Audio Portal Voting

[API]

Could there be, by any chance, an implementation of a java/flash timer that will open up the voting panel when the song has completed one play? Artists need to be given a better chance. One day, I look at my audio scores, they range from about a 3.50 - 4.50, then the next, they are in the ones and two's. This blows my mind. The same goes for the flash portal.

When it is the day before the weekly top 5, people tend to vote 0 on everything they possibly can so their shitty little song will make it into the top 5.

That timer really should be implemented, to make things fair and fun. To hell with people who vote 0 on everything.

-API-

[Denvish]

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote: That timer really should be implemented, to make things fair and fun. To hell with people who vote 0 on everything.

I don't think a timer would make a blind bit of difference. What we really need to do is track down the mass-zero-voters and slice them up into small pieces which can then be made into pies for the needy.

[Erkie]

You speak my mind, but a timer would be a bit hasty.

It's a nasty-ass battle out there that's outdoing itself on all fronts, both audio and flash, I think right now the best thing to do is to get some of your own pals together and up your ratings to what you really deserve.

Of course, the flaw being that you could jump the gun. Maybe we could get a specialized protection ring going, like DJRunaway made. It sounds faggy, but it would work. To some extent.

[API]

At 4/13/05 05:02 PM, Denvish wrote:

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote: What we really need to do is track down the mass-zero-voters and slice them up into small pieces which can then be made into pies for the needy.

Damn I love you.

[Pandora-Tranquil]

im with u -api- even if that was just a subliminal message saying VOTE MY MUSIC!!!

lol i hate fags that vote zero though, zeros have too much influence on a song, if u have 2 fives and get a zero, it takes it down to 3. something and that is bullshit.

that would be awesome if they actually had to listen to it all, then noone would vote zero barely cuz it would take so long. and for the people who actually do listen, it will remind them to vote.

however i dont think anyone who represents newgrounds will notice and actually implement something......

[TenchuX]

At 4/13/05 05:02 PM, Denvish wrote:

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote: That timer really should be implemented, to make things fair and fun. To hell with people who vote 0 on everything.

I don't think a timer would make a blind bit of difference. What we really need to do is track down the mass-zero-voters and slice them up into small pieces which can then be made into pies for the needy.

Thats hard to do if the 0 voters use a proxy to mask their IP address :-/...the only thing that would solve it would be an exp system, via BLAM and PROTECT like on the Flash Portal. You would get so many voters on songs, the 0 voters really wouldn't have that big of an effect. Could it be that hard to transfer the code over to the Audio Portal and make it basically a flash portal voting system with music not flash? :p

[SpamWarrior]

At 4/14/05 07:39 AM, TenchuX wrote:

Thats hard to do if the 0 voters use a proxy to mask their IP address :-/...the only thing that would solve it would be an exp system, via BLAM and PROTECT like on the Flash Portal. You would get so many voters on songs, the 0 voters really wouldn't have that big of an effect. Could it be that hard to transfer the code over to the Audio Portal and make it basically a flash portal voting system with music not flash? :p

The problem being that 0 voters would get rewarded with more voting power. Maybe it would balance out, but it takes some planning to work out..... Maybe stop people voting with a masked ip address? After all, its only newgrounds who's gonna know your ip address....

[HDG]

i believe that i vote fairly. i listen the whole song. if i like it, i give it five. i'm pretty straight foward. i rarely do the in betweens. usually 0, 1, or 5. if i liked it at all, i'd like to see it go up, so that other people can vote on it too because i want others to hear my stuff as well. if i thought it was just meh, i probably don't vote, or i just give it a 1.

[API]

At 4/14/05 04:57 PM, HDG wrote: i believe that i vote fairly. i listen the whole song. if i like it, i give it five. i'm pretty straight foward. i rarely do the in betweens. usually 0, 1, or 5. if i liked it at all, i'd like to see it go up, so that other people can vote on it too because i want others to hear my stuff as well. if i thought it was just meh, i probably don't vote, or i just give it a 1.

But you don't count as hordes of people. I'm still glad you actually listen to the song.

[IvanTuroc]

speaking of audio portal voting...
I have noticed once I vote on a audio portal entry I cannot go back and vote again the next day like flash entries where you get to vote once daily.
In other words, once I vote, thats it, no revoting. Is that normal?
I mean I have tried voting right at midnite when no others could have possibly voted on them and still get the error"looks like you have already voted on this entry today"
anyone?

[Loki]

I hate when people vote 0 for no reason... It makes me angry >:(

[TropicalParadise]

No music deserves to have a 0 voted on it, if they tried hard. If more people are encouraged to go to the audio portal, other than those that just go there when their music is put up, than the 0's that the other audio submitists would have the effect of their 0's lessened.

