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At 7/24/13 01:12 PM, Earfetish wrote:

At 7/24/13 12:52 PM, ArmouredGRIFFON wrote: I find that breach of privacy appalling. I would like to personally apologize to CelticThunder88 on behalf of Newgrounds.com and assure that the majority of the members respect your internet privacy, and I hope this kind of behavior never happens again.

I find the breach of privacy entertaining and have no qualms about it, NordicThunder88 breached his own privacy by putting information on the internet anyway

Um I had my thumnail like that on purpose thank you very much, I plan to make youtube videos pretty soon.

At 7/24/13 04:23 PM, AxTekk wrote: Ain't got shit on the Old Testament though imho (at least, definitely not Numbers and Deuteronomy).

Maybe, but the Old Testament doesn't have much relavance anymore. When Exodus says: "[i]thou shalt not suffer a witch to live[/i]", then that's interesting from a historical point of view but not from a modern political point of view becuase there is no place in the world (except for maybe some parts of the African jungle) where mentionworthy religious groups exist that use this verse to advocate the killing of witches. However, when it says in the Qur'an: "[i]let not believers take disbelievers as 'awliya [translated here as 'allies'] rather than believers[/i]", then this is completely relevant becuase it underpins the modern Salafist doctrine of al wala' [from 'awliya] wa al-bara', which (mainly) teaches that Muslims should at all times show solidarity to each other, and to disassociate themselves from disbelievers. This is of course very relevant when you see parallel societies spring up in all the major cities of Western Europe, specially when mosques in Western Europe increasingly espouse Salafist theology.

In the end, it doesn't matter what you (as a disbeliever) think the fundamentals of a religion are, or what you like or do not like about its holy texts. What matters is what the adherents think, or what people who use said religion as an ideology think. What you think and what they think need not agree.

Also, I suck at distinguishing between HTML and BBCode.

At 7/25/13 05:21 AM, lapis wrote: Maybe, but the Old Testament doesn't have much relavance anymore.

I think on the whole you're right: Religion was very different for Jews than Muslims; in the days of early Judaism Yahweh was just god of the tribe, whereas by the time Islam came on the scene religion had bigger ideas. I'd also agree that the Quran makes it annoyingly easy for jihadists to claim divine cause (probably because Muhammed was essentially a military leader at a time of interfaith war not entirely instigated by Islam).

However, one thing I would say is that the exclusivity stressed in the Old Testament literature and the racial outlook of it also gives Israeli hardliners the same kind of excuses. That is the one thing I would say about it's relevance.

At 7/25/13 11:12 AM, AxTekk wrote: I'd also agree that the Quran makes it annoyingly easy for jihadists to claim divine cause

Okay, but that was not my point. Most of the warlike verses of the Qur'an actually have other verses in their direct vicinity which could be interpreted as implying that war in only allowed in a defensive manner. But that doesn't matter. If I wanted to, I could found a bloodthirsty cult that derives solely from the New Testament in terms of scripture and I could find a semi-pacifistic new age religion based on the Qur'an. The only thing that matters though is what the majority of the faith's believe. In addition to the Qur'an there's not just the sunnah (which is already a lot more warlike than the Qur'an) but a vast literature on doctrinal thought. And it's this not-quite-liberal doctrinal thought that is on the rise within Muslim immigrant communities in Western Europe and which can be linked to problems facing these communities.

However, one thing I would say is that the exclusivity stressed in the Old Testament literature and the racial outlook of it also gives Israeli hardliners the same kind of excuses.

I wouldn't overestimate their religiosity. While hardliners are growing more powerful, Israeli politics have always been largely secular and many Israelis do what they do out of Nationalist motives instead of religious ones. Also, Jewish orthodoxy doesn't always lead to a hardline stance in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The Satmar group, which is ultra-orthodox and numbers over a 100,000 adherents, is in fact opposed to Zionism.

Always very knowledgeable Lapis. That's the one major thing I've realised about reading holy books - how surprisingly irrelevant holy books are to religion.

At 7/25/13 01:23 PM, lapis wrote: And it's this not-quite-liberal doctrinal thought that is on the rise within Muslim immigrant communities in Western Europe and which can be linked to problems facing these communities.

