need to be patient with them, because they certainly haven't shown any patience with everyone else here.

Well, there's no point in teaching someone who cannnot grasp the concept of something that isn't staring them in the face. So let them hate religion, hate is what they are good at. Just let them bask in their smug biggoted since of superioty as they sit with their thumbs up their ass thinking about how they've got it all figured out.

At 9/29/05 04:54 AM, Redbob86 wrote: Don't bother talking to the atheists. They need to think about every possible contradiction so they can sleep at night thinking the Earth is flat and that there are no consequeces for their actions.

Well that's not true actually. Atheists believe in science and science proves things like how the earth is round. Also there are always consequences to every action, one does not need to believe in a God to know such things.

I was reasonable a couple of pages back, but the children of this thread seem to have an almost unrelenting lack of tolerance, patience, and acceptance for someone else's beliefs.

You're showing your intolerance as well I'm afraid. Remember when you have enough evidence backing up your side of a debate there's really no reason to get mad, and if you're chosing to have faith in certain things you can't expect everyone else to share the same view.

This thread is ALWAYS bumped back to the top by some 13-15 year-old who needs to complain as much about religion as possible. It's amazing, not only do they seem to not like religion, but they appear to be almost psychologically repulsed by the concept. So now I do not feel the need to be patient with them, because they certainly haven't shown any patience with everyone else here.

Well really you should choose to lead by example then instead of letting those immature users get to you. I mean you sound intelligent enough and this is a debate forum, so debate the issue.

Well, there's no point in teaching someone who cannnot grasp the concept of something that isn't staring them in the face. So let them hate religion, hate is what they are good at. Just let them bask in their smug biggoted since of superioty as they sit with their thumbs up their ass thinking about how they've got it all figured out.

That is what they say about religion and that is what you say about them. Not much difference so far. At best here you learn a different person's point of view, at worst you let it get you angry and compromise yourself.