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so I was thinking about it, and I'm going to catch a LOT of flak for this idea, but it's one I feel is worth looking into.

The best way to permanently end the threat would be to destroy their religion. They all fight in the name of Allah, and many islamist groups want to impose Islamic law on a worldwide basis. Now, killing a few islamists will only make Muslims angry, in order to permanently put an end to this vicious cycle would be to end it the way you end any war, you destroy their will to fight. and by ending the religion, I mean basically saying "To hell with the middle east and Islam!" and doing what we've always needed to do to end the problem.

a good first move would be to bomb the Kaaba in Mecca during the Hajj. this could probably be done easily enough with a squadron of stealth aircraft, mainly because Saudi Arabia would NEVER see it coming. Who would do such a thing? The answer? a nation with a leader interested with ultimate victory and not just appeasing the enemy and exchanging tit for tat.

This would send a very clear message of "We're tired of your shit." Then, we turn our sights to various other Islamic holy sites and reduce them to rubble. This would make many Muslims second guess their faith, as they see Allah allowing the infidel to destroy the holy sites.

Now, before you say, "But that would make us no better than them!" Maybe, but I'm looking at the end result, It would be like Catholics watching Vatican City be reduced to rubble and the pope killed, surely Jesus would not allow his most holy city to be destroyed.... right? exactly.

Splendid idea. Because nothing stops people from wanting to kill you more than going into their house and destroying their most precious possessions.

You think that destroying holy Muslim sites will eradicate Islam? That has to be the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

i agree i say convert or die i mean they been doing this to use for how long like 14 cenutres now so i say convert to a difernt religion
or get ur brains blow into the wall

At 8/7/13 10:37 PM, Fim wrote:

Can't even tell if you're trolling, I'm tired. I hope you are otherwise you are such a pepporami.

of COURSE I'm trolling. such a plan would ignite world war 3.

At 8/7/13 09:52 PM, Korriken wrote: so I was thinking about it, and I'm going to catch a LOT of flak for this idea, but it's one I feel is worth looking into.

This should be fun.

The best way to permanently end the threat would be to destroy their religion.

K, good luck with telling all the Muslims, Christians, Asian etc. extremists to abandon their religion, as well as the people who AREN'T extremist.

They all fight in the name of Allah...

And here is where I stopped reading because your solution is to simply single out and attack Muslims. Acting like the destruction of Islam will end terrorism. It won't, why? Because not all terrorism is committed by islamists. Unless of course I've somehow misread the religious faiths of pieces of shit like Timothy McVey and company, or Ted Kazynski, or Om Shinreki.

You will never find an effective solution to the problem as long as you continue to insist that terrorism only has one face, one extreme interpretation of one belief.

At 8/8/13 12:05 AM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: the NRA is not a terrorist organization you don't see them blowing buildings apart we are American nonprofit organization for protecting 2nd rights for american citizens.

I think he must have meant the IRA.

At 8/8/13 12:05 AM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: the NRA is not a terrorist organization you don't see them blowing buildings apart we are American nonprofit organization for protecting 2nd rights for american citizens.

Quite right the NRA aren't terrorists. They are a one issue radical type group that seeks to use one piece of the law (the 2nd amendment) to then try to claim any other laws (anything to do with gun control) are wrong, immoral, or bad because of the piece of the law they like that they believe trumps it. That's not terribly different then a lot of other groups in this country of a similar bent and vein.

At 8/7/13 11:44 PM, Fim wrote:

Wy bother making a thread then? ;(

give ppl something to talk about, why else do you make a forum post?

At 8/7/13 09:52 PM, Korriken wrote: This would send a very clear message of "We're tired of your shit." Then, we turn our sights to various other Islamic holy sites and reduce them to rubble. This would make many Muslims second guess their faith, as they see Allah allowing the infidel to destroy the holy sites.

Good to know our enemy isn't just Muslim extremists it's Muslims in general.

Now, before you say, "But that would make us no better than them!" Maybe, but I'm looking at the end result, It would be like Catholics watching Vatican City be reduced to rubble and the pope killed, surely Jesus would not allow his most holy city to be destroyed.... right? exactly.

