What do you think of the idea of giving characters a guard/block ability in 2D side-scrolling games?
Do you think this is a good idea or do you think damage prevention should strictly be from evading?
Examples of side-scrolling game with guarding is Shinobi III and Odin Sphere.
i dont know anyone who blocks in any game
At 1/13/17 01:12 PM, NightRaid-NG wrote: i dont know anyone who blocks in any game
You don't know any players who would do that or you're not aware that some side-scrolling games have a guard/block function?
I think Robocop for the NES also has a guard function.
At 1/16/17 02:13 AM, Goldsickle wrote:At 1/13/17 01:12 PM, NightRaid-NG wrote: i dont know anyone who blocks in any gameYou don't know any players who would do that or you're not aware that some side-scrolling games have a guard/block function?
I think Robocop for the NES also has a guard function.
Don't know any players that do that
At 1/13/17 11:53 AM, Goldsickle wrote: What do you think of the idea of giving characters a guard/block ability in 2D side-scrolling games?
Do you think this is a good idea or do you think damage prevention should strictly be from evading?
Examples of side-scrolling game with guarding is Shinobi III and Odin Sphere.
The game I've been working on with JohnnyUtah and Spazkid has a blocking ability, where you take some grey damage that can heal (but gets lost if you take real damage). There are moments where it's the best option against enemy bullet spam and also some opportunities where you use it to make an enemy vulnerable. I think overall it's been a nice addition, although overall we have been risking giving the characters too many abilities vs making people work with constraints.
At 1/16/17 10:38 AM, TomFulp wrote: The game I've been working on with JohnnyUtah and Spazkid has a blocking ability, where you take some grey damage that can heal (but gets lost if you take real damage). There are moments where it's the best option against enemy bullet spam and also some opportunities where you use it to make an enemy vulnerable. I think overall it's been a nice addition, although overall we have been risking giving the characters too many abilities vs making people work with constraints.
That can be balanced.
You could introduce attacks that can't be blocked or have some sort of properties, like certain attacks stagger you or some attacks are parry-only.
But going this path means doing a lot more work into the combat mechanics and you will need to do extra animations like guards, parry, staggers and so forth.
I have a game that was incomplete but playable, meaning you can actually see these functions in action.
The player character in my game can guard and parry attacks.
Parrying can be used to nullify "unblockable" attacks or stagger enemies for a critical hit.
But if you keep attacking a guarding enemy, they can parry back too.
At 1/17/17 05:42 AM, Goldsickle wrote: You could introduce attacks that can't be blocked or have some sort of properties, like certain attacks stagger you or some attacks are parry-only.
In our game, bullets make your shield shake but melee attacks push you back some while you continue to block. It's assumed that anything larger than your character is unblockable... It's been tempting at times to color-code enemy attacks so you can better anticipate what type they are but haven't gone that route so far. We need to create some situations where blocking opens a good opportunity to counter-attack and maybe consider a specific counter attack move that could come out of a push-back block.
I wasn't intending to come in and plug the supporter upgrade but anyone with supporter access can check out Pixel Puncher, an unfinished project I was working on with MindChamber:
It has a parry move, like Street Fighter where you press towards the attack (try it with bullets) right before it hits you.
I think Kirby did that in a few games right?
Sig by @Brokendeck
At 1/17/17 08:56 AM, TomFulp wrote: In our game, bullets make your shield shake but melee attacks push you back some while you continue to block. It's assumed that anything larger than your character is unblockable... It's been tempting at times to color-code enemy attacks so you can better anticipate what type they are but haven't gone that route so far. We need to create some situations where blocking opens a good opportunity to counter-attack and maybe consider a specific counter attack move that could come out of a push-back block.
In Metal Gear Rising, anytime an enemy unleashes an attack that can't be blocked, they glow yellow.
Is that what you mean by color-coding?
In Onimusha, you can block attacks from light enemies to halt their slash combos and actually make them stagger a teeny bit (but not enough to trigger Critical opportunities).
But if you try to block a heavy attack (such as a giant axe or a diving slash), your character will be pushed backwards.
Your character will not be damaged by the staggering but you won't be able to guard in that state.
Some enemies will team up where one staggers you and the others do follow-up attacks.
So you will need to know when to block and when to evade.
Yeah, I can't view your work-in-progress because I'm not a Supporter.
I dunno about pressing forward a la Street Fighter III for parrying.
I have never actually played SFIII.
In the game I made, you press the guard button the same time the attack is about to hit you:
At 1/17/17 09:06 AM, Hoodie wrote:
does the various shields megaman can get count as blocking
I see those as "sub-weapons", since you actually use ammunition to power it.
You can damage/destroy enemies with it, so it's really more of an attack with a pattern that envelopes you.
At 1/17/17 12:31 PM, Goldsickle wrote: Yeah, I can't view your work-in-progress because I'm not a Supporter.
I gave you honorary supporter status for the month so you can check it out:
This game has been postponed indefinitely. There's actually more than in this demo but I need to fix a broken area to connect it to the final boss fight. One of these days :P
At 1/17/17 11:19 AM, Wegra wrote: I think Kirby did that in a few games right?
kirby superstar has a guard ability but it doesn't defend against elemental damage or an enemy grabbing you.
Birds Born in a cage think Flying is an illness - Alejandro Jodorowsky
At 1/17/17 02:12 PM, TomFulp wrote:At 1/17/17 12:31 PM, Goldsickle wrote: Yeah, I can't view your work-in-progress because I'm not a Supporter.I gave you honorary supporter status for the month so you can check it out:
This has way too much potential to end up a cancelled project.
I know games getting cancelled at 60%-80% is the norm in the industry but hopefully you can pick it up again.
One weakness about parrying in both of our games is how you can just mash a button to trigger it.
I just simply mashed towards the enemy and was able to get a parry in most of the time.
Same problems occur even in popular games like Metal Gear Rising or Bayonetta.
I think I have some sort of solution to cut down on the habit of button-mashing to parry but it will require an actual "guard" function.
I tested as much as I can and I see effort here and there.
You even implemented launchers to knock enemies into the air.
Parrying doesn't just stagger the enemies but disarms the "Hemphogs".
When I encounter a boss, I was able to deflect its energy wave back at it.
Was that supposed to instantly kill the boss?
Keep up the effort.
If anyone else makes side-scrolling games, it's always the same old "get damaged from touching the enemies" and "you can only shoot left and right" retro stuff.
At 1/17/17 03:43 PM, Goldsickle wrote: I tested as much as I can and I see effort here and there.
You even implemented launchers to knock enemies into the air.
Parrying doesn't just stagger the enemies but disarms the "Hemphogs".
Had been tinkering with idea of grabbing their gun and using it after disarming them.
When I encounter a boss, I was able to deflect its energy wave back at it.
Was that supposed to instantly kill the boss?
I forget if that's just him having low health for testing but parrying is meant to be pretty rewarding so it does a lot of damage when you knock a bullet back.
Keep up the effort.
If anyone else makes side-scrolling games, it's always the same old "get damaged from touching the enemies" and "you can only shoot left and right" retro stuff.
The game I've been working on for the past four years has a lot of gameplay similarities to Pixel Puncher. Will likely be doing an official reveal in the next six months, at which point there might be some video and fun stuff.
