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Trump skeptic. CMV.

713 Views | 14 Replies

Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-15 21:02:11


Okay, so there is a very good chance that Trump will get the GOP nomination. We all know that.

Some of the policy positions he has laid out seem all well and good, but would he actually be able to implement any of them? For that matter, what indications are there that he would be a good president and not a complete kook?

I know some of you folks are Trump supporters. So, in all honesty, I ask: why do you support Trump, and what makes you think he can accomplish any of what he wants to?

At this point, I am undecided. I was a Rubio supporter, and asking me to pick my favorite Democratic candidate is like asking me to pick my favorite STD. I have no idea what I'll do in the general.

Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-15 21:24:56


I'm having a hard time understanding why this should be it's own separate topic and not folded into the general discussion of Trump, where at least SOME of what you're talking about is being covered....I'm not saying I'm going to lock and re-direct just yet as I think very narrowly focused "one issue" type topics about Trump are ok and it's more useful to have them out of the main glut. I'm asking you to help me see how this fits that definition. Thanks.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-15 22:56:34


At 3/15/16 09:02 PM, RydiaLockheart wrote: I know some of you folks are Trump supporters. So, in all honesty, I ask: why do you support Trump, and what makes you think he can accomplish any of what he wants to?

I'm not a Trump supporter myself, but a lot of my family are, even over Kasich who they generally view quite favorably. Part of the reason is {and why Trump has so much support among the blue-collar Republicans and the undecided} is that he is able to speak to the zeitgeist of the average Joe who felt that Obama let them down during his tenure and considering that there is a degree of political correctness in our society {even if it is overblown hoopla} they view it as refreshing that a candidate not only acknowledges this, but seems to revel in being as blunt as possible.

Of course, the caveat is that my family are about as interested, let alone about as knowledgeable of politics in general as I am with Greek mythology. It's mostly just bits and pieces of it at best and they don't really have much of a party loyalty as much as it is seeing whichever candidate they can see relate to them to some level, most of my family voted for Obama just on that concept alone.

At this point, I am undecided. I was a Rubio supporter, and asking me to pick my favorite Democratic candidate is like asking me to pick my favorite STD. I have no idea what I'll do in the general.

For all the rifts that the GOP has, this might just be the best opportunity at getting a Republican president in. The Democratic candidates are just so unappealing on many different levels, it's hard to see them being elected President with what they have to offer and what their track records have. Push comes to shove, I would rather take my chances with Hilary hoping that she would be Obama lite over Sanders and his rather naive and Sisyphean policies, and a support base of folks which seems to revel in what he says and not how it is going to be implemented, which is being kind to say the least.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-16 19:34:29


At 3/16/16 04:39 PM, X-Gary-Gigax-X wrote: Obviously, Trump is already literally worse than Hitler. Just listen to the media.

That's a cop out. Trump so far does draw parallels between other dictators and totalitarian rulers, he certainly has no respect for at least the First Amendment (except for when it applies to him and his supporters). He also runs on a platform of targeting "enemies" of the nation that run along remarkably racial lines. These are the actions of a demagogue, and of someone with some pretty severe personality disorders (a narcissist for instance). Literally worse then Hitler? Nah, clearly not, he's not Hitler or Stalin or any of those guys yet, that's pretty clear. But Hitler and Stalin weren't Hitler and Stalin either until their respective people gave them the chance to be.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-16 21:26:15


At 3/15/16 09:24 PM, aviewaskewed wrote: I'm having a hard time understanding why this should be it's own separate topic and not folded into the general discussion of Trump, where at least SOME of what you're talking about is being covered....I'm not saying I'm going to lock and re-direct just yet as I think very narrowly focused "one issue" type topics about Trump are ok and it's more useful to have them out of the main glut. I'm asking you to help me see how this fits that definition. Thanks.

I thought about that two hours after I hit the "submit" button. Go figure.

But what was on my mind is I wanted to hear it from supporters, or any rational thoughts on why one would support him without everyone screaming about racism and whatnot. That, and I was afraid of losing any discussion in there to all the memes and other crosstalk that's been going on.

Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-16 21:39:23


At 3/16/16 09:26 PM, RydiaLockheart wrote: But what was on my mind is I wanted to hear it from supporters, or any rational thoughts on why one would support him without everyone screaming about racism and whatnot. That, and I was afraid of losing any discussion in there to all the memes and other crosstalk that's been going on.

Looking at it again today, and seeing how the two threads are progressing, I agree with you. I think this is generating different enough discussion, and achieving an objective that isn't really suited for the catchall and isn't overlapping with it. So far so good, I'll let it roll for now.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-17 19:25:02


At 3/15/16 10:56 PM, orangebomb wrote: I'm not a Trump supporter myself, but a lot of my family are, even over Kasich who they generally view quite favorably. Part of the reason is {and why Trump has so much support among the blue-collar Republicans and the undecided} is that he is able to speak to the zeitgeist of the average Joe who felt that Obama let them down during his tenure and considering that there is a degree of political correctness in our society {even if it is overblown hoopla} they view it as refreshing that a candidate not only acknowledges this, but seems to revel in being as blunt as possible.

I think we're seeing the rise of the Reagan Democrat again for this reason. Hell, my mom the lifelong Democrat is seriously interested in Trump. Part of it is because Hillary and Bernie are so far to the left now they are alienating a lot of moderate liberals/Democrats. And 1/3 of the country is not going to just sit there and let the leftists keep insulting them. I think we're seeing a voter revolt on the Dem side, but I don't know how much of that is due to Trump. That's more of a long-term study.