No, it probably wouldn't. The Vatican City is more say a political division rather than a fundamentally religious one. It's only the first Holy See because it's in Rome and when the Catholic Church originally divided up its followers geographically in order to create parishes and select Bishops it was the most important since it's where Paul founded the first Church. So originally there were 4 Holy See's which were supposed to have important religious connotation but were really the 4 most important cities in the Roman Empire; Rome, Constantinople, Antioch and Alexandria. Jerusalem was added as the 5th Holy See since it's where Jesus was crucified. Now if you notice something, all of them except for Rome is now in the hand of Muslims. That didn't end Christianity in those area's, and indeed in the case of Orthodox Christianity all it really did was shift the center of power in Orthodox Christianity to the rising power of the Russian Empire. Besides, in the Crusades the Muslims destroyed Holy Churches in Jerusalem and that didn't stop the Christians from fighting them. .

If you want to see another case look at Buddhism, it was exterminated from its homeland of India but that didn't stop people all the way from Sri Lanka to Japan to believe in it despite the fact that most of Buddhism's Holy Sites are in Northern India and Nepal.

Now what you're proposing is different from destroying the Vatican because Mecca is an actual Holy Site that's irreplaceable, in terms of the Vatican the actual location has little significance because it can be in Detriot or London and still hold its same significance. But if Mecca were in the hands of Buddhists or Christians people would still go to it.

Otherwise your overall notion of "God let this happen therefore the religion is false" is far from right. In fact many Muslims believe that due to their lack of piety the many ills of the Middle East arose, particularly the Socialist Regimes like Mubarak or Al Asad. But no, simply destroying Holy Places will make them even angrier and if anything increase sympathy towards them and lead to more people joining their ranks as now this has turned from a war between the West and Terrorists, to a war between the West and Muslims. Which would probably mean that nearly every Islamic country will declare war on the US, the move would have caused denouncement of the US in Europe and elsewhere and now you have basically the whole world furious at such a blatantly offensive move that you've pretty much sealed the fate of the US forever.

At 8/8/13 12:13 AM, aviewaskewed wrote:

Quite right the NRA aren't terrorists. They are a one issue radical type group...

so, then you believe the NAACP is a one issue radical group too?

Genociding 1 600 000 individuals would be easy enough and a decisive victory over the minor concentration of terrorists and those sympathiser among them. That's just killing 1 human out of 5 anyway, we can do it anytime. It's for a good cause right?

You're seriously suggesting that we completely eradicate one of the largest and fastest growing religions in the world because of the actions a small, extreme minority took years ago?

Likely outcome in one of the largest wars in history and massive social unrest between Muslims living in western countries and their governments. Congratulations, you've created a massive new generation of terrorists who are fighting for the very survival of their religion.

Yeah, great plan.

Those who think the religion is the cause of the terrorism are foolish. Sure, religion may be a vehicle that assists (key word) the spread and depth of such ideals, but they are neither the root nor a cause of the terrorism or the terrorist sentiment.

The poverty, international intermeddling, and the percieved us versus them attitude (largely perpetrated by the same fools who blame the religion for the terrorism) are the main causes of terrorism. Islam is merely A vehicle through which the ideas are coagulated. They would still exist with a different religion, or with a different coagulation medium in the absence of Islam.

Won't work at all.

At 8/8/13 12:52 AM, Entice wrote: You're seriously suggesting....?

No:

At 8/7/13 11:38 PM, Korriken wrote: of COURSE I'm trolling.

DISCLAIMER:

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

THIS IS A TROLL THREAD.

________________________________________________

Ok, so that hopefully should be enough of a disclaimer as to how seriously any unlucky straggler happening upon this thread should take any of the arguments made by Korriken in the OP.

At 8/7/13 11:38 PM, Korriken wrote:

At 8/7/13 10:37 PM, Fim wrote:

Can't even tell if you're trolling, I'm tired. I hope you are otherwise you are such a pepporami.

of COURSE I'm trolling. such a plan would ignite world war 3.

