I have been making music for a long time... Ever since i have figured out how to record music in my house i have had mixed emotions about it. I am not rich and i cannot afford a $1000 setup, so comes the problem at hand.

I have read and watched hundreds of articles and videos on recording/mastering which is why my music is not 100% horrible sounding, BUT i can just never seem to achieve that perfect sound i try to fight for. Sometimes i want to throw my computer through a window and other times i get so irritated i just give up on writing music for the day period. All i want is to get that full phat sound like there's a orchestra in my recording area... is that so much to ask? :D

Anyone else feel this way or am i that guy?

Know what you have, your own limits and the limits of what your current setup can achieve. Use this as a strength instead of a weakness.

You can't write super-realisic orchestral music because you don't have super smarty pants VSTis and a realistic convolution reverb plugin? OK. Then OWN IT. Make semi-realistic orchestral music with an electronic feel and call it your own. Some incredible music was born because the artist only had 4 tracks available and a VERY limited soundbank, just look at old game soundtracks.
Creativity is often born when we strive to smash and break the boundaries that hold us. Perhaps you won't achieve your original goal but you will find some solace in knowing you are unique.

At 5/25/15 08:28 AM, MetalRenard wrote: Know what you have, your own limits and the limits of what your current setup can achieve. Use this as a strength instead of a weakness.

This is wonderful advice. Seconded.

Less is more, remember

At 5/25/15 08:28 AM, MetalRenard wrote: Creativity is often born when we strive to smash and break the boundaries that hold us. Perhaps you won't achieve your original goal but you will find some solace in knowing you are unique.

some very sound advice sir. i may use that theory in the future.

I think you are that guy, but a bunch of people are also that guy, lol.

Mastering is something you learn over time from doing it over and over again.
Personally, when I started making beats, I had to google a bunch of tutorials to even learn how to use FLS, along with a bunch of tuts for mastering kicks, snares, loops, ect.

The first year I made beats, I didnt even upload them to NG because I thought they were just straight shit, lol.
After a year of messing with FLS and mastering different beats, using a multitude of techniques, I finally feel like I am making decent music.

I would just say, practice and practice even more. Watching tutorials on youtube or googling tutorials can be really helpful too. Even if you already know how to do something, watching a tutorial can give you information that you didnt know before even if you are comfortable doing something.

Youll eventually get it man, just keep working on it. :D

At 5/25/15 05:34 AM, XxCowMeatxX wrote: I have read and watched hundreds of articles and videos on recording/mastering which is why my music is not 100% horrible sounding, BUT i can just never seem to achieve that perfect sound i try to fight for. Sometimes i want to throw my computer through a window and other times i get so irritated i just give up on writing music for the day period. All i want is to get that full phat sound like there's a orchestra in my recording area... is that so much to ask? :D

maybe, instead of watching countless videos and tutorials on how to make phat beats you should just experiment. overtime you will find out what you like and what you don't. watching videos helps no one dude. you're obviously not going to be a pro overnight but you will learn much faster.

At 5/25/15 04:35 PM, w00tw00 wrote: maybe, instead of watching countless videos and tutorials on how to make phat beats you should just experiment. overtime you will find out what you like and what you don't. watching videos helps no one dude. you're obviously not going to be a pro overnight but you will learn much faster.

What the hell? lol
Watch tons of videos, read a thousand and one blogs, create a circle of useful people around you like industry professionals with real world experience who are willing to give genuine, constructive feedback, experiment with everything you hear about, cut through the bullshit people spout (pseudo science about a certain type of cable etc) and practice, practice, practice until your ears bleed.

But how do you start any of that without research, w00tw00? The untrained ear can't tell shit from gold.

At 5/25/15 05:03 PM, MetalRenard wrote:

At 5/25/15 04:35 PM, w00tw00 wrote: maybe, instead of watching countless videos and tutorials on how to make phat beats you should just experiment. overtime you will find out what you like and what you don't. watching videos helps no one dude. you're obviously not going to be a pro overnight but you will learn much faster.

What the hell? lol
Watch tons of videos, read a thousand and one blogs, create a circle of useful people around you like industry professionals with real world experience who are willing to give genuine, constructive feedback, experiment with everything you hear about, cut through the bullshit people spout (pseudo science about a certain type of cable etc) and practice, practice, practice until your ears bleed.