[AGH]

At 4/17/05 09:26 AM, IvanTuroc wrote: speaking of audio portal voting...
I have noticed once I vote on a audio portal entry I cannot go back and vote again the next day like flash entries where you get to vote once daily.
In other words, once I vote, thats it, no revoting. Is that normal?
I mean I have tried voting right at midnite when no others could have possibly voted on them and still get the error"looks like you have already voted on this entry today"
anyone?

I tend to get that in the alpha section sometimes too, for one movie I couldn't vote on it for several weeks. I have no idea why it happens though, but maybe it could be related?

[AGH]

At 4/17/05 11:13 AM, AGH wrote: I tend to get that in the alpha section sometimes too, for one movie I couldn't vote on it for several weeks. I have no idea why it happens though, but maybe it could be related?

Nevermind, maybe it is what you said. I just went to vote on something I have voted on before (like 3 months ago) and it said I had already voted today. I could've sworn I could vote more than once on something, but maybe my memory is deceiving me.

[Pavo-Miskic]

Yea, the only votes I see people get on their music are 0's and 5's, I think the best way to handle this is just track down mass 0'ers and ban them from Newgrounds for a week or so so when they come back they put their shit back together or its banned for a month, then a year, then life

[corvet]

At 4/17/05 09:26 AM, IvanTuroc wrote: speaking of audio portal voting...
I have noticed once I vote on a audio portal entry I cannot go back and vote again the next day like flash entries where you get to vote once daily.
In other words, once I vote, thats it, no revoting. Is that normal?
I mean I have tried voting right at midnite when no others could have possibly voted on them and still get the error"looks like you have already voted on this entry today"
anyone?

yeah, i voted on a song about 8 months ago and I was scrolling through the musisc when I saw it and I thought i would vote on it again and it gave me the same message-even 8 months later!

[Chronamut]

actually - you can only vote once on a song. Its pretty much always been like that. It also prevents users from blamming 0 over and over and over.. which could be devastating as blammers would tend to vote 0 more than decent people would vote 5.

I listen to a whole song before i rate it. sometimes i dont rate at all. Actually, a lot of times i dont rate at all. Unless its something that is either totally awesome, sucks beyond belief, was stolen or could use lots of improvement,.. or maybe someone I see as having potential.

Also if a person is a known jerk - but i like their song neways - i might give them a 4 - so factors like that will affect my judgement. They get my grudging respect that is all.

And no i do not rate other people zero to put my songs above them. You people might remember my brother, Reaper_of_ratings who blammed many many ppl because he was like the evil santa claus from futurama - too high expectations.

0s are meant for blatent midi rips and bad ones at that. Ive been mulling over the voting problem for a long time now, and it seems there is no real way to solve it without crushing peoples free will, because:

You cant have them review first - they'll just create alias accounts and write gibberish.

You cant force them to NOT vote zero - some songs deserve a zero. Not many but some

You could give users voting power - but this could go either way. What i think is that people who vote high on songs should get higher voting power than people that vote down if it was implemented.

all in all it boils down to the users choice - if they wanna vote zero, they will vote zero.

[GoreBastard]

I'm glad somebody made a topic about this, because I was thinking the same thing... Just the other day my song "Patronising Cunt" was number 7 with a score of 3.82... The next day that song, along with all of my other high scoring ones, had much lower scores than the previous day! And what really pisses me off, is that good musicians spend time on their songs and get a shitty score, but people who upload a 15 second effortless riff with no drums saying, "It's for a song I'm making, tell me if it's good", always seem to get a high vote and shit loads of downloads? Anyway I'm glad someone voiced their opinion on this, I hope the Newgrounds dudes do something about it.

[SpamWarrior]

I reckon that people on the same page or set score range shouldnt be allowed to vote on each others songs, though i'm not sure how to fit in people like me who 5 their own tracks so that they get noticed. In this situation I shouldnt be able to judge anyone who is in the same range of scores. This would stop people from voting down songs just to increase their own place. Apologies to Denvish, but i'm not sure where the evolution thread is, and i think this should be hammered out properly here before the staff see it.

Any comments?

[SpamWarrior]

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote: Could there be, by any chance, an implementation of a java/flash timer that will open up the voting panel when the song has completed one play? Artists need to be given a better chance. One day, I look at my audio scores, they range from about a 3.50 - 4.50, then the next, they are in the ones and two's. This blows my mind. The same goes for the flash portal.

The problem is jealousy, or offending people. People who make shit audio think "giving him a 0 will make me feel better and also increase my place a bit" I think people who stalk people and 0 people should be allowed to still 0 them, but the 0 should have much less of a strong affect. If people were banned for being spiteful they'd just get a new account. Sad bastards. ah well......

[Erkie]

At 4/19/05 11:50 PM, GoreBastard wrote: I'm glad somebody made a topic about this, because I was thinking the same thing... Just the other day my song "Patronising Cunt" was number 7 with a score of 3.82... The next day that song, along with all of my other high scoring ones, had much lower scores than the previous day! And what really pisses me off, is that good musicians spend time on their songs and get a shitty score, but people who upload a 15 second effortless riff with no drums saying, "It's for a song I'm making, tell me if it's good", always seem to get a high vote and shit loads of downloads? Anyway I'm glad someone voiced their opinion on this, I hope the Newgrounds dudes do something about it.

