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whiteboyme
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 01:29 PM Reply

At 9/17/01 11:06 AM, TomFulp wrote: We've heard a lot of different response to recent events - many people want to turn Afghanistan into a parking lot, while others want to shower Osama Bin Laden with love and show him we are not the monsters he thinks we are. I would personally like to see his head on a stick, but before we discuss extremes, lets take a look at someone else's perspective. The following is part of an email thread written by Tamim Ansary, Afghani-American writer. He gives his American friends the perspective through his Afghani eyes:

I've been hearing a lot of talk about "bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age." Ronn Owens, on KGO Talk Radio today, allowed that this would mean killing innocent people, people who had nothing to do
with this atrocity, but "we're at war, we have to accept collateral damage. What else can we do?" Minutes later I heard some TV pundit discussing whether we "have the belly to do what must be done."

And I thought about the issues being raised especially hard because I am from Afghanistan, and even though I've lived here for 35 years I've never lost track of what's going on there. So I want to tell anyone who will listen how it all looks from where I'm standing.

I speak as one who hates the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. There is no doubt in my mind that these people were responsible for the atrocity in New York. I agree that something must be done about those monsters.

But the Taliban and Ben Laden are not Afghanistan. They're not even the government of Afghanistan. The Taliban are a cult of ignorant psychotics who took over Afghanistan in 1997. Bin Laden is a political
criminal with a plan. When you think Taliban, think Nazis. When you think Bin Laden, think Hitler. And when you think "the people of Afghanistan" think "the Jews in the concentration camps." It's not only that the Afghan people had nothing to do with this atrocity. They were the first victims of the perpetrators.

They would exult if someone would come in there, take out the Taliban and clear out the rats nest of international thugs holed up in their country.

Some say, why don't the Afghans rise up and overthrow the Taliban? The answer is, they're starved, exhausted, hurt, incapacitated, suffering. A few years ago, the United Nations estimated that there were 500,000 disabled orphans in Afghanistan - a country with no economy, no food. There are millions of widows. And the Taliban has been burying these widows alive in mass graves. The soil is littered with land mines, the farms were all destroyed by the Soviets. These are a few of the reasons why the Afghan people have not overthrown the Taliban.

We come now to the question of bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age. Trouble is, that's been done. The Soviets took care of it already. Make the Afghans suffer? They're already suffering.

Level their houses? Done.

Turn their schools into piles of rubble? Done.

Eradicate their hospitals? Done.

Destroy their infrastructure? Cut them off from medicine and health care?

Too late. Someone already did all that.

New bombs would only stir the rubble of earlier bombs. Would they at least get the Taliban? Not likely. In today's Afghanistan, only the Taliban eat, only they have the means to move around. They'd slip away and hide. Maybe the bombs would get some of those disabled orphans, they don't move too fast, they don't even have wheelchairs. But flying over Kabul and dropping bombs wouldn't really be a strike against the criminals who did this horrific thing.

Actually it would only be making common cause with the Taliban - by raping once again the people they've been raping all this time. So what else is there? What can be done, then? Let me now speak with true fear and trembling. The only way to get Bin Laden is to go in
there with ground troops. When people speak of "having the belly to do what needs to be done" they're thinking in terms of having the belly to kill as many as needed.

Having the belly to overcome any moral qualms about killing innocent people.

Let's pull our heads out of the sand. What's actually on the table is Americans dying. And not just because some Americans would die fighting their way through Afghanistan to Bin Laden's hideout. It's much bigger than that folks. Because to get any troops to Afghanistan, we'd have to go through Pakistan. Would they let us? Not likely. The conquest of Pakistan would have to be first. Will other Muslim nations just stand by?

You see where I'm going. We're flirting with a world war between Islam and the West.

And guess what: that's Bin Laden's program. That's exactly what he wants.

