"Mixing is Cheating"

[Kwing]

"It's so artificial and inorganic."
"You do realize EQing is supposed to make up for errors in the recording equipment itself, right?"
"I have a Master's degree in music and I've been a musician for 40 years, I know what I'm talking about. What's EQing? You shouldn't have to EQ good music."
"We might as well put on all plays and musicals with natural light, then. We don't need spotlights, they're just cheating."

It took me a sizable chunk of time to convince this person that amplifying music digitally does nothing to audio quality unless it begins clipping. Is there any hope of reasoning?

[Phonometrologist]

At 7/25/15 10:35 AM, Kwing wrote: "It's so artificial and inorganic."
"You do realize EQing is supposed to make up for errors in the recording equipment itself, right?"
"I have a Master's degree in music and I've been a musician for 40 years, I know what I'm talking about. What's EQing? You shouldn't have to EQ good music."
"We might as well put on all plays and musicals with natural light, then. We don't need spotlights, they're just cheating."

It took me a sizable chunk of time to convince this person that amplifying music digitally does nothing to audio quality unless it begins clipping. Is there any hope of reasoning?

That was a fun read.
But it was merely that as I can recognize rhetorical reductionism when I see it. The EQ is a tool just like music theory could also be considered as another piece in part of a tool belt.

[Oakwood]

This makes me cringe so badly.

[samulis]

At 7/25/15 11:15 AM, LiquidOoze wrote: This makes me cringe so badly.

Second'd. Thank you for sharing what he said, but not sharing his e-mail address... if he even has one... XD

I don't think there's been a top 100 song in any genre in the last 40 years that didn't make use of EQ, and that's across the board. Whatever this guy is smoking, I don't want it!

[Troisnyx]

40 years qualified + music diploma =/= jack, when it comes to musical application. I think a lot of us here on NG have seen that first-hand. Perhaps he needs to be told by someone less qualified but more experienced than he!

[thebitterroost]

At 7/25/15 11:29 AM, samulis wrote:

:Thank you for sharing what he said, but not sharing his e-mail address... if he even has one... XD

lol

We all know that any *real* communication happens solely through pen and paper. E-mail and text is just so flat and inorganic, it saps all the *life* and *soul* out of what you're trying to say. Analog print is the only way.

[samulis]

At 7/25/15 01:36 PM, thebitterroost wrote:

At 7/25/15 11:29 AM, samulis wrote: Thank you for sharing what he said, but not sharing his e-mail address... if he even has one... XD

lol

We all know that any *real* communication happens solely through pen and paper. E-mail and text is just so flat and inorganic, it saps all the *life* and *soul* out of what you're trying to say. Analog print is the only way.

What are you talking about? Didn't you hear about this new thing called "The Telegram"? THAT'S the way to go man... it's like having the person in the room next to you! I've been pretending to know shit for an imaginary 40 years and that's the only way I ever communicate with other people. That silly "telephone" thing is such a passing phase...

[thebitterroost]

At 7/25/15 10:35 AM, Kwing wrote: Is there any hope of reasoning?

Short answer: no.

People who fancy themselves as "purists" in whatever fashion have a mental blockade against alternative ideas. This guy is a little over the top, even for their like. I know several guys who have the "if it wasn't recorded on 2" tape, it ain't real music" attitude, but even they allow not only mixing, but (gasp!) punch-ins.

[samulis]

People who fancy themselves as "purists" in whatever fashion have a mental blockade against alternative ideas. This guy is a little over the top, even for their like. I know several guys who have the "if it wasn't recorded on 2" tape, it ain't real music" attitude, but even they allow not only mixing, but (gasp!) punch-ins.

Yeah man, if my music isn't full of noise, hiss, artifacts, and have a maximum frequency range of 17 kHz, I'm not happy either! I think I'll just have to start doing 32kHz/8-bit to fix that...

[DL2Electron]

At 7/25/15 10:35 AM, Kwing wrote:

is there any hope of reasoning?

You pretty much have the about same hope as reasoning with someone who believes the moon landings never happened.

[MetalRenard]

I lol'd.

[TheBetterAudioPortal]

He's right though.

[Daru925]

Noise and random outside sounds like train vibration, earthquake, someone doing ring modulation in the toilet...
All those wonderful things picked up by mic while recording...
Its not unwanted, its a feature! nO NEED TO EQ!

[YukkiHonoka]

I am done! I am just done. XD
Can't even.

[sorohanro]

The EQ started as a correction for flaws in the telephone system equipment, so, form a point of view, the music purist is sort of right.
Also, many big names in the music production get the results they want with the microphone choice, preamp choice and microphone placement, but to do that you need a really professional studio, a collection of 30+ microphones and similar collection of preamps. But that's also EQing, because different membrane size picks up different frequencies, so that's EQing, different circuits in the microphone have different frequency curve, so that's EQing too, different preamp has more or less "color", which translates into a different spectral response, which is also EQing.

Long story, each aspect he rants about can have sort of a reason behind, but short story, he is an idiot.

[satanicpotatoe]

I have some friends into classical music who even consider that home recording a performance via youtube is a shame.
There is a really different approach according the "academic" music compared to modern artists. They just don't adapt to the nowadays reality. It's like people who don't have computers, you can adapt but it's an archaic way of life.

I think we must respect the roots and the reason why they think we should not EQ and "cheat" a classical performance but there's a whole industry based on mixing techniques since the 80s (there is a good movie called Sound City you should watch, it's done by Dave Grohl who buyed a Neve console).

Since this person might be really focused on traditionnal ways, it sounds more like an artistic taste.
It's like those who consider that Andy Warhol was not an artist by painting those Campbell soup cans ;)

[sorohanro]

Playing music through speakers is an abomination, because each speaker has a different spectral response, so that's EQing.
Heck, playing music in a room is also an abomination, because each room, each concert hall or church has their own spectral response, and that's EQing.
Music should be played exclusively in anechoic environment, perfectly anechoic natural. That;s possible only in space, but the astronaut costumes might interfere with both playing and resonance, so, I propose that those (idiotically) purists get their chance to perform and listen to music like this, in space without costumes.

[Noisysundae]

At 7/30/15 12:46 PM, sorohanro wrote: ...in space without costumes.

False! If you do that, there will be no sound at all and you're dead. :P

[sorohanro]

At 7/30/15 08:10 PM, Noisysundae wrote:

At 7/30/15 12:46 PM, sorohanro wrote: ...in space without costumes.

False! If you do that, there will be no sound at all and you're dead. :P

Details, details. You can't have "the good stuff" without a minimal sacrifice or effort. All the good art is a result of sweat, tears and very often even blood. All the rest is "cheating".

Now, please, let's stop talking online about this. This is cheating too. I mean, we use fonts and colors we didn't designed, and doesn't represent our own voice, which passes through our mouth which apply a formant filter (tongue, teeth, cheeks, lips), which is actually EQing... which is cheating... On a second thought, yes, let's write about it, it's less "cheaty".

[sorohanro]

At 7/31/15 10:16 AM, Seprix wrote: My grandpappy bought that soundwave in 1923, when they sold it to pay for the Grand Second War, and people have been using it without my express consent.

Pffff 143kHz is for amateurs. We use the more natural tuning to A=432kHz, so will use probably just 142kHz, not 143. It's all based on cymatics.