Given that you've conceived utterly moronic ideas to solve our problems in the Middle East,it isn't difficult to believe you'd support the plan that you "jokingly" advocate in this thread.

At 8/8/13 02:04 AM, Light wrote:

Given that you've conceived utterly moronic ideas to solve our problems in the Middle East,it isn't difficult to believe you'd support the plan that you "jokingly" advocate in this thread.

Judge as you wish, I have no respect for you anyway.

At 8/8/13 12:41 AM, Korriken wrote: so, then you believe the NAACP is a one issue radical group too?

The two aren't comparable and you know it. The way the NRA operates and the issues they champion are not the same as the NAACP.

Someone has already proposed to ban religion in the UN it did not passed. All it will lead to is that all the religious people will massacre the atheists.

The various European powers of the early modern and postmodern era were able to keep a much more politically unified and [relatively speaking] technologically / militarily advanced Islam out of most of Europe. And they succeeded because keeping Islam out of Europe and the west generally was their intention.

I would add that the destruction of a people's culture is a fate worse than death, and it is precisely that tactic which has been used against westerners, at least since the Holocaust, to extinguish western and European self-assertiveness that is a necessary prerequisite for any resistance to an external foe.

First, Islamic terrorism isn't a threat so much as the Islamification of Europe. And the Islamification of Europe is occurring as a conscious policy by European elites. Asking a western power to deal with the Islamification of Europe is rather silly in this regard.

The terrorist attacks that have been attempted, successful or not, had one thing in common; all of them were low-tech, unsophisticated, and for those reasons could have been prevented through fairly simple *police level* tactics.

And now I'll end with a classic and relevant quote from a dead ancient Greek.

"I am more afraid of our own mistakes than of our enemies' designs" - Pericles.

At 8/12/13 04:26 PM, SmilezRoyale wrote: I would add that the destruction of a people's culture is a fate worse than death, and it is precisely that tactic which has been used against westerners, at least since the Holocaust, to extinguish western and European self-assertiveness that is a necessary prerequisite for any resistance to an external foe.

Why? Why help Korriken troll everyone? Please stop for a moment there I thought you were serious and I became so depressed.

At 8/12/13 09:06 PM, Ceratisa wrote: Yeah, one is entirely racial

But making the clear goal of helping a continually oppressed people exercise their rights.

and the other is based on the 2nd amendment.

Not really. I don't hear them talking about militias so much as blocking ANY and ALL gun control law (even the sensible stuff) and advocating that we'd all be safer if we all had guns and could all shoot each other at any time...yeah, that is definitely the same thing, how could I have missed the similarities! *eye roll*

Interestingly. the only time the NRA was against citizens forming militias and their right to bear arms was...can you guess it? That's right! When the Black Panthers started getting uppity way back in the 60s. Weird!

Personally, I think the War on Terror is a natural evolution of humanity coming together. In short, it's mearly a clash of cultures. East meets the West -- ideas clash, people fight -- it'll be short lived (in comparrison to the whole of human history) and the world will be better for having gone through this.

To me, we are the first generation that can actually contact the rest of the world. That's not to say that we couldn't before, but for the first time in human history you can pull a small object out of your pocket and face-chat with a person on the other side of the world. Technology!

But when this happen, heads butt. So we fight... those stuck in the old ways, refusing to give into the future, try to fight change. They can't... and they won't be able to stop it, but they will try. And when they try, we will have to fight back. But when it's all over -- as older generations die out and new generations are born into a world where the "new ways" are all they know... slowly the resistance will stop.

Personally, I think humanity has a bright future through all of this. As communication gets easier, and travel faster... the world will shrink and eventually we'll be on solid group of people instead of the culturally diverse group of individuals we are now. We'll always have countries and such... but wars will be more like small arguments and the world will view itself as one group of people. But to get there, we have to do this... we have to tear down the walls, and that involves conflict.

Religion is just an excuse... it's not the cause of the war.
The real cause is culture clash... they just use religion as an excuse to back up their points of view.

American's fight under God and Country and others fight under Allah. OP is pretty blind to reality.