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School shooting, 27 people dead

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Urban-Champion
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:24:04 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:22 PM, RacistBassist wrote:
At 12/14/12 03:11 PM, Urban-Champion wrote: oh the fucking irony. All day yesterday people were trying to tell me that strict gun politics "are completely ineffective" in america.

Canada has had eleven school shootings to this day? And the US? take a god damn look, i aint fucking counting that shit

And NO, lets NOT discuss gun politics in this thread please. If you wanna bitch and moan at me for saying this send a god damn PM
22 people were stabbed in a spree stabbing in a school in China today. Now, either advocate for the banning of knives, or shut the fuck up and deal with your hypocrisy.

Not only have i already gone over this topic in detail in this thread, China is culturally backward, unlike america. Stop riding my dick you fucking biased idiot

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:24:12 Reply

It's not a problem until my kids are shot in school, or at the movies, or at the mall.


/ Accomplishments: first 1000 comment news post.
/ عثكغ ʘⒺⒸⓀⒺʘ

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Gagsy
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:27:53 Reply

Shit like this is the reason easy access to guns in the US is batshit insane to me. Yeah people can argue that if someone wants to mass murder people in a large setting enough then they will find another way how to but talk about making it easy for them to commit a mass travesty like this.


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RacistBassist
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:30:27 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:24 PM, Urban-Champion wrote: Not only have i already gone over this topic in detail in this thread, China is culturally backward, unlike america. Stop riding my dick you fucking biased idiot

Dick riding? I am no dick rider, I don't know who you are. You are completely insignificant to me. All I know is that you are using this tragedy as a soap box for your dumb ass politics. There is absolutely zero link between a gun being owned and that person committing a violent crime. Explosives easily cause far, far more damage then guns do. Also, I see absolutely nothing in your post history regarding the knife attack. If this guy wanted to, he could have used a 3D printer to make the AR-15, (Which, going off what people believe, is an Assault Rifle, which is currently banned in his state) and the school still would have been shot up.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:31:15 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:27 PM, Gagsy wrote: Shit like this is the reason easy access to guns in the US is batshit insane to me. Yeah people can argue that if someone wants to mass murder people in a large setting enough then they will find another way how to but talk about making it easy for them to commit a mass travesty like this.

So you would rather people are stripped of the ability to defend themselves when people like this exist? Easy access? A lot of this is done by people who don't even own the weapon.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:31:31 Reply

Guys, we need to focus on something more important. Was the brother of the shooter a brony or not?

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:33:04 Reply

" boo hoo i guess killing innocent children will make up for the people that bullied me" -school shooters

Fucking logic.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:34:09 Reply

We can't outright ban gun ownership, because it'll make many Americans unhappy and also increases the chances of the government taking over it's citizens. We need to stop listening to the liberals.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:38:35 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:31 PM, Ceratisa wrote:
So you would rather people are stripped of the ability to defend themselves when people like this exist? Easy access? A lot of this is done by people who don't even own the weapon.

We manage fine in the UK by not carrying guns with us in order to 'feel safe'.

Ok sure, say they do not own the guns they use for mass shootings, but you cannot deny that it is far easier for them still to obtain these weapons, and not just little pea shooters, but proper rifles and such, much much easier than say me here.


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Gagsy
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:40:16 Reply

Sorry America. This stuff just makes me so mad, and sad due it being children. Its just not right at all how anyone can be able to do that if they want to.


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Ceratisa
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:48:28 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:40 PM, Gagsy wrote: Sorry America. This stuff just makes me so mad, and sad due it being children. Its just not right at all how anyone can be able to do that if they want to.

You have more violent crime though. In the end this is really about mental health. People are slipping through the system who need help.

WiiFittoToreinaa
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:51:13 Reply

At 12/14/12 01:11 PM, MikeyS9607 wrote: I bet everyone will blame it on the internet and cyber bullying or violent video games.