But how do you start any of that without research, w00tw00? The untrained ear can't tell shit from gold.

lets be honest, those "how 2 make skrillex base" videos are dreadful and a huge reason why there's a massively oversaturated amateur edm market. there's only so far you can get by reading about mixing or hearing it through youtube's shitty flv codec, and i'm constantly surprised by what "trained" ears think is "gold"

First an example of my work. So I'll be talking about my experience in mixing down dance music, some of my advice may apply to your style though.

• 

  Don't Bother Listening

  by TheBetterAudioPortal

  It's Shit.

  Song

  Dance

  2,110 Views

  PLAY

1.
Using multiband compressors, give yourself a few attempts. Export the track and leave it a while. When you go back to listening to it and you don't like something, try again with different settings, compare your old attempt to your new attempt and see if you like or dislike the changes you've made. This step is important because sometimes you might fuck something up and not notice.

2.
Really important to be using a good pair of monitors (price range of ~£200) and/or headphones (price range of ~£100) to hear what you are doing. Use a free plugin called SPAN. Learn how to use it to compare your track to a track in the same style you really like, then try and EQ your track it until the frequency spectrum matches their track.

3.
Getting a good mixdown is something really tricky to get down. Remember to trust your ears, but help them by using other tracks as references. The most prevalent thing in any mix should be the drums. Sidechaining is a good method for this. Don't go overboard with it as it will make your track sound like shit if the release is too long or the velocity is too high.

4.
Achieving a loud mix may be ideal but avoid making your master sound like shit by over compressing or over saturateing the master. It's not worth the loudness.

5.
You need to stop cutting the mids so much on your guitars.

6.
Read the first letter on tip 1 to 5.

At 5/25/15 09:36 PM, TheBetterAudioPortal wrote:
Read the first letter on tip 1 to 5.

forget this guy

use soundgoodizers and 5 compressors on your master

your track will be gold !

At 5/25/15 06:47 PM, midimachine wrote: lets be honest, those "how 2 make skrillex base" videos are dreadful and a huge reason why there's a massively oversaturated amateur edm market. there's only so far you can get by reading about mixing or hearing it through youtube's shitty flv codec, and i'm constantly surprised by what "trained" ears think is "gold"

Yep. Avoid any "how to sound like..." videos, they'll ruin you. Why sound like someone else? At the same time there are plenty of useful videos out there, you just have to choose carefully. For example, rather than that, be more specific - pick the genre you want to work on, the instrument specifically and then watch a few different videos and read a few blogs about it before making up your mind. People disagree all the time, it's up to you to find what works best and it will take years to get good.
Dedication! :)
I don't care much for your last statement, so whatever.

At 5/25/15 07:03 PM, Lich wrote: Waves One-Knob absolutely everything!

But no seriously, I made a list of decent free plugins awhile back this year to help people use & abuse different FX, Mixing and Mastering VST's for thir unlimited leisure. It might be beneficial to run through with some of these and see if you get better result:

http://www.newgrounds.com/bbs/topic/1381985

oooo thanks man! I am always up for trying a new vst. ill mess around with those for sure.

I'd just like to second the guy who emphasized experimentation. You really don't learn the logic behind the processes until you do it wrong and recognize techniques that aren't popular in the industry yet. I don't use crap like soundgoodizer or compressors anymore. I just do the following steps in a non-negotiable order:
Sample volumization
Exciter+calibration
Finetune/Sync
Reconfigure EQ
Duplicate track and create track group
Experiment with dysphonic FX, (Distortion, Reverb, Phaser, Ringmod), apply separately depending on note frequency
Filters, start with HP+LP and work to a series of Band Stops
Add velocity trackers or signal followers to every effect
Reconfigure EQ
Apply and finely calibrate Gate Limiter
Mix all tracks' electrical signals to match peaks
Set delays
Reconfigure EQ
Redo Gate limiter

Also, I copy every sample and choose to process FX, then invert phase and hear what just the difference sounds like. Every action taken produces a unique result, and if you do it out of order, you'll get musical mud. Add some compost and you've got musical mulch. Once you see it as a tree of techniques, you'll see the spirit grow it's plume :)

At 5/25/15 09:12 AM, UserSigon wrote: Less is more, remember

This, a thousand times over. The smallest changes make the largest impact on a track; a tiny bit of reverb, a slight amount of ducking on an EQ frequency, etc. I try to make as little change as possible while still striving for the "sound" that I want. Every plugin and filter will degrade the audio signal very slightly, until it sounds like you're hearing someone whispering in a can, or shouting in a metal dumpster.