That's why he did this. Read his speeches and statements. It's all right there. He really believes Islam would beat the west. It might seem ridiculous, but he figures if he can polarize the world into Islam and the West, he's got a billion soldiers. If the West wreaks a holocaust in those lands, that's a billion people with nothing left to lose, that's even better from Bin Laden's point of view. He's probably wrong, in the end the West would win, whatever that would
mean, but the war would last for years and millions would die, not just theirs but ours. Who has the belly for that?

Bin Laden does. Anyone else?

I'm not sure when this email was written - but Pakistan has since pledged support to the US. I am guessing that would include sending ground troups through Pakistan. I also doubt that we will be turning Afghanistan into a parking lot. Anyone who has been reading up on our current military status may have seen that we have two prototype planes with high powered lasers, capable of destroying a single human target in a crowd from 180 miles away. I'd like to see us use that between Osama's legs. But I'm getting sidetracked...

My main reason for posting this was, what does it make you think? Does it change your view of Afghanistan? Does it change your feelings towards what must be done to end this conflict?
K-psychotic
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 01:37 PM Reply

ok ok ok everyone seems to be forgetting something. 15,000 people men, women, and children are dead. first of all there is no way in hell we will not let their lives go un-avenged. Secondly there are other terrorist organizations out there. It's a "war on terrorism" not just bin laden, he's our main focus right now but it won't end right there. It's up to Afghanastan to either hand over bin laden (because we al know they can) or to keep him and have their country crushed. Now you really have to look at how weak minded they are if they do keep him. Osama convinced them that they could beat not only the U.S. but every alliance they have going with them. It's pretty much the world (excluding china japan india etc) vs. a middle-east country. There was really only one man who worked for taliban who could even rival Osama but guess what....his ass was assassinated a week ago. So now here you have at it's more likely ww3 then the an operation "desert storm" except this time you finish the job. America is an amazing country where anyone no matter race, religion, or creed have the chance to speak freely about their view points. If we don't attack and we don't fight then what are we? Cowards? Weak? Not american...who knows.

jman66
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 01:46 PM Reply

I dont think afghanistan will be "turned into a parking lot" We have the military capability to take out specific targets. Precision attacks that will keep the loss of innocent lives to a minimum.... This is NOT world war II where bombs land at the mercy of the bomber's skill and the wind... Also the comparisons to the wtc thing being like Pearl Harbor is GROSSLY INACURATE.... newscasters spit out mindless drivel when they dont have a telepromter to read from.... But back to my point, We have the capability to to go in there and get the people that we need to get without great impact on the entire population of afhanistan... And once more, instead of Islam against the west it will be the world against terrorism... Other countries such as russia have pledged to help us, and even Iran is considering letting us use its bases . If anything this "war" will eradicate a large terroist group, and at the same time bring world nations closer together in the process.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 01:48 PM Reply

Nuke the mother fucker

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DaWeb
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 01:50 PM Reply

I can totally understand where your comming from, but you say that we would kill inocent people? well weren't all the thousands of ppl killed in the pentagon and wtc and bistandards innocent? I think that we have to do something because if we let ben laden get away with this other nations will think that we are a bunch of "push overs", no pun intended, so therefore we have got to retaliate.

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morbidiqua
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 02:38 PM Reply

Dear Tom,
I am a 23 year old ex New Yorker currently situated up in Boston. I suppose you have heard of some of the horrible things several uncaring
people have posted as comments. I know you consider yourself neutral but I am saddened and offended by some comments made by a certain Isaiah (who made
the Boy & his Blob animation) and other cold hearted people. He made comments to one of the Tributes that made me tear up in anger. Yesterday I had to console a friend after the funeral of one of the Pilots who died in the attack. The pilot was a friend of hers. I also saw a friend yesterday who had lost 6 friends in the World Trade Center. I'm sorry if I got angry but the idea that someone could be so ridiculously cruel makes me seeth. I am a tired human being who would like at least a slap on the wrist given to Isaiah to show that those kinds of comments will at least be reprimanded.