For all the rifts that the GOP has, this might just be the best opportunity at getting a Republican president in. The Democratic candidates are just so unappealing on many different levels, it's hard to see them being elected President with what they have to offer and what their track records have. Push comes to shove, I would rather take my chances with Hilary hoping that she would be Obama lite over Sanders and his rather naive and Sisyphean policies, and a support base of folks which seems to revel in what he says and not how it is going to be implemented, which is being kind to say the least.

That, and a lot of Bernie supporters will a) vote for Trump if Bernie doesn't get the nomination (I have heard this more than once), b) stay home, or c) write in Bernie. The Democrats would be in much better shape if Hillary wasn't such a terrible candidate. She routinely insults the people she needs support from (e.g. Hispandering, the whole emoji thing) when she already has more baggage than Southwest Airlines.

Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 10:17:14


At 3/18/16 06:11 AM, zornuzkull wrote: Either way a change is what people were promised under the Obama administration...
They didn't get it so now they will whatever the cost...

Remember though, a change can also be a change for the worse.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 18:17:38


Trump's rise in politics is inherently reactionary -- it's a response to the complete and total failure of the Republican party to do anything for their constituents to any meaningful degree. Nobody needs a reason to support Trump other than "the GOP failed me." which it has. It's their fault. The people aren't wrong.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 18:30:46


At 3/18/16 06:17 PM, Feoric wrote: Trump's rise in politics is inherently reactionary -- it's a response to the complete and total failure of the Republican party to do anything for their constituents to any meaningful degree. Nobody needs a reason to support Trump other than "the GOP failed me." which it has. It's their fault. The people aren't wrong.

I think it's also a result of what FOX News and it's ilk have done to shape party thought and the definition of "conservative" they've put out there. They've brought so much vitrial and viciousness into the mainstream that this is why when Trump says the kind of things he does people aren't shocked and actually go along with it. The mistakes, the back room deals, the value compromises....all of that is what laid the groundwork for candidate Trump. But in the end, I don't think it's enough to sway a general election, I really don't. I think "Hold your nose for Hillary" is going to be the defacto move for most people.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 18:45:43


The relationship between conservative media outlets and Trump is an example of a self-fulfilling prophecy -- they've pushed an anti-media/anti-elite narrative for so long that conservatives collectively do not trust any outlet anymore, not even Fox. Not even fucking Breitbart. This is why Trump's anti-media platform is so popular and sells so well -- he's the end result of that rhetoric festering in conjunction with the GOP failing to pass any sort of conservative agenda during Obama's entire tenure.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 19:26:00


At 3/18/16 06:30 PM, aviewaskewed wrote: But in the end, I don't think it's enough to sway a general election, I really don't. I think "Hold your nose for Hillary" is going to be the defacto move for most people.

You would think, and I hope your right. Hopefully the 33% of Sanders supporters get their heads out of their asses if he loses. If that many Democrats and Independents refuse to vote Hillary (or actually vote Trump, which some actually are considering), Hillary will be destroyed in the general. It will become a basic Republican vs Democrat battle in the end, demographic-wise, and getting your base to turn up is pretty much the only way to win that (the country is still split nearly in half still, politically). Republicans are showing more the hold-your-nose attitude than Democrats, so far from my basic observation (which admittedly isn't perfect), so it's not nearly as clear that she'd win as some people say.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 19:34:09


At 3/18/16 07:26 PM, Gario wrote: You would think, and I hope your right. Hopefully the 33% of Sanders supporters get their heads out of their asses if he loses. If that many Democrats and Independents refuse to vote Hillary (or actually vote Trump, which some actually are considering), Hillary will be destroyed in the general. It will become a basic Republican vs Democrat battle in the end, demographic-wise, and getting your base to turn up is pretty much the only way to win that (the country is still split nearly in half still, politically). Republicans are showing more the hold-your-nose attitude than Democrats, so far from my basic observation (which admittedly isn't perfect), so it's not nearly as clear that she'd win as some people say.

Respected polls have said for awhile Trump loses. Yes, some things have defied the rules....but there's only a couple cases so far where the same outlets' polls were massively wrong. I also think there is a strong "anti-Trump" wave that would show up and just vote for whoever and whatever isn't him. It's a crazy election cycle for sure, and we're seeing some real anger and shit bubble up....but interestingly enough I've been reading a book of Hunter S. Thompson's letters for a couple weeks now, and it's interesting to see the parallels towards the end of the 60's and what he was doing personally with his "Freak Power" campaigns in Aspen in the early 70's. I think this is a similar anger and revolt....but I think now, like then, as the dust settles, things will cool down and it'll be more like business as usual come November.


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Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-18 22:05:46


At 3/18/16 11:49 AM, gumOnShoe wrote: 5. Trump has claimed on many occasions that he could shoot someone in the street and still win the election.

I think that was commentary on how crazily loyal some of his supporters are.

Response to Trump skeptic. CMV. 2016-03-19 12:54:30


At 3/15/16 09:02 PM, RydiaLockheart wrote: So, in all honesty, I ask: why do you support Trump, and what makes you think he can accomplish any of what he wants to?

;;;
Even though i have no vote, I see trump as the only Candidate that isn't a pawn of the Banking elite. Not that he may not be friends/acquaintances of them....but he sure doesn't seem 100% bought & paid for by them.

Can he keep his promises, probably no better than Obama did. Your system seems set up so that everyone at the top takes care of themselves , everyone else ...pays for them.

2ndly , If the choices were Trump or Clinton I'd leave Canada & happily volunteer to work for Trump for free. Clinton is loyal to the People of Clinton & as for America & Americans, the self centred B!+(# would make sure you'd all be dead before she do anything for your betterment, especially if it meant , oh she might have to take an extra step or move her pinky finger unwillingly...she'd cook you all first.

I think you'd all be better off with George DubYa, again than her !


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