Listen to your track through as many types of monitor as possible; little headphones, big headphones, active surround headphones, computer speakers, home theater systems, car speakers, and take notes before you start mastering. Perhaps what you're hearing is really a deficiency in the monitor; some won't produce the lowest frequencies very well, some will struggle with higher frequencies. Small speakers will typically sound "tinny", but speakers that are too large will distribute the sound too widely which can also cause audio distortions.

I can't remember who exactly, but I think it was Jerry Garcia that said "if it sounds good really quiet, it will sound good really loud", and that's generally true. It's also indicative of the way that you have to approach mastering, it's a process of experimentation.

Also, this:

At 5/25/15 08:28 AM, MetalRenard wrote: Know what you have, your own limits and the limits of what your current setup can achieve. Use this as a strength instead of a weakness.

This is at the very heart and core of art theory. He's right on the money with this post.

At 5/27/15 02:05 PM, RubberBandMethod wrote: Every plugin and filter will degrade the audio signal very slightly

You pulled this out of your arse.

At 5/29/15 05:24 PM, TheBetterAudioPortal wrote:

At 5/27/15 02:05 PM, RubberBandMethod wrote: Every plugin and filter will degrade the audio signal very slightly

You pulled this out of your arse.

I could see a filter doing that because that's the whole point, but a plugin degrading the audio signal, seriously?

At 5/29/15 05:28 PM, Troisnyx wrote:

At 5/29/15 05:24 PM, TheBetterAudioPortal wrote:

At 5/27/15 02:05 PM, RubberBandMethod wrote: Every plugin and filter will degrade the audio signal very slightly

You pulled this out of your arse.

I could see a filter doing that because that's the whole point, but a plugin degrading the audio signal, seriously?

Maybe I didn't say that the right way; it won't effect your original audio signal the way a filter would. When you apply a filter to your audio file there's no going back unless you have a backup copy of the original. Plugins are processed and can be altered in real time, so it's not altering your original audio signal. It can, however, degrade the audio output signal if used incorrectly. Compressers, de-essers, and noise gates are essentially designed to 'degrade' audio, but they do so in controlled conditions, in order to produce desired results. Plugins will also use up more memory, which can slow down your playback engine (only really need to worry about this if you are doing live performance from a computer).

My DAW is getting a bit dated now, so I occasionally run into these types of issue. Some plugins could cause a subtle decrease in decibel strength which would have to be compensated for, etc. Newer systems and versions have often fixed these types of issue, but it still doesn't mean that you can run your audio through 15+ plugins and expect to have the same signal strength as before:

"Many plugins will do nothing to the signal if it is flat--and if you run through 30 hardware units you gonna have a degraded signal

As little as 5 years ago I would say, and know, that a lot of plugins would turn the sound into a crumbling apart mess. But that was not only the plugins..but the Daw itself..and the way it processed plugins

Things are much better now. You probably dont need anymore than 5 max on the most. Most tracks will have 2 or 3 and some none. So as long as they are good you will be fine.

BTW..most anything you put sound through degrades the original signal....how much... is what matters."

These guys had a pretty decent discussion in regards to this.

At 5/29/15 05:38 PM, RubberBandMethod wrote: These guys had a pretty decent discussion in regards to this.

That thread is shit.

I'm the same way. I can change my voice to a lot of different characters and people types, I can sing however the way my stuff records makes everything sound like crap. I have had to tweak my stuff through Audacity and most of the time it makes everything sound worse. I've had to buy a blue snowball which won't even be here for a while. It's kind of sad that you have to do that sort of thing but you do in this line of work. No one will pay attention to your talents otherwise and even then none at all sometimes.

At 5/30/15 08:21 PM, JayWEccent wrote: I have had to tweak my stuff through Audacity and most of the time it makes everything sound worse. I've had to buy a blue snowball which won't even be here for a while. It's kind of sad that you have to do that sort of thing but you do in this line of work. No one will pay attention to your talents otherwise and even then none at all sometimes.

