US President & treasonous actions

[morefngdbs]

So I've been waiting to see if anyone else was going to report this.
Its been a couple of days now , so I figured its political , I guess its gotta be me
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21768668

The BBC has reported on Lydon Johnson tapes that have been recently released
Seems he knew that the candidate Richard Nixon was doing some real nice backroom
manovering to keep the USA involved in Vietnam & his actions prolonged the war (which according to reports, allowed for the deaths of 22,000 additional US troops.

WHich begs the question (actually it brings to mind shitloads of them)
But isn't a President knowing another politician is doing things that are treasonous or on the border of such to suit their own political agenda .... & does nothing about it, because it serves his wishes or his Party line. Is he himself not then guilty of a crime against the American people ?
By protecting a wiretap, he basicly let events unfold that killed tens of thousands of people both Americans & Vietnamese !

Nixon ended up winning the Presidency & was obviously a slimey piece of garbage ...he can't be considered a wonderful Presidnet ...he was impeached out of the office.

Yet he did make it there & if Johnson had of acted, the war would possibly had ended earlier....a lot of US service men would not have suffered & died there.

Its realise this story is a bit to take in, & of course makes me wonder just what can/should be done to protect "we the people" .... from "they the uncaring & ungoverned" who 'we' elected & yet they are not responsible for lying (about things like weapons of mass destruction ~;p) as well as all the other things covered up etc !?!

[Warforger]

Nixon would've been one of the greatest presidents of the modern era if you had cut out Watergate perhaps, but if you include Watergate you should also mention he wasn't doing anything Johnson and Kennedy hadn't been already doing. Kennedy was the first President to use Federal agencies to go after political opponents, in particular he used the FBI against the Steel industry to forcibly keep the cost of steel down (this involved breaking into Steel owners homes and all). Nixon took this however and blew it out of proportion.

Keep in mind Johnson knew he couldn't win the war, there were state department papers called the Pentagon papers which showed that the government wanted to stay in just to save face. Why Johnson didn't call out Nixon on this we probably won't ever know seeing that they're both dead. Humphrey's campaign rested on the peace talks going on at the time and they were in fact about to decide a resolution, but like you said the South Vietnamese delegation walked out after Nixon convinced them they were going to be screwed over had they stayed, so Nixon won an easy election (although had the peace talks gone through we could've actually seen the election being thrown into the House for the first time since 1824 because of the strong 3rd party showing of George Wallace).

[Ceratisa]

I've always felt that Nixon just wasn't as good as hiding and lying as the others.

[Camarohusky]

At 3/17/13 04:07 PM, Ceratisa wrote: I've always felt that Nixon just wasn't as good as hiding and lying as the others.

I think he was actually too good at it. His ability to keep things under the radar led him to take bigger risks than others would have an he eventually overstrecthed himself.

[morefngdbs]

At 3/17/13 05:11 PM, Camarohusky wrote:

At 3/17/13 04:07 PM, Ceratisa wrote: I've always felt that Nixon just wasn't as good as hiding and lying as the others.

I think he was actually too good at it. His ability to keep things under the radar led him to take bigger risks than others would have an he eventually overstrecthed himself.

;;;
So none of you ...or anyone else... feel that the office & those who occupy it have lost touch with what the founding fathers wished to create ?

That by allowing the Presidency to become literally a dictator/warlord, with them serving the agenda's of those who helped pay their way into power.

thousands of people died because of the decissions of LBJ.
hundreds of thousands died because of Georgie Dubya's Iraq invasion, another'war' put forward & donecompletely based/caused through lies from a President .

its hard to believe so many seem to be fine with it being "business as usual" what does that say about everyone ! Its sad

[Warforger]

At 3/17/13 08:10 PM, morefngdbs wrote: So none of you ...or anyone else... feel that the office & those who occupy it have lost touch with what the founding fathers wished to create ?

The Founding Fathers were not sure what they were creating.

That by allowing the Presidency to become literally a dictator/warlord, with them serving the agenda's of those who helped pay their way into power.

It's pretty much his Commander in Chief Role. Nixon had little to do with LBJ and he entered office condemning his presidency so I doubt Johnson was trying to get Nixon elected.

thousands of people died because of the decissions of LBJ.
hundreds of thousands died because of Georgie Dubya's Iraq invasion, another'war' put forward & donecompletely based/caused through lies from a President .

Bush's invasion of Iraq wasn't unconstitutional and a couple of Founding Fathers may have agreed with it. Congress had already passed resolutions basically saying that it was their goal to overthrow Saddam Hussein back in the 90's and they had already tried doing it over and over covertly. Bush's actual invasion was just giving up on trying it secretly.

its hard to believe so many seem to be fine with it being "business as usual" what does that say about everyone ! Its sad

[Ceratisa]

I think Camarohusky and myself just realize regardless of who is in office, they all do it.

[Camarohusky]

At 3/17/13 08:10 PM, morefngdbs wrote: So none of you ...or anyone else... feel that the office & those who occupy it have lost touch with what the founding fathers wished to create ?

The founding fathers had a small agrarian society that numbered maybe 10-20 million. They also had a society that was fairly cut off from the rest of the world and one where most of the civic duties were perfrmed by people, as these duties and the people's job did not require a great deal of specialization.

Do I think Presidents and all politicans take advantage of the system? Yes. Can we stop it (in ANY system)? No. Humans are greedy and prone to power-grabbing. However, I would much rather have the system we have now where there is corruption, but the people still get a great deal of support and freedom than one where it's all corruption, or worse, where the amount of people misusing pwer changes from the current several hundred thousand to a whopping 300,000,000.

That by allowing the Presidency to become literally a dictator/warlord, with them serving the agenda's of those who helped pay their way into power.

I suggest you bone up on the terms dictator and warlord. All of the bad things all the Presidents have done combined into one person would still not rise to warlord or dictator status. It wouldn't come close.

hundreds of thousands died because of Georgie Dubya's Iraq invasion, another'war' put forward & donecompletely based/caused through lies from a President .

And? I voted against him every time. I didn't support the Iraq War. I knew the claims were bullshit from the very beginning. What else do you expect for me to do? I do have other things going on in my life tht are far more important to me than Middle Eastern Geopolitics.

its hard to believe so many seem to be fine with it being "business as usual" what does that say about everyone ! Its sad

It IS business as usual. And you know why so few confront it? Because business as usual, while not perfect, is pretty darn good for the American people (with the exception of the budget spats the past couple years.) Also, I'm not sure what you're expecting here. Expecting the US to be like Canada? Where Canada doesn't ruffle any feathers anywhere and always acts the good guy part. Why does Canada do that? Because Canada is not important enough for others to care about. Thus Canada has the freedom to go about its business without World attention focusing on its every move. WIthout countries pleading for help and then returing the favor by crticizing the method of help. It doesn't have people who hate it violently merely for existing. Canada has never had to be the rock for the rest of the Western World to hold on to. Being prominent creates enemies. Enemies create responsibilities and conflicts. You act as if everyone should just ignore the rest of the world Like Canada, yet completely forget that a huge chunk of Canada's ability to go unnoticed also comes from the fact that the US is willing to get dirty and deflect the ire for you.