Sincerely,

Morbidiqua

P.S. Yes I'm a chick... :)

Knaggsy
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 03:03 PM Reply

i was longing to hear another side to the story its interesting to finally hear something from the other side cause lets face it the controlled media like radiio television and newspapers are only ever gonna release small very generalised opinions. In view of what is going on is afghanistan i think we should be providing support to these people turn them into our allies then we have a country of spies allowing us to track down the taliban and Osama using only a fraction of the firepower and man power available.
of course this would be dangerous and take time, which is why its easier to shoot blind at targets and hope to hit the right one. carpet bombing would grant us even more enemies and is much more cowardly.
what we must do is stop the needless violence erupting around this event. today on the news i heard about 2 men who were targeting a 19 year old asian girl with baseball bats in order to seek redemption, how cowardly pathetic and wrong is that? these men by acting like this take on the mentality of the taliban and its extremist followers.

DUDE4U
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:00 PM Reply

i say we kill the mother fuckers. i say we turn them into another dessert. i hope we do something soon because people here are going crazy.

jimmydeadstar
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:03 PM Reply

Everyone who wants to declare war on afghanistan should think of their younger brother or sister, their child or their parents. Then they should imagine that person severely burnt or disabled. This is what it is like for the people of Afghanistan, and if war brakes out between Islam and the west, it will happen to us.

It is the Taliban that are at fault. People should remember that killing innocent people, killing women children or the elderly, or attacking without violent provocation is stictly forbidden by the Qu'ran. The Taliban and Bin Laden are simply a bunch of psychos that are abusing a religion for their own gain. what gain? Bin Laden is thought to have made billions on the stock exchange through 'predicting' the tragedy...

Steve84
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:08 PM Reply

lets all end this in a peaceful manner i'm canadain we will fight this together

dagger-happy
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:14 PM Reply

At 9/18/01 02:38 PM, morbidiqua wrote: Dear Tom,
I am a 23 year old ex New Yorker currently situated up in Boston. I suppose you have heard of some of the horrible things several uncaring
people have posted as comments. I know you consider yourself neutral but I am saddened and offended by some comments made by a certain Isaiah (who made
the Boy & his Blob animation) and other cold hearted people. He made comments to one of the Tributes that made me tear up in anger. Yesterday I had to console a friend after the funeral of one of the Pilots who died in the attack. The pilot was a friend of hers. I also saw a friend yesterday who had lost 6 friends in the World Trade Center. I'm sorry if I got angry but the idea that someone could be so ridiculously cruel makes me seeth. I am a tired human being who would like at least a slap on the wrist given to Isaiah to show that those kinds of comments will at least be reprimanded.

Sincerely,

Morbidiqua

P.S. Yes I'm a chick... :)

The whole point of the internet (and freedom of speech), is that you can say whaever the hell you want. I saw some of Isiah's comments and they were pretty shitty things to say in a time like this, but I think it would be kind of hypocritical of Tom to "reprimand" Isiah for this while absolutely nothing has been done about the biggest arsehole of them all -strawberry clock. But let's forget about him, he's had his 5 minutes of fame.

Isledeavarice
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:18 PM Reply

We don't have to kill any more innocent people. NONE of the population of afghanistan actually supports the taliban. Also most of the population of afghanistan dosen't have any means of finding out about the world trade center being hit by a jet. They have no radio, no TV, not even newspapers. So they don't know. Since they have nothing to lose, they would probably side with the west.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 04:56 PM Reply

The US has some of the best technology in the world
they can be pinpoint the location of a nickle lying wedged between the buttcheeks of a angry arab.
The NATO alliance has the best special forces in the world, they are like a crossover between a ninja and McGuyver.
Yet they have to bomb the entire country to get a single bearded freak.
Excuse me, but that dosen't make much sense

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 05:13 PM Reply

This has been a big debate on the BBS since the day the towers fell. As I have said before, at first I was happy to see people coming together...but soon I was sickened as many people decided to give in to the basest of instincts and scapegoat a race of people in a sad attempt to appease their anger. All the time these people do not realize that they are emulating the man that they most despise.

