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Ways to improve the Audio Portal?

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LiquidOoze
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 08:21 AM Reply

I have been saying that those medals should be brought back ever since I knew they were once removed.

I like the idea of getting a medal/award for a song based on the amount of reviews/downloads your song gets (preferably reviews because downloads are more easily manipulated). However I think the popularity of the artist should get involved too, because I obviously get less reviews for a new song than Waterflame, for example.
E.x.:
When my newest song gets (amount of fans)/10 = 7,9 = 8 reviews, I get a medal.
When Waterflame's newest song gets (amount of fans)/10 = 551,6 = 552 reviews, he gets a medal.

That's just a random formula, it could be easier or more complex, but that's how I think of it.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 12:43 PM Reply

How about a decent radio system? Or more genres?

NorskeDrittsekk
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 12:57 PM Reply

Top priority: a delete button without malfunction!

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 01:59 PM Reply

At 6/13/12 07:54 AM, SenatorJohnDean wrote:
Audio mods don't need any more power. Mods in general don't need any more power. Many of them are immature.

Well im not gonna discuss much of this here, but there are plenty of small things that would benefit how much we can keep the portal clean and correct mistakes if even made by us. Immaturity? I think that describes most users but least of all the mods of the site.

Also, not letting ppl vote on their own submissions is NOT A GOOD IDEA. There's so much 0 bombing in there you HAVE to do it. Plus, if you get bombed, one vote is not gonna matter.

IMO, I'm pretty sure self voting was at least somewhat the cause of zero bombing, but that aside, its a risk for anyone on the site and self voting doesnt fix that. In fact, not being able to vote on your own stuff would probably detract users from trying to "destroy" the competition.

Back-From-Purgatory
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 02:10 PM Reply

-- The new Audio Mod tools...
-- Delete button for submissions
-- The updated approval system we were supposed to be getting (As far as I understand it was going to be a bit more like the Art Portals scouting system)
-- Playlists would be cool.
-- Grouping songs for "Albums" would be cool.
-- A "Report" button for users to hit when they find something that's stolen/has copyrighted material in it. A lot of people complain that others are stealing, but then never report it in the clean up thread... because they probably don't even know it exists.
-- A way to keep track of new reviews.
-- An option to change project titles (Or I guess just having a delete button so we can delete and remake would be fine too)
-- A review counter, so we know which of our songs are getting the most reviews.
... And probably more I can't think up now...


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 02:18 PM Reply

At 6/13/12 01:59 PM, Breed wrote:
IMO, I'm pretty sure self voting was at least somewhat the cause of zero bombing, but that aside, its a risk for anyone on the site and self voting doesnt fix that. In fact, not being able to vote on your own stuff would probably detract users from trying to "destroy" the competition.

Only problem is is that they would still be looking to "destroy the competition" no matter if you removed self voting.

And the review score should honestly effect the score more than the vote. Split the voting power between the review and vote, so that those who are too illiterate to leave a word can still vote, whereas the portion that is actually supposed to be helpful would hold more of a presence.

The only way to eliminate zero-bombing completely would be to have a content only site and no voting, but then there would be the problem of content searching.

NorskeDrittsekk
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 13th, 2012 @ 04:38 PM Reply

Senator has very good points but we all can agree not all mod is immature but a small numbers of them only. I also agree with Breed that audio mods might need more power and functions to manage the portal, in a better way.

No one is perfect. No system is perfect. It's only about how are you going to manage the system makes stuff different from shit.

At 6/13/12 01:59 PM, Breed wrote:
At 6/13/12 07:54 AM, SenatorJohnDean wrote:
Audio mods don't need any more power. Mods in general don't need any more power. Many of them are immature.
Immaturity? I think that describes most users but least of all the mods of the site.

From my perspective, some audio mods are extremely immature. However that is it for my judging. They see it themselves.

