National Security or Scrutiny?

[EnragedSephiroth]

I noticed while accessing the Politics forum that it says "got an opinion? post it here" (somewhere along those lines anyway). Well this seems to be a bit more than an opinion.. more like a fact. I was reading through the main MSN page on Dick Cheney's statements during today's Republican convention, they said: “On the question of America’s role in the world, the differences between Senator Kerry and President Bush are the sharpest, and the stakes for the country are the highest,” Cheney said. “History has shown that a strong and purposeful America is vital to preserving freedom and keeping us safe, yet time and again, Senator Kerry has made the wrong call on national security.” Now we know that all countries have to have some sort of form of defense for all sorts of purposes (tyrants, idiots, Richard Simmons, etc...) but it seems that all Dick Cheney and George W. Bush have had on their minds since that dark day on September 11th is "national security."

Now, does anyone else find it funny that this great country of the U.S. feels like it should protect its self on every front? I've heard people say that this is the price you pay when you're the biggest superpower in the world; wouldn't you think that the way Cheney and Bush manage the national security actually isolates the U.S. from the rest of the world rather than bring it together?

A while back (can't recall the exact date) president Bush signed a little something called the lovely "Patriot Act." Sounds patriotic right? Yeah... patriotism seems to be the republican party's way of making actual GOOD Americans feel that what the current administration is doing is right, just like Toby Keith's song makes it sound that putting a boot up someone's ass should be the American way of doing things, but that carries a possibility that other countries might not exactly find it friendly to get a boot in their ass even if it is "the American way" (Toby Keith). But anyway, the "patriotic" Patriot Act actually allows the government to arrest you, try you in court (of their choice, either federal or military) and sentence you without much tangible (solid) evidence. This would make it seem that the government is doing something a tad bit unconstitutional with that Patriot Act there like... violating your rights to privacy. So, now not only is the government isolating the U.S. from other countries with their patriotic "homeland security" but it also seems to be aiming to put it's own American citizens in a ditch with the Patriot Act.

What are your thoughts on the government's administration of national security? Are they doing a good job, or are they trying too hard to make you feel safe?

[witeshark]

I say that results speak well. Since 911 the FBI and CIA have actually canned some new attempts at terror, and the fact that well documented news points out the terror idiots are trying to resort to weak and lame ideas that won't work. Sorry for no sources now, watching the hurricane close range on my city...

[theburningliberal]

But does anything justify the revocation of our civil liberties?

I would post the Ben Franklin quote, but I think we all know what it is.

[EnragedSephiroth]

Well that's a smarted reply than others lol. Careful with them hurricanes, hope it doesn't turn out to be a bitch like Mitch. You're right though, the FBI and CIA have caught "some" suspects attempting terrorist acts, however, where's Bin Laden? Why didn't we do anything about Korea? We could have undergone some political talks with Kim Jong IL (or whatever his name is) and people still keep slipping by airport security like a lubricated condom (and believe me I live by LAX we hear about that shit all the time on the news), the current administration needs to seriously work some bugs out or get the hell out if they can't get it done right (without making us look like a bunch of girly paranoid people in the eyes of the rest of the world).

[antiklaus]

The War on Terror is hype.

You have a greater chance of dring by second hand smoke or by a steel beam landing on your head than by a terrorist attack...

[John-Kerry]

At 9/2/04 12:34 AM, theburningliberal wrote: But does anything justify the revocation of our civil liberties?

I would post the Ben Franklin quote, but I think we all know what it is.

You mean the one that is no longer legitimate.

He spoke in a time that was free from islamic terrorism, suicide bombers, chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons. The quote is outdated, and I'm sure he would change it if he were alive today.

The problem is, liberals arent smart enough to understand that.

[John-Kerry]

At 9/2/04 12:39 AM, antiklaus wrote: The War on Terror is hype.

You have a greater chance of dring by second hand smoke or by a steel beam landing on your head than by a terrorist attack...

Islamic terrorists have just taken a school hostage in Russia. Children, hostage. Some have died, they threaten to kill more, and even blow up the building, killing all of them.

BUT AT LEAST YOU ARE SAFE! You OBVIOUSLY stand less of a chance of being attacked than THEY do.

What happens when your little girl is in the American school that is taken over? Will you sleep easy each night knowing that YOU dont stand much of a chance of being attacked by terrorists???

See, you shouldnt put personal percentages above the lives of your fellow americans.