In response to the comment that news anchors often turn into babbling idiots when without a teleprompter, I wholeheartedly agree. I watch the anchors at my station do this daily.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 05:19 PM Reply

HEy Arrogancy, I never said anything about nukes. Sure a few Cruise missles and some artillery but where did I say nukes? Don't think I did.

Im more concerned with the economy as of this moment, supposedly we're on the rebound and then the airlines and insurance industries get hit. Wahts wrose is that now we've got to be on the lookout and beef up security further for the SLC Games in February.

As tempting as Military police all over our street corners sound I think it would be better to find these people and keep them out of the country.

As much fun as this is I am going to go simulate the Ravens vs. VIkings on MAdden 2002 to find out who would have won that monday night football game.

"War cannot be stopped, it can only be postponed due to the advantages of others." Machiavelli

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 05:37 PM Reply

Think of the Afganistans as Jews in the concentration camps? Like they're the good guys? Is that why they were dancing in the streets are the terorist attacks?

boinkdoink
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 06:08 PM Reply

About the conspiracy---

At 9/17/01 02:51 PM, GiR wrote: Hmmmm... everyone is making a good point. I do have one idea of conspiracy... but I don't know. Here is something that I e-mailed my friends:

I think that the gov't started this whole thing. FACT: In the WTC, when the planes crashed into the buildings, everything in the plane and around that area of the building melted because it was so hot. And yet, the US gov't claims to have found one of the terrorists passports.

The plane crashed into the building then exploded. The heat for the combusted gas did melt everything around it, but such a thing happens as fast as the gas from the fuselage leaks. Things will only melt when the ignited gas hits it. If the passport of the terrorist was in a bag or in a pocket of some sort, there are chances that the gas did not reach it. On top of that, paper has to burn...it won't if it is exposed to high heat gas. Consequently, what you do say is plausible, but it seems more likely that investigators found a charred and blackened passport.
FACT: When the buildings collapsed, they imploded to an extent, like how when they implode buildings that are no longer needed. If a huge plane crashes into a building, and it collapsed, wouldn't it fall over on its side just a little bit??

No. The World Trade Center was built to withstand the impact of small planes (i.e. MD-11's) not 737's. When something that large hits it, the shock of impact weakened the main supports. When the main supports weaken, the weight of building can nolonger be held up. Each floor then collapses on the next, causing an implosion. The supports must have been irrepairably damaged in the 1992 bombing of the WTC garage also. Also if someone used plastic explosive or any other type, they would have needed a TON of it. Even after the fact, the amount of residue from the explosives would have been enormous, and that's something the feds can't ignore very easily.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 06:21 PM Reply

People will probably hate me - since that's what people tend to do... but here's my opinion:
I know we HAVE to retaliate somehow... but I can't STAND the celebrating! We're all human, Osama, you, me, everyone. We all have different ideals. Put in the same situation, raised and put in the same environment, any one of us could be the next Hitler. I really feel sorrow for not only us and the people who suffered, but for Bin Ladin, his organization, and everyone over in Afganistan for having to live this way, and having to resort to this. I don't agree with Bin Ladin's position or actions, but he's human, and the same as all of us, like it or not. We should retaliate, to protect our way of living, but lets not discriminate against the Afganistan - they've been through far worse... lets also not celebrate the Talibans death. We're killing them to preserve our way of life. But celebrating someones death makes you just as bad. It's hard to convey exactly what I think in text... even through long conversation people don't understand my views... hate me if you want - but that won't make you any better.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 06:39 PM Reply

At 9/18/01 05:37 PM, ParaSwarm wrote: Think of the Afganistans as Jews in the concentration camps? Like they're the good guys? Is that why they were dancing in the streets are the terorist attacks?

First the Afghans werent dancing on the streets, those were the palestinians. And second, it was the same footage of film being shown everytime of the same 10 or 15 people. Does 10 or 15 people describe the beliefs of millions?

