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Imagination vs Skill

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Ernosco
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Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 06:42 AM Reply

What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

M-Maher
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:00 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 06:42 AM, Ernosco wrote: What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

there's got to be a balance of the two, however, Skill is good for illustration so i'd say skill.

PigeonOnAStick
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:01 AM Reply

Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.


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M-Maher
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:10 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.

Survey says: YUP!

Imagination vs Skill

Ernosco
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:11 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.

yes, so?

Ernosco
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:15 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:10 AM, M-Maher wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.
Survey says: YUP!

Oh, don't get that thing into it. That's just something I drew when I was bored. I can draw a little:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=310959562311696&set=
a.102794576461530.5492.100001929633904&type=1&theater

M-Maher
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:29 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:15 AM, Ernosco wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:10 AM, M-Maher wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.
Survey says: YUP!
Oh, don't get that thing into it. That's just something I drew when I was bored. I can draw a little:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=310959562311696&set=
a.102794576461530.5492.100001929633904&type=1&theater

yeah facebook links don't work when you've got privacy settings on like a mother trucker

Ludic
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:35 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 06:42 AM, Ernosco wrote: What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

Skill, any day.

PigeonOnAStick
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 07:52 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:11 AM, Ernosco wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.
yes, so?

Two things:
- Usually imagination and skill go hand-in-hand. If you have a good imagination and you want to express it, you will look to improve your skill so that you can communicate your ideas effectively.

- Your stuff isn't imaginative. Stuff like this, where you paint erratically over a canvas and plunge a knife into the center into its center has had no thought during its creation, and is fobbed off as imagination in the aftermath.
The only people who will be using their imaginations for these submissions are the audience, not the artist.


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Ernosco
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 08:02 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:52 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: fobbed off as imagination in the aftermath.
The only people who will be using their imaginations for these submissions are the audience, not the artist.

No, I thought of that before. I thought "What would a painting look like if it bleeded, and how would the blood look"
You see that the colors are not over the whole painting, but a certain area, so it is like a wound in the big thing. But I understand that you are a skeptical person, which is very good.

Ernosco
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 08:10 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:29 AM, M-Maher wrote: yeah facebook links don't work when you've got privacy settings on like a mother trucker

  • Temiz Gozleri
    Temiz Gozleri by Ernosco

    Score
    0.000000000 / 5.00
    Type
    Illustration
    Popularity
    1 View
    Rated
    Everyone

this ones not bad imo

M-Maher
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 08:25 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 08:10 AM, Ernosco wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:29 AM, M-Maher wrote: yeah facebook links don't work when you've got privacy settings on like a mother trucker
http://www.newgrounds.com/art/view/ernosco/temiz-gozleri
this ones not bad imo

mediocre at best

Lintire
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 08:31 AM Reply

Man imagination is not even mildly important compared to skill. Ideas are fucking cheap.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 09:22 AM Reply

Skill is more important initially, but when you have it imagination is definitely going to set you apart amongst other people with skill.


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Luwano
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:53 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:52 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Two things:
- Usually imagination and skill go hand-in-hand. If you have a good imagination and you want to express it, you will look to improve your skill so that you can communicate your ideas effectively.

^ This, absolutely. Good ol' Loomis once wrote "It's ten percent how you draw and ninety percent what you draw." and emphasized that skill is the prerequisite for both. It's not "one or the other". If you lack skill then your imagination will go to waste and if your skill is prefect but you lack imagination you can't do anything more than a photo could do.


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ornery
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 11:08 AM Reply

Another thing is that skill is identifiable. You know when you have it, you know when someone else has it. Imagination is a bit more obscure. A lot of people who think they have a great imagination and great ideas tend not to in reality. And one persons good idea isn't necessarily another persons definition of a good idea.

idiot-monarch
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 12:01 PM Reply

Your imagination ain't gonna do you no good if you don't know how to properly ans skillfully express your ideas.

At 6/17/12 08:31 AM, Lintire wrote: Ideas are fucking cheap.

This.