...I wouldn't disagree. I honestly didn't know this was the discussion we were having. I don't know though, I live in a very Muslim area and the Muslims I'm friends with aren't even vaguely militant. Yeah, extremists exist, and I don't live in somewhere like Bradford, but I think it's far too easy to get panicked by this stuff.

Also, Jewish orthodoxy doesn't always lead to a hardline stance in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The Satmar group, which is ultra-orthodox and numbers over a 100,000 adherents, is in fact opposed to Zionism.

This is really, really interesting. I suppose I spoke to soon.

At 7/25/13 01:56 PM, AxTekk wrote:

At 7/25/13 01:23 PM, lapis wrote: And it's this not-quite-liberal doctrinal thought that is on the rise within Muslim immigrant communities in Western Europe and which can be linked to problems facing these communities.

...I wouldn't disagree. I honestly didn't know this was the discussion we were having. I don't know though, I live in a very Muslim area and the Muslims I'm friends with aren't even vaguely militant. Yeah, extremists exist, and I don't live in somewhere like Bradford, but I think it's far too easy to get panicked by this stuff.

I know they look alike, but wikipedia makes it sound like you live in a very Hindu area:

22.0% Indian
2.5% Pakistani

According to the 2011 census 25.3% of Harrows population identified as Hindu

At 7/25/13 02:39 PM, Earfetish wrote: I know they look alike, but wikipedia makes it sound like you live in a very Hindu area:

22.0% Indian
2.5% Pakistani

According to the 2011 census 25.3% of Harrows population identified as Hindu

Lol that's mostly North Harrow, I live further down towards Sudbury. That being said, it is still a very Hindu area as well.

At 7/25/13 04:51 PM, AxTekk wrote: Lol that's mostly North Harrow, I live further down towards Sudbury. That being said, it is still a very Hindu area as well.

By Hindu, do you mean South Asian? Or are all the people actually Hindu? (FYI, a significant portion of the population of the South Asian subcontinent is NOT Hindu.)

Maybe we should learn to celebrate diversity

At 7/26/13 01:08 AM, NordicThunder88 wrote: Maybe we should learn to celebrate diversity

What did that video have to do with anything?

At 7/26/13 01:27 AM, Camarohusky wrote:

At 7/26/13 01:08 AM, NordicThunder88 wrote: Maybe we should learn to celebrate diversity

What did that video have to do with anything?

Do you want that happening to your sisters or daughters?

At 7/25/13 10:32 PM, Camarohusky wrote: By Hindu, do you mean South Asian? Or are all the people actually Hindu? (FYI, a significant portion of the population of the South Asian subcontinent is NOT Hindu.)

I mean Hindu bro, as in go to Neasden temple for religious events and celebrate Diwali. Of course, not all of the South Asian people are Hindu or Muslim, but there is a large Hindu population and a large Muslim population. Less so in places like Pinner Green and Stanmore which are more Jewish.

You will also notice that contrary to far right predictions Harrow is yet to fall into abject race war/ become an Al Qaeda stronghold. Harrow's a pretty shitty place to live to be honest, but diversity certainly isn't the reason for that.

At 7/26/13 01:28 AM, NordicThunder88 wrote: Do you want that happening to your sisters or daughters?

Still, what does this have to do with immigration? Immigrants acting like locals (i.e. being mean to eachother for no reason) is evidence of nothing but assimilation.

At 7/21/13 04:38 PM, NordicThunder88 wrote:

At 7/21/13 04:36 PM, Fim wrote:

At 7/21/13 04:14 PM, NordicThunder88 wrote: Anyway what do you guys think of the English Defense League?

I quiver at their intellectual prowess

Judge an entire group by 1 member? Seems credible

Yeah, the only entire group we should judge is Muslims, right?

In a nutshell they are basically been doing this. Trying to make the streets safer, by making violence, Just because a few Muslims give them a bad reputation they are all terrorists? That's dumb, I live in a multicultural society and I know, first hands that Muslims are nice. This whole EDL thing is jut a stereotypical movement with no real points.

racism in any way or shape or form is messed up. racism should be abolished & it doesn't really come under the same roof as freedom of speech so it'd be alright . . . the french outlawed racism despite being one of the most secular (racist prone) nations on earth. then again the secular tendency to racism may have been what warranted a law against it in france & not the fact that they're super progressive

--supergandhi64