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At 8/10/04 05:46 AM, antiklaus wrote: I have my own opinions, and they didn't require a 'talk sheet' or a FOX memo for me to form them.

No one has their opinions given to them by the Fox News Channel.

And if you think I agree with Moore on everything, you are "Moore" ignorant than you claim me to be. But attribution of traits is nothing to you. You constantly rely on ad hominem tactics to further your point.

I only said that you would look at Moore's film and wouldn't question it. There is an inherent problem with that.

My only hope is that for every person like you there are two smart people who will look for the truth.

If you cannot attack the point, attack the man.

I did attack the point. You have to look at both sides was my contribution to the thread.

Enforcer - defining ad hominem... since 1984.

I was born in 1982

Everything Moore does is to advance his career. The movie is not a documentary, its propaganda, and people who dont like bush just feed off of his misintepretations. He downplays 9-11, so his movie shouldnt even have that in it. Everything he does, in all of his movie, is take htings out of context to make america look all bad. Every single one, which i think i have seen all of them, he takes things, takes them out of context, makes america seem evil, then turns and gets rich off of it.. Sad society we live in.

At 8/10/04 12:16 PM, Celly07 wrote: Everything he does, in all of his movie, is take htings out of context to make america look all bad.

Finally! Someone else who sees what Michael Moore does.

Sad society we live in.

Indeed.

Ya im pretty sure ive seen them all. I was forced to watch them in government at school... I liked spellbound. It was funny

At 8/10/04 12:18 PM, The_Enforcer wrote:

At 8/10/04 12:16 PM, Celly07 wrote: Everything he does, in all of his movie, is take htings out of context to make america look all bad.

Finally! Someone else who sees what Michael Moore does.

and you chastize me for only seeing one side *cough hypocrite cough*

Sad society we live in.

Indeed.

And you blame me for bashing America?

that cough is coming back again.

At 8/10/04 12:18 PM, The_Enforcer wrote:

At 8/10/04 12:16 PM, Celly07 wrote: Everything he does, in all of his movie, is take htings out of context to make america look all bad.

Finally! Someone else who sees what Michael Moore does.

Sad society we live in.

Indeed.

Heehe...thats because america is bad moron...

t3h people that vote for bush are so ignorant...
ANYONE IS BETTER THEN BUSH

At 8/10/04 11:25 AM, The_Enforcer wrote:

At 8/10/04 05:46 AM, antiklaus wrote: I have my own opinions, and they didn't require a 'talk sheet' or a FOX memo for me to form them.

No one has their opinions given to them by the Fox News Channel.

Then why do people who watch FOX score lower on "knowledge of current events polls" than other news viewers? Unless you are admitting ignorant people watch FOX.

http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Iraq/Media_10_02_03_Report.pdf

I only said that you would look at Moore's film and wouldn't question it. There is an inherent problem with that.

Actually, you said I only look at Moore's opinions. I have CONSTANTLY said that F911 was propoganda. That's 'taking his side?'

My only hope is that for every person like you there are two smart people who will look for the truth.

If you cannot attack the point, attack the man.

I did attack the point. You have to look at both sides was my contribution to the thread.

Oh and calling Wraith an idiot, and implying I am one - that ISN'T a personal attack?

If you really think that, then you are proving yoursef as the idiot.

Enforcer - defining ad hominem... since 1984.

I was born in 1982

Yes, but I added two years for you to learn to speak and to be brainwashed. You weren't born with such idiotic notions, regardless what you'd like us to believe.

So, he makes money off a movie. Good for him. You dont like it, tough, dont see it then, and you can in good conscience say that he hasnt gotten any of your money. I think a little america bashing every now and then is a good thing, as all that patriotism tends to go to our heads. Besides, it can be rather funny sometimes :)

At 8/10/04 09:25 PM, killazz wrote: t3h people that vote for bush are so ignorant...
ANYONE IS BETTER THEN BUSH

can we try to refrain from posting irrelevant quotes like this? Writing 'bush is dumb' or 'kerry is gay' or whatever other things of the sort is the quickest way to make enemies, not to mention attacking whole groups like that.

Is it just me is Moore bigger than he was 10 years ago...When I saw him on Fox News and also on MSNBC standing next to Ron Jr. he looked morbidly obese...I am not going to see that movie at all...but maybe he should do the Jared diet at Subway or the Atkins because his weight is going to cost us money because being obese you end up having health problems all the time...also maybe he should stop making stupid movies and make a movie about how he eats and lives his life...god that guy makes me sick just looking at him...