This


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:54:30 Reply

As I've been saying to people around me almost all day, banning guns outright will not help, and may in fact do a lot more harm than most people realize. If the right person was outside the classroom, such as an armed guard or cop, just as this was going on, his or her gun could have been used for the better in effect by killing the shooter early and saving many lives. It all comes down to, again, blaming the perp and not the gun since guns don't have minds of their own.

Still, it's far too early to know whether any significant changes in gun legislation will come up as a result of this. You have countries like Japan with strict gun laws and very low homicide rates every year, but then you have other countries like Mexico, which like Japan, also has strict gun laws but way more murders and overall crime.

Culture plays a very important role here. And sadly, no matter what we do, even if we illegalize guns by way of repealing the 2nd Amendment, we're still going to have to deal with tragedies close to this or even worse. Major cultural shifts where most people would move away from being inclined to engage in mass shooting sprees take a LONG time, if ever. In any case, there's no good reason why this piece of human filth did what he did, and the best decision he ever made in his miserable life was ending it.

ngmastah
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 19:55:27 Reply

I think it's perfectly logical to take people like this and use them for involuntary medical experimentation. That way, the victims are being satisfied, and society benefits.


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MiniDroidKreator
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:04:29 Reply

What the freakin' hell? I swear, these psychos that pull this crap need to be severely tortured for being this thoughtless.
They either are oblivious to the fact that they've destroyed several families as a result of their actions, or they simply don't care. To the families who were affected by this, and anything similar, you have my utmost condolences.

In regards to gun control, that sort of thing will never work. There will always be some nutcase who ends up getting their hands on a gun and the ones who truly suffer are the law-abiding citizens.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:05:53 Reply

Media blames the wrong guy, everyone sees that he likes the Mass Effect page, then mindlessly attack it.

School shooting, 27 people dead


:O

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:07:09 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:55 PM, ngmastah wrote: I think it's perfectly logical to take people like this and use them for involuntary medical experimentation. That way, the victims are being satisfied, and society benefits.

People like the shooter though will never see the court since they usually kill themselves after the crime happened. We could use that Anders guy in Norway but the law over there makes it so he spends the rest of his life in what amounts to a hotel room as a sentence for his crime that's besides the point though.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:14:35 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:48 PM, Ceratisa wrote:
You have more violent crime though. In the end this is really about mental health. People are slipping through the system who need help.

Thats a fair enough comment but many people do go unchecked in many countries when it comes to mental health. Its especially hard as seemingly some people just seem to snap out of nowhere. They seem perfectly fine to everyone including family and then something happens and they lose it. Them being able to obtain the weaponry to kill large groups of people doesn't reflect well on the health system sure but still not well on the actual gun law either.

Also I don't understand why pro gun people are using the Chinese stabbing as a resource for their belief that this tragedy would be just as bad with the use of a knife. Fact is 27 (or 28 is it now?) people, including children are dead from gunshot and attack in China had no fatal casualties from stabbing. If anything that event reflects badly on guns further.


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RacistBassist
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:19:29 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:14 PM, Gagsy wrote: Also I don't understand why pro gun people are using the Chinese stabbing as a resource for their belief that this tragedy would be just as bad with the use of a knife. Fact is 27 (or 28 is it now?) people, including children are dead from gunshot and attack in China had no fatal casualties from stabbing. If anything that event reflects badly on guns further.

Because if people want to go crazy and hurt multiple people, they will. There's plenty of shootings where the person takes multiple gunshot wounds and they come out fine, much like there are plenty of knifings where one stab is all it takes to end the life.


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ngmastah
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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:20:16 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:54 PM, GoryBlizzard wrote: As I've been saying to people around me almost all day, banning guns outright will not help, and may in fact do a lot more harm than most people realize. If the right person was outside the classroom, such as an armed guard or cop, just as this was going on, his or her gun could have been used for the better in effect by killing the shooter early and saving many lives. It all comes down to, again, blaming the perp and not the gun since guns don't have minds of their own.

