At 12/24/12 05:48 PM, DickBuns wrote:
"don't blame the guns, blame violent media,"
That's not a conservative talking point at all.
The idea that media ought to be blamed instead of guns absolutely is. LaPierre explicitly said it in his speech. I'm not trying to make blanket statements about all conservatives here, that would be stupid. I'm pointing out the typical talking points we've seen specifically from hardcore gun advocates, and this is most certainly one of them.
"if you restrict guns, then only criminals will have them and it'll be more dangerous,"
How is this debunked when this is exactly the case in mexico?
You're saying it would be preferable and safer for drug cartels and civilians to be having pitched firefights in the streets all the time?
Whatever, Mexico is a terrible example to use because the government is hampered from properly implementing whatever gun control laws it has for reasons that are almost entirely unique to that country (and that certainly don't apply to America). Virtually every "first-world" nation, where organized crime doesn't constantly overwhelm law enforcement and the government, has stricter gun control laws than the U.S., and substantially lower rates of gun-related homicide.
"gun control advocates/liberals/Obama want to repeal the Second Amendment and take all guns away,"
No one ever stated this in the thread.
Really? Take another look at the third page. And beyond this thread, you can clearly see this kind of all-or-nothing attitude reflected in pro-gun arguments, especially by groups like the NRA.
"don't blame the guns, blame mental illness,"
Im sorry, could you explain how this has been debunked? Both Adam Lanza and Cho Seung Hui were obviously mentally ill. The latter having been to a hospital several times.
Again, it's the idea that we should be focusing on mental illness instead of gun control that pro-control people take issue with. Obviously improving how we deal with mental illness is important in its own right, and would certainly contribute to helping prevent future mass shootings, but by itself it's not nearly enough. Just like with healthy people, the overwhelming majority of mentally ill people are not violent.
Pro-gun people have been disproportionately talking about the mental illness issue to take the focus off guns and avoid talking about our gun problem.
Thanks for showing us how ignorant you are on this subject bud.
Nobody is saying that these things aren't problems, just that it's ridiculous to be saying that they're somehow more significant problems than the actual fucking weapons used to commit the actual fucking murders, and that we shouldn't even consider that something might be wrong there.
At 12/24/12 05:49 PM, BumFodder wrote:
People actually believe these things?
Gun manufacturers pay a substantial amount of money to ensure that people do, yeah.