With that said, the news media has been pretty much fueling the fire and giving its audience what they want, reason for hatred and anger. This is how they get their ratings. Of course theyll throw in a little bit of good news here and there, but thats just so they seem like they care about whats happening. Hey this is America, everythings done to make money in some sort of way, even war. Here are a few examples:

1) Do you think during the golf war, the United States was helping to free Kuwait because they thought it was the right thing to do? In actuality it was to keep the price of gas down and a side-effect of their actions would be freeing Kuwait.

2)While Iraq and Iran were in war with each other, who do you think was giving money and arms to both sides? America. They called it duel containment, which basically means let them kill each other so they wont go destroying other gas producing countries.

3) Then theres Vietnam and a ton of otheres which I wont go into.

What Im saying is that most people arent aware of things like this that the US does because the media is not going to report it. Its unpatriotic to talk about things like that and anyways people dont want to hear that the US was at fault for anything. Ive been reading a lot of posts on here that have made me realize that 99 percent of peole living in the US dont know anything about world history, US history, or of other countries or cultures.

Im not going to give my opinion on what should be done about Bin Laden, because I need to do a little more research into the subject. All I know is that the Afghans had nothing to do with the bombing, just a small group of people who arent even Afghans in some cases. Because Timothy McVeigh bombed the Oklahoma building we should bomb his family?

I think all of have to turn the TV's off and start looking for the true facts before we make any judgements, especially people in power because most of them know as little about this matter as most Americans.

Remember, we're humans, before we're Americans. Be patriotic to the human race and not to hatred and racism. Be true Americans.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 06:43 PM Reply

And one other thing: People are dead. Innocent people lost their lives. Everyday, thousands of more people begin losing hope that their loved ones will turn up...If you're in New York go downtown and look at the tons of posters with faces of missing people. They're all smiling and happy, and now tearful relatives are having the hope of finding their loved ones chipped away a day at a time. How could this happen here?
Well, it did. And this sort of thing happens all over of the world, all the time, going back to the beginning of civilization. Look at history. Look at places where disputes will never be settled, and look at why. In Isreal, each side has factions out for blood. When one side kills, the other side kills. Angry at the loss, the first side kills again. It's a vicious cycle.
You think I'm being mean? I've had friends who lost parents. I've had friends who have been spit on and threatened because they are Muslim. I've been to both extremes at once, and now I'm scared because we are going to rush blindly into war wreak havoc on a country already plunged in chaos, and set ourselves up for the next terrorist tradgedy. The People of Afghanistan do not hate us. 90% of Muslim People do not hate us. It is the fanatics. There are fanatics in every religion, and they ruin everything for the majority. Fanatic Christians in this country breed racist hate. Fanatic Jews in Israel will kill for their state, even if that means assassinating their own prime minister. Fanatic Muslims in Afghanistan will kill all who get in the way of their plans of creating the perfect Islamic state. Fanatic Hindus kill kind hearted missionaries who want nothing more than to help poor villagers in India. The list goes on.
The moral here: HATE ONLY BRINGS MORE SADNESS. If you want justice, go after the fanatics. Bring down the Taliban regime, bring down Bin Laden. Bring Down the KKK. Bring down the RSS (for those of you indians out there).
Bring down those who hate, and let live those who would be happy with the sanctity of life.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 07:26 PM Reply

In Animal Farm, the pigs said "All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others."

What a lot of people are doing right now... they're thinking "Their people are innocent, but ours were more innocent than them. So let's nuke them."