At 8/10/04 09:35 PM, hbgcompgeekgirl wrote: Is it just me is Moore bigger than he was 10 years ago...

300+ lbs i hear

Oh that's right, fat people have no credability when it comes to politics. In fact lets have everyone who is in shape have their votes count twice.

At 8/10/04 09:40 PM, KirbyMan wrote: Oh that's right, fat people have no credability when it comes to politics. In fact lets have everyone who is in shape have their votes count twice.

how many votes will the anorexics have then? :)

At 8/10/04 09:16 PM, antiklaus wrote: and you chastize me for only seeing one side *cough hypocrite cough*

Again, you're putting words in my mouth. My statement was one of shock and amazement at how another person believes Moore misleads on purpose. I didn't accuse anybody of seeing one side.

And you blame me for bashing America?

I'm not bashing America. America is the best country on Earth. I simply said it saddens me that wanton propaganda is met with open arms by the public. It was met with open arms all around the world when there are clearly untrue statements/positions.

Next time don't pretend to know what I think, instead learn to read what I say and respond to that instead of your assumptions.

At 8/10/04 12:16 PM, Celly07 wrote: Everything Moore does is to advance his career.

Uh, no shit. Thats what everybody does... welcome to capitalism. The reason why it is so bad in Bush's case is because he has been voted into office to represent America and he represents the best interests of only a select few instead.

The movie is not a documentary, its propaganda, and people who dont like bush just feed off of his misintepretations.

The movie is a documentary, albeit a very biased documentary, but what isn't. People who don't like Bush are usually people who have been lied to by Bush and enjoy hearing a more truthful depiction of events.

He downplays 9-11, so his movie shouldnt even have that in it.

No, he makes it pretty prominent. In fact, I'm pretty sure the first 45 minutes of the movie are all about 9/11.

Everything he does, in all of his movie, is take htings out of context to make america look all bad.

Everyone says he is making America look bad, but nobody says anything about how Bush is making America look bad. Senselessly attacking other countries for the first time in America's history is not a favorable action if you want your country to look good. Moore takes very few things out of context, he simply interprets things how he sees them, he shows the facts, and then gives his opinion on why they are relevent and how they have been used to pull the wool over everyone's eyes.

Every single one, which i think i have seen all of them, he takes things, takes them out of context, makes america seem evil, then turns and gets rich off of it.

No, he takes the facts, presents them to the viewer, and then offers his interpretation of events. I think the real anger here is that many of them hit really close to home in terms of the truth.

Sad society we live in.

That is what he's trying to point out and hopefully correct, except half of the people won't give him the time of day with which to do it.

Banning anything because their opinion differs from yours is wrong... If Bill O'Reilly made a film or wrote a book I would support his right to it. Banning entails that you would never give it the time of day and would knowingly discourage other people from supporting that person's cause.

Ryan

I think tha man had alot of good points, with alot of facts to back them up, but he did overlook alot of facts, I mean he said that the coalition had a bunch of unpowerful countries that wouldnt do much in the way of military support, but he did forget to mention Great Britain and Japan. Maybe the man is full of it, but what do you expect from a country that is worked by movies of a fat bush basher who grew up in the ghetto. lol, but bush kind of was a crap president

At 8/11/04 02:10 PM, The_Enforcer wrote: I'm not bashing America. America is the best country on Earth. I simply said it saddens me that wanton propaganda is met with open arms by the public. It was met with open arms all around the world when there are clearly untrue statements/positions.

Does that include wanton propoganda by the right-wing, as well?

At 8/12/04 06:42 AM, bumcheekcity wrote:

At 8/11/04 02:10 PM, The_Enforcer wrote: I'm not bashing America. America is the best country on Earth. I simply said it saddens me that wanton propaganda is met with open arms by the public. It was met with open arms all around the world when there are clearly untrue statements/positions.

Does that include wanton propoganda by the right-wing, as well?

No I dont think it can for enforcer, hes as much a part of the right wind propoganda yellers as he hates it out of the left.

God, isn't it a tad pointless keeping this thread going? I mean, it's been out for over a month now, made $100m in the US - if you want to rant and rave about it now, you have to wait until Oscar night. Or when the DVD is released.