It was weird - I remember recording the same thing side by side in Audacity and REAPER as an experiment and the one in REAPER sounded fuller. This was about 6 years ago, so maybe Audacity is a little better now. Also making your voice sound good when recorded is 80% down to how you mix it, you've got to learn how. :)

At 5/29/15 05:42 PM, dem0lecule wrote: This is my 9th year of music making and I'm still using base plugins in FL Studio to mix. I don't think the mixing gears matter much.

Seriously though, base plugins are nice when you get started but they won't carry you forever. Same with a simple audio editing program like Audacity. It's a nice place to start but upgrade to something better ASAP.

Melda Productions have some nice free plugins that will be better than FL's basic ones. Try those at the very least. But once you've tried pro stuff, you can't go back. Ozone 5, Alloy 2 and Nectar 2 user here, I swear by them.

Thanks for the info :) Really means a lot. I've been struggling for a while and needed something new so this was a great help :)

At 5/29/15 05:42 PM, dem0lecule wrote: This is my 9th year of music making and I'm still using base plugins in FL Studio to mix. I don't think the mixing gears matter much.

Seriously though, base plugins are nice when you get started but they won't carry you forever. Same with a simple audio editing program like Audacity. It's a nice place to start but upgrade to something better ASAP.

Melda Productions have some nice free plugins that will be better than FL's basic ones. Try those at the very least. But once you've tried pro stuff, you can't go back. Ozone 5, Alloy 2 and Nectar 2 user here, I swear by them.

How do you access the M Recorder. I'm having trouble finding it. They installed but I can't find them. There not even in the downloads folder.

At 5/29/15 05:42 PM, dem0lecule wrote: This is my 9th year of music making and I'm still using base plugins in FL Studio to mix. I don't think the mixing gears matter much.

Seriously though, base plugins are nice when you get started but they won't carry you forever. Same with a simple audio editing program like Audacity. It's a nice place to start but upgrade to something better ASAP.

Melda Productions have some nice free plugins that will be better than FL's basic ones. Try those at the very least. But once you've tried pro stuff, you can't go back. Ozone 5, Alloy 2 and Nectar 2 user here, I swear by them.

At 6/1/15 10:58 PM, dem0lecule wrote: It's true that I need to upgrade. I've been thinking about getting iZotope Ozone, but since FL Studio plugins did most of the jobs fairly solid, I haven't decided to get it so far. It is now on my shopping wish list, thank to you.

I used to use Ozone 5 for mixing too, until I got Alloy 2. It still has features that Alloy misses such as mid/side EQ (which pisses me off).

I think the guy at the beginning got it right. It really comes down to your skill, you can't let your set up get you down.

I would also take to heart that expensive isn't necessarily good, in fact I would say learning how to use what you have is far more important. I still use really crappy stuff like VEC and a lot of the default fruity loops samples, lots of fruity effects and plugins, I use lots of free stuff like Synth1 and Charlatan. But because I utilize them to a decent degree I can get a professional sound out of them simply from using my ear and trying my best to make something good.

That's another thing that's important too. Try and make stuff that YOU like. It doesn't matter what your set up is, if you don't like what you're making in whatever fasion that's not good. Utilize what you have, and learn new ways of doing things in order to make the sound that you like.

For example most of my beats are sliced beats. While not everybody likes to slice beats and manipulate them that's honestly my favorite sounding drums I can come up with. Almost all tracks, even my dance/house ones use cut drums beats. I borrow it from some of my favorite artists like Andrew Aversa and Nujabes.

At 6/2/15 12:50 PM, InfernoZN wrote: in fact I would say learning how to use what you have is far more important.

This is 100% dead on. It took me years to get good stuff (5 years for my first premium instruments that were bare-bones entry level) and until then, everything I used was free stuff excluding REAPER my DAW. I learnt how to make the most out of what I had and so when I finally had better stuff gradually over the past few years, I was able to hit the ground running. :)

Fret not ye younguns!

I hate mastering. Mixing, isn't too hard. Just getting your levels set right.

When I need something mastered I usually just send it to a local friend who is really good at it. If need-be I can sit in on a session.

In bulk, you save money.

Recording Engineers need work, and I know that they can do it better than I can so I just started placing my focus on writing music the best that I possibly can. Sometimes you can get lucky and find a new graduate who is looking to expand their portfolio who will do the job for free, generally well too.

I think as an artist it is a little bit more important to place your focus on getting a really great mix that compliments the music you wrote. The technical mastering stuff should be left to the pros. It's easy to make mistakes and ruin the mix that you already established.