sigh.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 08:25 PM Reply

I'm not to sure what people would think about my idea... But it is my idea. Along with my families, and a few of my friends. Well, not exactly enough people to go agead and try to start a "La Resistance" like in the 'South Park: Bigger, Larger Uncut'. I feel that physicalty will only solve part of the problem created by the bombing of the World Trade Center, something which I saw first hand from outside the window of my high school on the 7th floor that faithful morning. What we need to do is to destroy the the suicidal beliefs of the Talban.
We can bomb O(U)sama hundreds of times over. It'll only make his followers angry, and all 15+ children of his angry at the United States. What will prevent them from attacking us again in another 20 years or so, when they're strong enough to carry out the death wish of their father. And the fact that he was the leader of these bombings are still now comformed. I mean SURE, there are still tons of evidence pointing to him, but America will feel really stupid if it was someone else. Not to drift away from the subject of how I feel the matter should be dealt with.
Unfortunatley, for all of the true patriots back there who would love to give themselves just to help America in a whole in the fight against not only Osama bin Laden, but against Terrorism altogether. And it's unfortunate that the thousands of people, uncluding alot of my own friends who wanted to help with the excavation of the remains of the WTC because it is also being treated as a 'crime scene'. Bt let it be known that to the victims of the WTC attacks, and to everyone accepted, our hearts are with you. Whether it be the most hardcore gangsta' to the wimpiest person, and all in between.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 09:07 PM Reply

Timothy McVeigh killed thousands of Americans a few years ago. If "Bin Laden" represents all the "Afghanistans" then "McVeigh" represents all the "Americans."

Don't you people know that all nukes nowadays are made of rubber? As in if you throw one on someone, someone will throw one back at you.

Afghanistan (and by that I mean the Taliban) already declared that it will attack any country in its perimeter that supports the United States. Meanwhile, the US twists Pakistan's arm and demands access to all their military equipment and operations. Pakistan sides with the US, not just because it's ultimately the right thing to do, but it also knows it's much worse to mess with the US than with Afghanistan.

So now Pakistani will die.

Did you know that Bush refused to sign anti-terrorism legislation in the U.N., which would have allowed terrorists like Bin Laden to be tried in front of a world court? He never thought the US was in danger of terrorism, so he let the rest of the world fend for themselves.

There's a difference between justice and revenge.

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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 09:39 PM Reply

I can't believe some of the people on Newgrounds! Throwing out random numbers, "Oh the United States has killed 50000000 innocents they should die as much as the terrorists." Hmmm lets think about that. No. Take a look at other countries: the Holocaust... How many innocent Jewish Civilians died in that war? Far more than the United States has ever killed in any conflict. Then in Russia, the purge trials and Stalin's reign of terror millions of people died in both of these situations and some people think the United States is bad? I agree America has done many wrongs (Racism against Native Americans, Japanese Internment Camps, and other various horrific acts) and maybe deserves this attack against its property, but killing people is just wrong. I read these reviews about people commending the cowardly (oh yes and they were cowardly, people who attack without warning and against civilian targets are afraid of something, and giving your live for a cause is not exactly bravery either many military soldiers gave and will probably give their lives for a cause, they just believe that they will go to Allah or heaven you want bravery: the people on the plane that crashed in Philadelphia or the firefighters that lost their lives when the WTC toppled) attacks and saying America deserves this horrible tragedy, I say bullshit. Any loss of life anywhere is a horrible thing! And America is one of the most peaceful nations on the Planet. Our country has sent millions upon millions of dollars to help the needy; on a whole our people are kind and good hearted. We have gone to war, but in almost every case it is to help or protect another country and the ideal of freedom. Dropping the a-bomb on Japan maybe wasn't the best choice, but would Germany and Japan used them against us in WWII? Probably. America is a strong, and peaceful nation until attacked and then it will rage. If the terrorists don’t like our retaliatory response, screw them they brought it upon themselves. 5,000 people or more died in these attacks, that is like a year of the United States Military casualties (spelling? I suck at spelling) in one day. Furthermore, in most wars involving the United States less than 5,000 innocents lost their lives. This attack shows the dark side of human nature that people should rightly hate, it isn't unnatural for humans to feel hate when attacked. All the nations should ban together to fight terrorism and make sure that this sort of incident never happens again and I for one would like to thank all the people around the world that pledged to help this fight against terrorism. Human beings should also remember that only select groups of corrupted humans planned these attacks not whole races if Bin Ladin did do it then don’t attack Arabians or Afghans who are totally and completely unconnected with these bombings. I also wish to express all my grievances towards people affected by this attack and to thank all those involved in the rescue efforts! God Bless America! And God Bless the whole World!
P.s. these following people should not be considered as true human beings (in my opinion of course)
Mincemeat
zlatko
angelspit
Rondar
_Isaiah_
p.p.s.
There are also many NG users that don’t get their facts straight and say ill comments towards movies that most of them couldn't even think about making... the fact that these people got this many movies out in such a short time shows how they feel and how hard they worked. I am not a flash producer but I know the time and effort it takes to just make a simple flash slideshow. I also want to stress that if you feel the urge to denounce my opinions remember they are opinions... even the people that type in all caps and swear every other word are just stressing their opinions, but the people I listed above need serious help. Lol I wonder if anyone read to the bottom of this. email-fatmodger@hotmail if you feel that immense urge to contact me!