Also, not letting ppl vote on their own submissions is NOT A GOOD IDEA. There's so much 0 bombing in there you HAVE to do it. Plus, if you get bombed, one vote is not gonna matter.
IMO, I'm pretty sure self voting was at least somewhat the cause of zero bombing

The problem of self voting that causes the mess is pretty much minority. More on genre discrimination, vote exploitation and some more loopholes caused by the unbalance system. By mean is for example older and more popular on the AP gain more 'vote-man-power'. Him/her can exploit and abuse the vote systems legitimately. Human is a corrupted creature. Do you think it already happens?

but that aside, its a risk for anyone on the site and self voting doesnt fix that. In fact, not being able to vote on your own stuff would probably detract users from trying to "destroy" the competition.

That hits back to the vote counter thingy other has been saying. Vote limitation does not help. Let's say the admins limited the self-voting by today. Some user goes nuts. What's next? You might expect shit is going to change...

Tell you what? No, Never! There are always workarounds for the system. Proxies + multiple accounts. You can't track all ~10k of traffics per day on NG (ref: Alexa). With smart setup and calculation, the mastermind can make sure who is going to hit the damn Weekly Top 8, at the right moment. Think you can ban all the IP addresses of him/her?

Might sounds like this from some fictional novel but this was happened and it is happening.

Some people do this, for profit. Some did this, for challenges.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 14th, 2012 @ 12:57 PM Reply

At 6/6/12 06:12 PM, Breed wrote: Have somebody detail how exactly the top songs of the month get chosen.

Just a note, this would mean that the top songs would be picked based on quality, not on whether or not I can 0 bomb all entries except for my own and generally cater to the mindless mass of axiomatic basshunter/skrillex/tiesto pop music. I mean HOW ELSE do you even THINK of your entry surviving five seconds without completely marginalizing your peers who are more in tune with experimentation or musical culture!

But hey, what else would you be here for?

Although, someone going around listening to all the songs and having a team pick out the top ones will be more than likely overtly biased and, well, not much better then the system we already have. Blam and protect as well as a more rigorous voting policy that favors reviews as opposed to pressing zero or five. . .Maybe throw in some more genres to dilute the current ones.

Right now, if you looked in DnB, you'll see a whole bunch of liquid, arena, etc, but if we split those up the viewers could cater more attention towards more specifically catagorized songs-- I don't have to look for a liquid DnB track by trial. Of course, this rule is specific to all the genres we currently have, and the categories themselves should be carefully and intelligently thought out and agreed on by a majority. Maybe that's just way too much to ask!

More attention and detail needs to be put towards whether or not a song is easily available to listen to. It doesn't have to be complicated. We can just utilize what we've been doing now with the drop down menus.

electro>genre>subgenre instead of electro>genre (which is really a big, informally organized cluster of subgenres)

dlxrevolution
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 14th, 2012 @ 07:09 PM Reply

At 6/6/12 06:12 PM, Breed wrote: 3) People should not be able to vote on their own material

I would only agree with that if a function would be implemented so that anyone who 0 bomb's a submission should give a credible, and elaborate reason in the form of a review. In other words, if someone presses the 0 bomb button, screen takes them down to the review section, and they type something like "ZOMG! Shyt Suckz!", the review will be deleted, henceforth, vote won't count. I think that would be a good way to encourage more honest voting.

I also agree that there should be a playlist/radio feature where you can listen to your favorite songs without constantly having to switch to the next, or a different song in your favorites section.

Deleting songs...

etc...


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 14th, 2012 @ 07:34 PM Reply

At 6/14/12 07:09 PM, dlxrevolution wrote:
I would only agree with that if a function would be implemented so that anyone who 0 bomb's a submission should give a credible, and elaborate reason in the form of a review. In other words, if someone presses the 0 bomb button, screen takes them down to the review section, and they type something like "ZOMG! Shyt Suckz!", the review will be deleted, henceforth, vote won't count. I think that would be a good way to encourage more honest voting.

So why not just implement the same Review-bot for the audio section that is there for movies and games?