Still, it's far too early to know whether any significant changes in gun legislation will come up as a result of this. You have countries like Japan with strict gun laws and very low homicide rates every year, but then you have other countries like Mexico, which like Japan, also has strict gun laws but way more murders and overall crime.

Culture plays a very important role here. And sadly, no matter what we do, even if we illegalize guns by way of repealing the 2nd Amendment, we're still going to have to deal with tragedies close to this or even worse. Major cultural shifts where most people would move away from being inclined to engage in mass shooting sprees take a LONG time, if ever. In any case, there's no good reason why this piece of human filth did what he did, and the best decision he ever made in his miserable life was ending it.

I understand where you're coming from when you tell me that a gun can't make the decision to kill. But guns can't really be compared to tools or anything else that possesses an ambiguous function. Guns are designed primarily to kill, be it animals or people. And I don't believe that it's necessary to potentially allow dangerous people to possess these weapons in the first place.

I still believe that we should give hunting rifles and such the same kind of availability, but limit the owning of semi-automatic rifles purely because of the danger they pose to society. The use of a hunting rifle can be argued, you can claim that you want to hunt, which is a perfectly logical argument. But with semi-automatic rifles, there is no other function, these are weapons that are designed to kill, and we're just giving them to anyone. We cannot give so many people the responsibility of using one of these weapons, they're fast, automatic, and easy to use, in the wrong hands, these weapons can kill vast amounts of people in a short time. Another thing is, we're not stripping anyone of any special rights here when we inhibit the use of such firearms, you can't argue that you use an AR-15 to hunt deer, nor can you say that it's logical to go duck hunting with an M16. No, the only fairly valid reason for owning these weapons (other than taking another person's life) is either a) collection b) shooting inanimate objects. And yet, these two reasons are not valid enough to favor the continued legalization of such guns. To take away someone's right to shoot watermelon in their backyard with an M16 isn't really all that bad, you're not infringing on an inherent human right, and in a way, you're saving someone from losing the one right that is universal to all; the right to live.

So I do agree with you in some aspects. Yes, it is people that are causing these shootings in the first place, but had they possessed an alternate weapon because semi-automatic rifles were not available to them, then perhaps the number of deaths would have been much lower. This is why I believe that banning such rifles is the best course of action concerning these kinds of killings.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:20:36 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:14 PM, Gagsy wrote:
Also I don't understand why pro gun people are using the Chinese stabbing as a resource for their belief that this tragedy would be just as bad with the use of a knife. Fact is 27 (or 28 is it now?) people, including children are dead from gunshot and attack in China had no fatal casualties from stabbing. If anything that event reflects badly on guns further.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:21:07 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:54 PM, GoryBlizzard wrote: Culture plays a very important role here. And sadly, no matter what we do, even if we illegalize guns by way of repealing the 2nd Amendment, we're still going to have to deal with tragedies close to this or even worse. Major cultural shifts where most people would move away from being inclined to engage in mass shooting sprees take a LONG time, if ever.

This. Having a freely available supply of firearms doesn't help IMO, but at the end of the day, triggers don't pull themselves. The biggest warehouse of guns and ammunition in the world wouldn't be the least bit dangerous if no-one wanted to ever use any of it.

I think America stuck itself into a bit of a rut with that 2nd amendment. By now there are so many guns in circulation that even if it was repealed, it'd take decades to track down and remove all of the guns people legally bought, and even longer to get rid of those that went off the radar (like what's usually used to cause this kind of shit). Ergo, there'd be a point where the only people still in possession of a gun are exactly the ones who would do others willful harm with it, thereby proving the old adage: "If guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns.". Keeping the laws the same won't solve the current problems, and changing them would almost certainly swap the current ones for a set of new issues, so you can't really win here.

Changing the way a population views guns is arguably a better approach than trying to get rid of them; with current public opinions, people would probably just go out and buy them illegally anyway because they feel guns grant a sense of security, and protecting themselves and their families is more important to them than adhering to the letter of the law.