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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 12:23 PM Reply

At 6/17/12 06:42 AM, Ernosco wrote: What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

George Lucas is good example of having the one. No words to explain that he succeeded and when shooting Star Wars he was just going among the artists concepts with stamp to put over if it' s approved. If not - the guys had to continue work over it.
Creativity may have different forms - and to some of us it may be considered as boring or horrid. To the rest it may be good and amazing. That thing is called "variety" and you have the choice to like it or not. One of the important thing that artist or professional /whomever it is, and whatever creative work he/she is doing is to feel love to it, to have pleasure of it, or just to have the "mojo" - but talent is just not enough if you don't have the discipline. That thing differs the professional from the amateurs, along with the skill set and imagination. Skills and imagination is the thing you put in your folio to be noticed. Discipline makes you reliable.
Unoriginal and boring thing are the things that are with everyone. Imagine artist, designer, sculptor, programmer, creator or someone who's doing creative work - architect, engineer, inventor - like empty vessel or tank ( not the heavy machine that makes boom, but a tank to be filled with water). This water is the inspiration. It's matter of approach for everyone and it's different in everyone to get his own inspiration. How are you inspired? What inspires you? These are the questions that may answer the thing about the originality and boring stuff.

Here's another known secret - there are NOT plenty of guys who can show something original. If everyone was original, then no one would be original. One does the "thing" everyone are just imitators. Details are another important thing.
Let's talk about creators/not only artists - because we can talk about composers, bodybuilders, dancers, actors ...) - details make the thing special and informative. Details are making the whole image full, with personality and unique.
Examples that are well known (because of details):

Arthur Conan Doyle's character - Sherlock Holmes. The pipe, the violine, the way he's thinking.
Michelangelo's David - muscles, facial expressions - anatomically correct physique. Important details there are the palms, who are bigger that usual - but that is because David is adolescent - at that age people have bigger palms, feet, head - teeth. These are the things that grows up at first, before the height. He was youngster when he fought the big guy Goliath.
Caravaggio - my favorite artist from the Renaissance - guy surely knows how to use lights, forms expressions.
Rubens /not Barrichello, but the much older and the dead guy who draws/ - the one that draws fat ladies.
The guy who was making those Eggs - Faberge
Boris Velejo - art
The architects and designers who worked over Burj Dubai ;
John Browning - firearms designer
Miguel Cantera - spanish sword smith and master
Muramasa Sengo - japanese sword smith, famous with fact his swords make their owners get crazy and to eager for blood.
Yim Wing-chun - chinese martial female artist

These guys praises the details in what they were good with.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 02:10 PM Reply

Most of the stuff i could say about this has already been said. I was gonna read your long discussion about star wars and george lucas but i didnt understand the point. You should make a TL;DR would be nice.....

My only addition to this discussion is.

If your work looks odd and obscure and was NOT intended to look odd and obsure. It's not creativity. It's not imaginative. Anyone can randomly scribble on a piece of paper and throw shapes around and distort things. That's not creativity or imagination.

Now if you planned out your whole piece prior and knew everything and anything you wanted to incorporate into your piece before doing your very first stroke. Then THAT would be creativity. A prime example is a TV character called McGuyver who is a highly creative individual. He could do anything and everything with the little supplies he had. With a rubber band a toothpick and a paperclip he could create a key to unlock his way out of jail. That expresses high creativity because you are using tools that are not meant to do something in a new effective way to achieve a specific goal.

Same thing applies with art, EVERYONE is creative and imaginative. Some have more then others. Your "creative pieces" should have a direction and goal in them and purpose from the beginning, if you find yourself doodling and randomly doing stuff thats not expressing the creative process.

I could write more but i dont feel like researching the creative process.

TL;DR, Things that are creative should look representable and not obscure to be considered creative. Unless, its purpose is to look obscure.

lucariopokemonsonic
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 08:14 AM Reply

Any reasonable person will choose imagination. You can learn to be skilled, but cannot learn to imagine. Plus, imagination can make stuff unique, no matter how terrible it looks for that will make scores skyrocket (I'm thinking of Picasso).


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idiot-monarch
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 09:30 AM Reply

At 6/19/12 08:14 AM, lucariopokemonsonic wrote: Any reasonable person will choose imagination. You can learn to be skilled, but cannot learn to imagine.

You don't needto learn to imagine, because all people are imaginative and creative to some extent.

Plus, imagination can make stuff unique, no matter how terrible it looks for that will make scores skyrocket (I'm thinking of Picasso).

Mmhmm, Picasso sure does look horrible. No skill there at all.