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dlxrevolution
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 14th, 2012 @ 09:24 PM Reply

At 6/14/12 07:34 PM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: So why not just implement the same Review-bot for the audio section that is there for movies and games?

I'd probably agree with you...if I knew what it was.

I don't review games and movies very often.

Also...

At 6/7/12 12:59 AM, BlazingDragon wrote: How about a notification system for when your pieces get new reviews.

I most definitely agree with this as I like to reply to most all the reviews people leave on my stuff.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 10:57 AM Reply

Personally, I would like to see the weekly top 5 and featured artist return. I think that it helped new artists get exposure. Plus, it was cool to go to the audio portal and just have 5 new, good songs there to check out.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 11:29 AM Reply

At 6/15/12 10:57 AM, alienchao wrote: Personally, I would like to see the weekly top 5 and featured artist return. I think that it helped new artists get exposure. Plus, it was cool to go to the audio portal and just have 5 new, good songs there to check out.

even though half of them always sucked.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 12:24 PM Reply

I think what perhaps we all need to keep in mind is that there are at least two different categories of people who are likely to post their audio to a site like NG:

1) People who are already into composition, etc, find NG, and use it as another way to get exposure, etc. This category of person likely already has their work up on their personal/portfolio websites, bandcamp, soundcloud, etc.

2) People who use NG as their first foray into the whole concept of writing music/audio and putting it on the internet for others to use/hear. This person sees NG as a way to get feedback with the goal/idea of the NG community helping them grow into person #1.

This is why, imo, we're going back and forth here (and elsewhere on the forums) about whether or not zero-bombing is a big deal. I fit more in that latter category, and I can say that my whole perception of the site and my excitement to participate in NG took a huge hit when I uploaded my 3rd little loop, pulled up the "latest" list to make sure that it was there, and found that someone had already bombed it. I've come to accept things the way they are, but my hopes/expectations for the site are much lower than they used to be. That former category could care less, it's just the way it is, etc etc. If the goal of the site is to attract and retain that latter category of person, then the review system needs to be a priority. If we're not very concerned about them, then sure, the review system is fine. Scattered thoughts:

I definitely agree with that we need the vote count back. If I'm going to just accept that I'm going to get bombed, I at least need to be able to tell when my low score is due to bombing and when I just suck.

Tops on my list is probably something like the old "audio/edit" view where I can see all my tracks, votes, score, reviews, and if there are any new. New reviews using the notification system would also be fine, but I'd like to see my scores, too.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 01:16 PM Reply

At 6/15/12 11:29 AM, Sequenced wrote:
At 6/15/12 10:57 AM, alienchao wrote: Personally, I would like to see the weekly top 5 and featured artist return. I think that it helped new artists get exposure. Plus, it was cool to go to the audio portal and just have 5 new, good songs there to check out.
even though half of them always sucked.

Well, regardless of how good they were, it was something that kept me coming back to the audio portal. I was usually able to find at least one song that I liked there every week. Now, the portal just seems like a bunch of lists to me. It's not as exciting or interesting as it was before, and I just don't really feel as motivated to go there.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 02:14 PM Reply

Allow users to see who's voted on their submissions, along with that person's score (1 - 5) so possibly zero bombing can be reduced and possibly stopped. To many great audio artists and newcomers are leaving because of that. It just gives NG a bad reputation.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 02:16 PM Reply

At 6/15/12 02:14 PM, Rinileki14 wrote: Allow users to see who's voted on their submissions, along with that person's score (1 - 5) so possibly zero bombing can be reduced and possibly stopped. To many great audio artists and newcomers are leaving because of that. It just gives NG a bad reputation.

*"Too many"

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 07:03 PM Reply

At 6/14/12 09:24 PM, dlxrevolution wrote:
At 6/14/12 07:34 PM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: So why not just implement the same Review-bot for the audio section that is there for movies and games?
I'd probably agree with you...if I knew what it was.