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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:22:32 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:19 PM, RacistBassist wrote:
At 12/14/12 08:14 PM, Gagsy wrote: Also I don't understand why pro gun people are using the Chinese stabbing as a resource for their belief that this tragedy would be just as bad with the use of a knife. Fact is 27 (or 28 is it now?) people, including children are dead from gunshot and attack in China had no fatal casualties from stabbing. If anything that event reflects badly on guns further.
Because if people want to go crazy and hurt multiple people, they will. There's plenty of shootings where the person takes multiple gunshot wounds and they come out fine, much like there are plenty of knifings where one stab is all it takes to end the life.

And that's why we can't give these crazy people the kind of weapon that allows them to kill so easily. Had this psychopath used a knife or maybe even a hunting rifle, then perhaps more lives could have been saved.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:23:05 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:19 PM, RacistBassist wrote:
Because if people want to go crazy and hurt multiple people, they will. There's plenty of shootings where the person takes multiple gunshot wounds and they come out fine, much like there are plenty of knifings where one stab is all it takes to end the life.

Yeah sure but in this case you have two similar stories (without knowing the mens reasoning or mental state) where they wanted to harm a lot of children in a school with a weapon of their choice, one using firepower, the other slashing. And the difference is 27 body bags.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:27:24 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:23 PM, Gagsy wrote: Yeah sure but in this case you have two similar stories (without knowing the mens reasoning or mental state) where they wanted to harm a lot of children in a school with a weapon of their choice, one using firepower, the other slashing. And the difference is 27 body bags.

It's been compared so much because of how close to each other the events were. If this guy made a crude explosive using any multitude of day to day things, nobody at all would have batted an eye even though they can be far more deadly. Why people don't use them if they want to cause as much harm as possible? No idea, but I'm thankful for that


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:30:26 Reply

At 12/14/12 07:31 PM, Travis wrote: Please don't turn this into a gun control topic... please.

WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO? BAN ME?


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:31:30 Reply

At 12/14/12 08:27 PM, RacistBassist wrote:
It's been compared so much because of how close to each other the events were. If this guy made a crude explosive using any multitude of day to day things, nobody at all would have batted an eye even though they can be far more deadly. Why people don't use them if they want to cause as much harm as possible? No idea, but I'm thankful for that

Probably because he didn't know how to but he knew how to get a couple of guns.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:43:46 Reply

I recall Governor Malloy or another man suggesting that "The best thing we can do is pray for the victims and their families."

Yeah, because prayer's definitely going to do something.

It's funny how every time when these tragedies occur groups of people out there assert that we need to pray in order to make things right. How much has prayer worked, exactly? Is prayer going to bring back the victims? Is prayer going to supply the victims' families with financial relief? The only benefit of prayer, I can imagine, is to make people happier and give the illusion that they are actually doing something. It puts people in the pretense of holy self-righteousness and it absolutely disgusts me that in a time like this, where 20 or so children and several adults have been killed, we try to distract ourselves thinking about how God is somehow going to resolve this bloody incident.

Where is the logic in that? If you are trying to request God's help in any way, shape, or form, do you think he would actually listen? Wouldn't you think that maybe, if he actually cared about the lives of the claimed victims, he would have intervened to prevent this whole massacre from happening in the first place?

And yet many Christians are holding communions when they could instead use all of that time and resources to work towards the families' aid nonstop. Now I realize that some of these people have helped, but if they are truly devoted to making things right they should spend all the time they have possible in order to support the families.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:44:11 Reply

I bet this guy did it to spite his mother.


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Response to School shooting, 27 people dead 2012-12-14 20:53:03 Reply

"The victims ... are believed to include the school principal, teachers and young pupils aged between five and 10."

I don't know how anyone could shoot innocent children like that.

Rest in peace to all people who lost their lives in the crisis.