Personnally, I like Moore's projects. I'v read his books, seen his movies, etc. I do think that he can be too extreme for my taste, but that's just me. But when I and my family went to see that movie, they were moved. It's a powerful message. When farenheit is released on DVD, I'll definitely buy it.

all that Moore is a whiny fat guy who always wants attention. Has anyone ever heard of the conspiracy theory about him? He says that he is an Independent how can anyone be so sure? He has yet to show his voter registration information. I always have my voter registration card on me because of all the crazy shit that goes on where I have to for in my district. But thats entirely a different story and people are now getting investigated about it in my district. It all started during the 2000 election. Now back to Moore the more he bashes him the more people are going to get sick of him and won't give a hoot about him. Just look at bashing campaigns. For example, Rendell who is my gov of PA which everyone now hates because he is running the state into the ground and f****ing the state workers and now the state police royally because he hates them because the state police always gives him speeding tickets for going 90+ mph on the PA Turnpike. Well during the last gov race when he was against Mike Fisher and well Fisher was trying to bash Rendell and Rendell was doing the same to him. Well, thats acutally not a good example..OK...better example the Democrat's Primary for the Gov Race in 2002...Rendell was against fellow Democrat Bob Casey Jr. who's dad was Gov for 2 terms. Casey Jr. had a really big Rendell Bashing Campaign and he totally lost the election. People got sick and tired of hearing him complain and not say anything about what he stood for....My point is Moore complains and complains and I am so sick and tired of it. Why doesn't he get off his fat ass and do something instead of just sitting on his ass and eating. To me his weight is high because on how lazy he is. I know there are some people that are genetically overweight and they have been severely overweight since they were children and this guy wasn't. He's just like the majority of overweight Americans who just don't want to work out because it takes too much time and not fun. I was once overweight myself (well, only for 2 years) and I lost the weight by watching what I ate and played tennis, ultimate frisbee, pilates and fitness walking. well I will get off my pedistal right now....

Umm, I think making several award-winning independent films, and writing several books does count as getting off your ass and doing something, right? I mean if he was on his ass watching CNN bitching to himself, that would be nothing, but when you go out of your way to tell everyone about what Bush is doing behind our backs, in order to better America. I mean, what's your definition of doing something, running into the White House with a mini-gun.

P.S. When it comes to state politics, I'll be content the day we throw out Santorum(sp).

At 8/12/04 12:30 PM, hbgcompgeekgirl wrote: all that Moore is a whiny fat guy who always wants attention. Has anyone ever heard of the conspiracy theory about him? He says that he is an Independent how can anyone be so sure? He has yet to show his voter registration information. I always have my voter registration card on me because of all the crazy shit that goes on where I have to for in my district.

Well, let's apply a smidgen of common sense into the bargain, shall we? He obviously isn't a Republican, and attacks the Democrats for being too much like the Republicans... So he's probably not affiliated with either of them.

Note: None of the middle bit made any sense to me. And by the way, USE PARAGRAPHS!

I know there are some people that are genetically overweight and they have been severely overweight since they were children and this guy wasn't. He's just like the majority of overweight Americans who just don't want to work out because it takes too much time and not fun.

When you say 'he' are you talking about Moore? What does his weight have to do with anything?

i dont like moore his movies are all controvercial and most of the stuff is not fact but opinion just like his new movie most of it was created clips to make bush look bad

At 8/12/04 01:08 PM, banjo13 wrote: i dont like moore his movies are all controvercial and most of the stuff is not fact but opinion just like his new movie most of it was created clips to make bush look bad

I feel I should say something, but at least you didn't make some irrelevent comment on his weight.

People who seriously want this movie ban imply don't want to see the flaws ni the system. If you were a bit more open minded, you'd let people who want to see it see it, and just ignore the whole issue.

I saw the movie and I though it was good. Moore hardly ever says something without video footage to back it up, wich in my mind makes it quite a bit more believable.

At 6/29/04 12:22 AM, deepthrought wrote: Call me ignorant if you will but i for one will not EVER see ferenheit 9/11 because all Moore is interested in is furthering his career and not telling the truth. I am a conservative so you might think of course i will not see it but i beg all others who are disgusted not to see the movie. If you want to go just to see what its like or simply to yell at the screen, dont!!!

If you goto the movie you are just putting more money in his socialist pocket, makeing him believe that his films are good and that he should continue to bend the truth to hiw own whims, please all stand with me and ban 9/11.

So are you saying Bush didn't want to go to war? Dude, Farenheit 9/11 may be presented in a way that slants it against Bush, but everything in it is true. Don't bitch about it being slanted either, becuase the mainstream TV news slants things in Bush's favor all the time. The fact that Moore is making money from it isn't the point. Bush is making money for being pres., but you aren't bitching about that (the main point is that EVERYONE does what they do to make money, not just Moore).

Also, widely known but mostly ignored fact: Fahrenheit 9/11 won the Palme d'or at the Cannes film festival, wich is no small feat. Surely, such a biased peiece of slander must have done something right, don't you think?