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Ernosco
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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 09:43 AM Reply

At 6/19/12 09:30 AM, idiot-monarch wrote: Mmhmm, Picasso sure does look horrible. No skill there at all.

No, he had some skill. This is one of his sketches: http://www.google.nl/imgres?um=1&hl=nl&sa=N&tbm=isch&tbnid=i CH-uKrG870u4M:&imgrefurl=http://slackermommy.com/%3Fattachme nt_id%3D1473&docid=0qpNabnMuUmeRM&imgurl=http://slackermommy .com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Pablo-Picasso-Mother-and-Chi ld-and-Four-Sketches-of-the-Right-Hand-50358.jpg&w=287&h=400 &ei=SIHgT6OOD8m_8wOj6sGUDw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=290&vpy=119&du r=312&hovh=265&hovw=190&tx=110&ty=127&sig=116120806570035065 938&page=1&tbnh=144&tbnw=96&start=0&ndsp=52&ved=1t:429,r:1,s :0,i:74&biw=1920&bih=987
I guess, thinking of it being just a sketch, it was drawn quickly.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 09:46 AM Reply

At 6/19/12 08:14 AM, lucariopokemonsonic wrote: Any reasonable person will choose imagination. You can learn to be skilled, but cannot learn to imagine. Plus, imagination can make stuff unique, no matter how terrible it looks for that will make scores skyrocket (I'm thinking of Picasso).

Pablo Picasso (Age 15) - The First Communion, 1896

Imagination vs Skill


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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 09:57 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 06:42 AM, Ernosco wrote: What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

Well, I think sit should be more to the imagination side. Look at the stick figure things...no art involved but you enjoy read or watching them...I think you can pull off something awesome with messed up art and get away with it like you meant to do it.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 10:01 AM Reply

At 6/19/12 09:43 AM, Ernosco wrote:
At 6/19/12 09:30 AM, idiot-monarch wrote: Mmhmm, Picasso sure does look horrible. No skill there at all.
No, he had some skill. This is one of his sketches

I was being sarcastic. Picasso is a fantastic, incredibly skillful artist.


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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 10:03 AM Reply

At 6/17/12 07:10 AM, M-Maher wrote:
At 6/17/12 07:01 AM, PigeonOnAStick wrote: Lemme guess, you're an artist who thinks they have a good imagination, but weird looking art.
Survey says: YUP!

LMFAO!!!!

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 01:53 PM Reply

At 6/19/12 09:57 AM, No573N wrote: Well, I think sit should be more to the imagination side. Look at the stick figure things...no art involved but you enjoy read or watching them...

only if there is some story-telling or animating skill involved.
Imagination without skill is perfectly fine; it just isn't art. Skill is how you take an idea out of your head and onto paper or whatever medium you choose. If you don't have proper skill the brilliance of your idea won't come across; if you don't have a good idea to start with the result will, even when skillfully put to paper, not be very interesting.
The value of a work of art originates in the idea behind it; but only through the skill with which it was created.

basta.


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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 02:05 PM Reply

i've seen plenty of imaginative art that was done by not so skilled artists. They looked nice and intriguing. For those of you who are imaginative this is not meant to come across as something to make you stop being imaginative. To fully enjoy and appreciate art there has to be some kind of mountain climbed. If you just slap stuff on a sheet of paper even if your imagination is through the roof. its going to look as if it was slapped on a sheet of paper.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 02:17 PM Reply

At 6/17/12 06:42 AM, Ernosco wrote: What do you think that is more important? Having a good imagination but the art looks weird, or a very good detailed picture of an unoriginal & boring thing.

Skill comes in various forms. Someone could be good at realistic drawings yet lack any ability in doing abstract stuff. It all depends on the look you are going for. If you are not good using the medium that you currently use then try charcoal, oil paints, pastels, anything else. Maybe use a mixed media. If you have the creativity, then be creative enough to think of what will work for your skill set.

Creativity is what it is. You create new ideas. That's important for interesting art but not necessarily all art. If someone ask me to draw a portrait, then I can do it without using any creativity. Only skill is involved.

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Response to Imagination vs Skill Jun. 19th, 2012 @ 04:36 PM Reply

I like how some people seem to be assuming that creativity can be quantifiably measured.


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