Abortion and stem cell research.

[Steel-Redeemer]

I think that abortion should be a womans right and that stem cell research should be made legal, but should use only the stem cells of aborted children, they don't need em anyway.
Any views?

[System-1]

abortion is wrong, but if a potential mother wants an abortion it's usually for the best. abortions of feotuses under the age of 12 weeks is fesable, but above that, when major development starts to occur, then abortion should be avoided. may not be born, but its still alive.

as for the stem cells, why let an abortion go to waste??? nothing wrong with it, and the research can help alot of people.

[bombkangaroo]

if they can't get stem cells from aborted feotuses, they can always go around maternity wards asking for left over placentas.

[Spookshow]

...

Like I have said before. I think some medicines and other mind and body altering drugs are semi-bad. Screwing with our genetic make-up is even worse. What if we make ourselves sterile or worse?

[bbbomber]

At 8/15/04 06:38 AM, WhoopingTerrier wrote: abortion is wrong, but if a potential mother wants an abortion it's usually for the best. abortions of feotuses under the age of 12 weeks is fesable, but above that, when major development starts to occur, then abortion should be avoided. may not be born, but its still alive.

as for the stem cells, why let an abortion go to waste??? nothing wrong with it, and the research can help alot of people.

I strongly agree with you, aborted fetus' would be a great use for science and expirimentation, nicely stated

[Slizor]

Like I have said before. I think some medicines and other mind and body altering drugs are semi-bad. Screwing with our genetic make-up is even worse. What if we make ourselves sterile or worse?

So we shouldn't do anything for fear of fucking up? I know, let's all just sit here because if we move we could fall over!

[ChaosFoot]

ya, abortion is a persons choice, if a woman wants to abort her pregnancy, she should be able to do so with no hassle whatsoever, also contrary to what some people think, a fetus is only considered "living" when it is born and disconnected from the mother, while it is inside and connected, it is merely an attachment of the mother, meaning an abortion is nothing more than an amputation, also, stem cell research should be pursued thru any means necessary, fetal cells, unused tissue, any usable specimen

[DrKamakazy1]

Men shouldn't decide what to do with a womans body. Women should decide, i wouldn't want dogs to decide whether or not to castrate every man

[The-General-Public]

At 8/15/04 06:14 PM, DrKamakazy1 wrote: Men shouldn't decide what to do with a womans body. Women should decide, i wouldn't want dogs to decide whether or not to castrate every man

I wouldn't want Parents to decide whether or not to kill their children either.

[ImmoralLibertarian]

Abortion - Unborn foetuses may be alive, but are they conscious? Well, they certainly aren’t in the early development stage. Also, they are technically part of the woman’s body, and the woman can do to her body what ever the fuck she wants.

Abortion is killing? Depends on how you look at it. You could call me a murderer right now because I’m not having unprotected sex, THAT child will not be born.

Stem Cell Research - Of fucking course so! There is REAL possibilities to cure many ailments. It would take many decades probably, but in this case, the end justifies the means.

And the means aint all that bad either. Humans are too far up their own arses if you ask me. We don’t think twice about slaughtering millions of cows to make big macs (I like big macs) but using cells that one day could have, but will not now be a human being is a no-no.

[bombkangaroo]

At 8/15/04 06:14 PM, DrKamakazy1 wrote: Men shouldn't decide what to do with a womans body. Women should decide, i wouldn't want dogs to decide whether or not to castrate every man

i got a good one for the women:
your body, your choice, our problem. don't ask me for money, slut.
:P

[bombkangaroo]

of course that was supposed to say "your problem" but my damn useless fingers are just spazming over the buttons as per usual.
the joke is ruined, i'm going to go cut myself. [/emo]

[Neverness]

Embryonic stem cells have the greatest potential for use, mainly for the fact that they can develop into any type of cell, whereas mature, meaning already specialized cells can only be copied, and can never be changed into a different type. The main argument over embryonic stem cell use is that you can create all the cells you want simply by copying them from a donor. And while true, maintaining a library of the multitude of a person's cells vs. the few embryonic cells seems like a waste of time and resources. But, there are valid counter arguments as well.

And as for abortion, I'm a guy, what right do I have to tell a woman what to do--I'll never be in her position...fortunately.

[LexanPhoenix]

I think that abortion should be a woman's choice. I also think that the Bush administration is handling things wrong by saying "well, you have to have this baby, but we aren't going to help you raise it". Come on dude, if a poor person was raped and is now pregnant, she can't support a baby on her own, yet Bush wants to force her to. That's crap if you ask me.

Stem cell research may cause a few embryos to be aborted, but as long as they aren't past 12 weeks (or whenever they're considered as another person) then it's not really murder. It's similar to having a tumor cut off your skin. The tumor is alive, but it's not consious yet (I know embryos aren't malignant, but the idea is similar). Besides, with all the lives that stem cell research will save, it will be well worth it.

[Spookshow]

At 8/15/04 10:32 AM, Slizor wrote: So we shouldn't do anything for fear of fucking up? I know, let's all just sit here because if we move we could fall over!

Eh, we've been doing semi-fine for what 30,000 years plus? Why screw with that now. Where do we draw the line though? We already have enough problems with ethical doctors, now we have to worry about what some would do to the genetic structure of mankind?