[theburningliberal]

At 9/2/04 12:41 AM, John_Kerry wrote:

At 9/2/04 12:34 AM, theburningliberal wrote: But does anything justify the revocation of our civil liberties?

I would post the Ben Franklin quote, but I think we all know what it is.

You mean the one that is no longer legitimate.

He spoke in a time that was free from islamic terrorism, suicide bombers, chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons. The quote is outdated, and I'm sure he would change it if he were alive today.

The problem is, liberals arent smart enough to understand that.

So the words of the founding fathers mean nothing?

That would explain a lot. Like why the Republicans feel the need to distort the intent of the constitution and why they feel the need to violate said intent.

I think you need to go examine your history, TS. Whoops. I mean J_K.

[theburningliberal]

I haven't seen enough about the hostages in Russia, but I believe that the hostages are being held by Chechen separatists, not islamic extremists.

[John-Kerry]

At 9/2/04 12:49 AM, theburningliberal wrote: I haven't seen enough about the hostages in Russia, but I believe that the hostages are being held by Chechen separatists, not islamic extremists.

What do you think Chechen rebels are? They are islamic.

[EnragedSephiroth]

At 9/2/04 12:46 AM, theburningliberal wrote:

At 9/2/04 12:41 AM, John_Kerry wrote:

At 9/2/04 12:34 AM, theburningliberal wrote: But does anything justify the revocation of our civil liberties?

I would post the Ben Franklin quote, but I think we all know what it is.

You mean the one that is no longer legitimate.

He spoke in a time that was free from islamic terrorism, suicide bombers, chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons. The quote is outdated, and I'm sure he would change it if he were alive today.

The problem is, liberals arent smart enough to understand that.

So the words of the founding fathers mean nothing?

That would explain a lot. Like why the Republicans feel the need to distort the intent of the constitution and why they feel the need to violate said intent.

I think you need to go examine your history, TS. Whoops. I mean J_K.

You remember that little slip-up when John Kerry's mic was on and he said "I swear, these republicans are some of the crooked-est, cheating people you will ever meet" he said that for a reason. The fact of the matter is that we can't alter our own "inalienable" rights like freedom of speech, choice and the pursuit of happiness just because of terrorrists, otherwise they've won by scaring us shitless, hence why the whole national security thing seems to be the Republican party's obsession. What about education? What about medical issues? Damnit we need to pay attention to the matters at hand NOW not what COULD happen, you can't live your life thinking "what if."

[antiklaus]

What happens when your little girl is in the American school that is taken over? Will you sleep easy each night knowing that YOU dont stand much of a chance of being attacked by terrorists???

This sort of thing was going on 100 years ago, and with much more frequency and intensity.

See, you shouldnt put personal percentages above the lives of your fellow americans.

The percentages ARE the lives of our fellow americans.

For every billion squandered on Terrorism legislation:

10,000 people in America go to bed with an empty stomach
AND
10,000 Americans die because there wasn't adequate funding for health care to keep them alive.
AND
10,000 children are forced into the street to live homeless because there are no funds for the local shelter.
AND
2000 teacher's posts go unstaffed because thre was no funding
AND
Dick Cheney makes 1.25 million in revenues from his Haliburton dividends.

don't tell me about real lives in danger when REAL AMERICANS are suffering to rid the world of IMAGINARY TERRORISTS.

[antiklaus]

I think you need to go examine your history, TS. Whoops. I mean J_K.

Heheheheheh I was gonna say that - you crafty little liberal you.

[theburningliberal]

At 9/2/04 01:16 AM, antiklaus wrote:

I think you need to go examine your history, TS. Whoops. I mean J_K.

Heheheheheh I was gonna say that .

TBL = Quick Draw McGraw...

- you crafty little liberal you

And damn proud of it.

[theburningliberal]

At 9/2/04 01:00 AM, John_Kerry wrote:

At 9/2/04 12:49 AM, theburningliberal wrote: I haven't seen enough about the hostages in Russia, but I believe that the hostages are being held by Chechen separatists, not islamic extremists.

What do you think Chechen rebels are? They are islamic.

Pay attention TS. I'm going to give you a lesson.

1) I agree that they are Islamic.

2) But that doesn't mean anything. You see, they goals for which Islamic Extremists (Osama) and the Chechen separatists are fighting for are very different. Osama takes a hard-line anti-American stance, whereas the Chechen separatists, while they may personally be supportive of Osama's goals, have goals of their own: freedom from the Russian government. That is an overriding category, and that title surpasses the islamic extremist label.