Has anyone else noticed the distinct rise in these short samples? Despite the fact that this is an Audio Loops and Samples page, I've noticed that a lot of these samples are from new people.

When I came to the audio portal, as a new guy, I felt intimidated and threatened by artists who ranked high and mediocre, what did I do? I battled them.

Now, I realize what I did was immature, especially after I found out that making GOOD music is hard, and it's rewarding when it ranks. That's a personal lesson that could only be taught on my own. And that unless the new ones make this shift, they will continously push us down. Which is nearly impossible because it takes years to craft.

[SpamWarrior]

Theres nothing wrong with short loops. Its when they get rated as higher effort than a full track people get annoyed. Not many flashes are up for fitting in full tracks, unless someone writes a video around a song, like someone did with a deftones track, Luis i think it was.

[Erkie]

At 4/21/05 09:15 AM, SpamWarrior wrote:

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote: Could there be, by any chance, an implementation of a java/flash timer that will open up the voting panel when the song has completed one play? Artists need to be given a better chance. One day, I look at my audio scores, they range from about a 3.50 - 4.50, then the next, they are in the ones and two's. This blows my mind. The same goes for the flash portal.

The problem is jealousy, or offending people. People who make shit audio think "giving him a 0 will make me feel better and also increase my place a bit" I think people who stalk people and 0 people should be allowed to still 0 them, but the 0 should have much less of a strong affect. If people were banned for being spiteful they'd just get a new account. Sad bastards. ah well......

That brings me to my next point,

To be considered a threat should be an honor, but yes, only for a certain amount of time.
What your thinking of is installing a voting ratio, which has been explored, and failed because of it's short comings, after a short period of time, it wouldn't even matter.

The audio is saying, hey, look at me, I'm next to the flash portal, "I'm the sibling of a very extreme and consistent product", and pretty says to anyone, "Hey, jerk, why don't YOU make music?". Thus, new people who pursue their love for the POSTAL SERVICE. or ROB ZOMBIE.

the only idea that comes to mind that there needs to be a fan basis and an artist basis, there needs to be some kind of barrier between the people who know they can do it and the people who kinda think they can do it, screw everything up and drop out.

[SpamWarrior]

A barrier would be good, but there would need to be a lot of artists from experimental as well as other areas judging, as it seems to be experimental in my experience which takes the most abuse. Noobs just think "eh, its not metal, therefore its shit" or "eh, its not techno, therefore its shit"

There'd need to be a fair panel deciding basically, and it wouldnt be fair to have the largest genres have the most representatives, as whilst it would seem fair, they would naturally favour their own sound, so what others see as good experimental they would see as a crock of shit.

[Erkie]

That's an interesting idea, I think if we had a editorial/mod represent each genre, they could balance it out with editorial recommendations, someone to outrule abusive things.

[Chronamut]

why dont you just make whoever is most prominent, or been there the longest, or ranked the highest most frequently - the judges of their genre? Since theyve been there so long and are esteemed musicians they know whats hot and whats not.

[GoreBastard]

Chronamut you genious, that's an excellent idea, but what if the guy who's been there longest or has the highest rank is a complete dick that only likes one style of the genre, e.g, only likes rap metal and hates thrash metal... 2 completely different styles but in the same genre. That would indeeeed suck.

[Jhalkompwdr]

Yes! Another thing that's much rarer and MUCH more annoying is actionscript on flas that votes. It happened to LegendaryFrog, it can happen to you!

[Chronamut]

At 4/22/05 12:21 AM, GoreBastard wrote: Chronamut you genious, that's an excellent idea, but what if the guy who's been there longest or has the highest rank is a complete dick that only likes one style of the genre, e.g, only likes rap metal and hates thrash metal... 2 completely different styles but in the same genre. That would indeeeed suck.

well in that case you make judges that each deal with a certain aspect of the genre - one for thrash metal another for heavy etc.

The song that caters the most to whatever subgenre like lets say heavy metal would be judged by the heavy metal judge and not the thrash metal judge.

Or it could be judged by all of them - but you would have to have an odd number of judges for that genre to prevent ties - and that way if its for the most part good the thrash metal judge would get outvoted.

thats just my thought.

[Lavaking]

At 4/13/05 05:02 PM, Denvish wrote:

At 4/13/05 04:49 PM, -api- wrote:

I don't think a timer would make a blind bit of difference. What we really need to do is track down the mass-zero-voters and slice them up into small pieces which can then be made into pies for the needy.

believe it or not but on a completely different matter that actually happened in britain there was a barber called sweeny todd who in victorian times used to kill people and put them in pies.
look it up