[shei-inte]

This is a difficult topic, no matter what side a person is with. I believe that a woman's decision is made when she decides to consent to a sexual relationship and that abortion is no longer a choice if she becomes pregnant. However, if the woman's life is in danger because of the pregnancy or the woman was raped then abortion is her choice.

Stem cell research does have the potential to help cure many diseases, but how many potential lives will it take to reach that goal?

[Gunter45]

Waste not, want not. If a woman has an abortion, why not use the aborted fetus for something useful instead of deep sixing it, or whatever they do with the things.

[The-Complex-Old-Man]

Ahh finally a bunch of people with a good view point.... ok heres mine...

Abortion: It should be the womans choice weather or not to do it. If she wants if aborted in the first place then obviously if she left it live... its life could have (to be blunt) pretty shitty. She could choose to abort it if:

A: She doesnt make enough money to support the child... if she let it be born then it would just starve anyways.

B: If the child was unwanted... why should a child have to be born into a family that doesnt want it? Its just not fair to the child or the parents.

Now i know that you can bring up the issue that you can now leave the child at the emergency room safely... but again thats pretty unfair to the child too. Growing up in foster homes is difficult and it's going to mess the child up anyways. And even if foster parents can be found, its never the same. Once the child finds out it has been adopted then all the previous problems just come back again.

The last thing i add onto the abortion side of this is that while i agree pro-choice... i feel that there should be a set limit of how late you can do it. Like was previously said the child may not be born yet but its still alive...i think its month 3 that the limit should be made... but dont harass me on that because its been a while since ive been submerged into the topic.

Stem Cells: Im for it 100%. Not only from the aborted children but using your own created cells should been a problem, especially when its not for just a single cell. The Amazing benefits that can come from its research and success FAR out weighs the disadvanteages. Think about this... the countless thousands of people who were born with disabilities... thousands more injured in work or war... the ability to grow back entire limbs. The waiting list for extra organs would be sliced to nothing more then growing time... millions saved... maybe im just closed minded.. but i dont see anything wrong with that.

[Neverness]

All things considered this is a pretty easy going discussion. I'm glad to see that some people actually agree with my opinions on these issues.

[The-Enforcer]

I am against abortion but I'm pro stem cell research.

Not allowing federal funds to be made accessible to stem cell research is one of the things George W Bush did that I didn't agree with.

[bumcheekcity]

I'm for Stem Cell Research. Abortion isn't a nice thing, so we have to make the best out of it that we can. Using stem cells could potentially cure some pretty nasty diseases. Do all we can, I say.

[Kilrathi827]

As was mentioned, this tends to be a tricky subject with battle lines clearly drawn and defended. This thread seems to indicate though that a civilized conversation CAN be held on the subject though. Personally, I think that abortion is ethically speaking wrong, except in certain cases (i.e. rape, incest, danger to the mother, etc.). This comes from my own personal religious beliefs. At the same time however, I do not feel it is the duty of the government (Federal or State) to be regulating any form of action which must be left to the individual. Matters of morals and ethics must be left up to the individual person to decide.

[AssholeSauce]

Stem-cell research helps, abortion with fetus' above the age of 12-13 weeks should not be done...

[Ravens-Grin]

The problem with allowing stem cell research through aborted fetuses is the possibility of the creation of an abortion market. The people will get pregnant just to get a couple bucks to sell the aborted fetuses for research. This should be outlawed, the aborted fetuses should only be free because if they paid money, then the original intention of the abortion changes.

[bumcheekcity]

At 8/17/04 01:59 PM, Ravens_Grin wrote: The problem with allowing stem cell research through aborted fetuses is the possibility of the creation of an abortion market. The people will get pregnant just to get a couple bucks to sell the aborted fetuses for research. This should be outlawed, the aborted fetuses should only be free because if they paid money, then the original intention of the abortion changes.

Yes, I agree with this. The women (after having her abortion) should be allowed the choice between having her baby/foetus/squidge used for stem cell research or not. If she doesn't want to, that's fine.

[Jemistad]

've been thinking about this for a while - it's a very interesting subject.
Deciding the point at which something becomes human is important.
If sperm has a life - then condoms could be considered to be wrong.
Personally I agree with using stem cells to cure diseases - and even to farm body parts. Messing with a human body is fine - messing with a mind is wrong - and could lead to numerous problems. I also think creating superhumans (or modify the genetic pattern of humans to make them stronger) is immoral.

Abortion is a tricky subject - as it reverts to my first point - about deciding the point at which something becomes human. Abortion could be considered murder. It is said that at a certain stage - the foetus becomes self-aware. At that point, I think abortion is wrong.

I some cases, abortion is necessary or convenient. For under-age mothers, especially those of poor background, bringing up an unwanted baby would be a trial - the mother and the baby would not benifit. If you are a victim of rape, a rape that leads to pregnancy - abortion might be a good idea.

However, this sort of meddling might lead to bigger problems. Much advertised is the potential threat of increased GM-product usage, organ transplants, stem cell research, cloning and increased AI. (Personally I think robots and computers taking over the world is rubbish - and will never come into fruition)

[Lisa4Catholis]

The sad thing is you guys can not see this is a Nazi mentality.You do not use humans,babies, unborn children,as commodities.Has everyone gone insane! The idea that a poor person a handicapped person, or a unborn person has less of a right to live is evil. In order for people to back Hitler he had to first convince the German people that the Jews were less than human,he called them parasites, sewer rats,ect...Look at this conversation.Wake up