Beowulfthefallen
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 09:54 PM Reply

I must admit that after hearing that Bin Laden was responsible for those atrocities, I was ready to make Afghanistan into an eternal glowstick, but after seeing that the Afghans aren't the ones who did this, and that they're suffering as we are, that we should help them get back what's rightfully theirs.

Beowulfthefallen
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 10:06 PM Reply

At 9/18/01 09:07 PM, rvyn wrote: Timothy McVeigh killed thousands of Americans a few years ago. If "Bin Laden" represents all the "Afghanistans" then "McVeigh" represents all the "Americans."

Don't you people know that all nukes nowadays are made of rubber? As in if you throw one on someone, someone will throw one back at you.

Afghanistan (and by that I mean the Taliban) already declared that it will attack any country in its perimeter that supports the United States. Meanwhile, the US twists Pakistan's arm and demands access to all their military equipment and operations. Pakistan sides with the US, not just because it's ultimately the right thing to do, but it also knows it's much worse to mess with the US than with Afghanistan.

So now Pakistani will die.

Did you know that Bush refused to sign anti-terrorism legislation in the U.N., which would have allowed terrorists like Bin Laden to be tried in front of a world court? He never thought the US was in danger of terrorism, so he let the rest of the world fend for themselves.

There's a difference between justice and revenge.

You need to get your facts straight. Timothy McVeigh killed 180-some people. I believe it was 187. He was also a ex-militant who went bonkers after seeing what happened at Waco, Texas.
How will Pakistan get attacked by a country with no infrastructure and hardly any military force besides small terrorist groups? By the time the United States gets to the Taliban, they'll be lucky to fight us off, let alone the Pakistanis.
Anti-Terrorism acts? I don't know...seems to ME, that you can't control terrorism...might just be ME though...then there's the fact that killing 5000 people is already illegal, but let's just ignore that fact.
There is a difference between justice and revenge. There's also a difference between fact and fiction.

Beowulfthefallen
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 10:19 PM Reply

You need to get your facts straight. Timothy McVeigh killed 180-some people. I believe it was 187. He was also a ex-militant who went bonkers after seeing what happened at Waco, Texas.
How will Pakistan get attacked by a country with no infrastructure and hardly any military force besides small terrorist groups? By the time the United States gets to the Taliban, they'll be lucky to fight us off, let alone the Pakistanis.
Anti-Terrorism acts? I don't know...seems to ME, that you can't control terrorism...might just be ME though...then there's the fact that killing 5000 people is already illegal, but let's just ignore that fact.
There is a difference between justice and revenge. There's also a difference between fact and fiction.

My mistake, it was actually 168. I was still closer than "1000s"

DUDE4U
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 10:21 PM Reply

I though it over and i believe that we shouldn't bomb all of them. i wish i would be the one to find bin Laden. man that dude is a pain in the mother fuckin ass. i hope we kill him and bomb all of his lil suicide groups too. I think this is a good thing for what america is doing.

BigGorilla
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 10:25 PM Reply

I think we should just bomb it piss on it and leave it Fuck them they killed my brother.

FF8-Fan2000
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Response to Discussion of Current Events Sep. 18th, 2001 @ 10:36 PM Reply

Turn Afghanistan into a parking lot! =D