You can't leave shitty reviews on games and movies...this little thing called M-bot or H-bot or FuckYou-Bot will come by, erase the review, and annoy your email saying that your review sucked.

Well, I have another song that is going Top 8 in popularity...the second it hit, the 0 bombing started.

Just know this, anybody that is 0 bombing...it's not making YOUR music any better. The reason I'm getting views is cuz I care about music, not trying to manipulate the system. Losers


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 09:19 PM Reply

tbh i don't think there should be a voting system at all, any community this big and full of retards cannot possibly use it fairly and responsibly.

i wonder if i'm considered an immature mod haha
fuck those fuckers


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 15th, 2012 @ 10:46 PM Reply

At 6/15/12 09:19 PM, midimachine wrote: tbh i don't think there should be a voting system at all, any community this big and full of retards cannot possibly use it fairly and responsibly.

i wonder if i'm considered an immature mod haha
fuck those fuckers

Saying "Fuck those fuckers" does make you sound immature. That does not mean that you are though.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 16th, 2012 @ 01:54 AM Reply

I have a feeling this isn't the first thread about this system changing stuff. Well I'm new here. Let's see how this goes.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 16th, 2012 @ 09:17 AM Reply

At 6/15/12 10:46 PM, pikafrogbro wrote: Saying "Fuck those fuckers" does make you sound immature.

yeah that was the joke


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 06:55 PM Reply

While there are probably a couple ideas I think the AP needs, the most prevalent ones off the top of my head are definitely the lack of a deletion feature, coupled with no blam/protection. That effectively makes it so people can upload pure garbage, and it will forever be uploaded... Having some form of quality control, to me at least, makes the whole experience a bit more engaging when you know theres some standards. I'm sure it would also make for much fewer headaches for game developers/flash movie makers who want to find songs within the AP itself.

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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:04 PM Reply

At 6/15/12 09:19 PM, midimachine wrote: tbh i don't think there should be a voting system at all, any community this big and full of retards cannot possibly use it fairly and responsibly.

i wonder if i'm considered an immature mod haha
fuck those fuckers

No, I wasn't speaking specifically to you, but u should have known that because u have mod powers.

I think the lists are as close to perfect as they are gonna get. The popular list keeps 0 bombers from keeping an influential song from being viewed. high ranking songs cater to the stereotypical NG demographic.The only one that is kinna lame is the alphabetical one, cuz ppl put quotes around their shit just to show up first.

Basically, if your song is in quotes, it stinks and I won't listen to it. j/k


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:08 PM Reply

At 6/17/12 10:04 PM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: No, I wasn't speaking specifically to you, but u should have known that because u have mod powers.

nah man everyone is always speaking specifically to me, ever.
i know this because i have mod powers.

ppl put quotes around their shit just to show up first.

yeah this is pretty bitchmade. i actually just don't understand putting "tags" at the start of song titles other than as a means of attention whoring. i only ever do it as a joke.


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Back-From-Purgatory
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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:11 PM Reply

At 6/17/12 10:08 PM, midimachine wrote: yeah this is pretty bitchmade. i actually just don't understand putting "tags" at the start of song titles other than as a means of attention whoring. i only ever do it as a joke.

I do it because half the time the song names I come up with are already taken.

Also, can we please stop complaining about 0 bombing and come up with some suggestions to improve the portal instead? The only thing that will stop 0 bombing is removing the voting system entirely... And that will likely never happen, so just suck it up, move on, and help improve the portal in other ways.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:13 PM Reply

At 6/17/12 10:11 PM, Back-From-Purgatory wrote:
At 6/17/12 10:08 PM, midimachine wrote: yeah this is pretty bitchmade. i actually just don't understand putting "tags" at the start of song titles other than as a means of attention whoring. i only ever do it as a joke.
I do it because half the time the song names I come up with are already taken.

Also, can we please stop complaining about 0 bombing and come up with some suggestions to improve the portal instead? The only thing that will stop 0 bombing is removing the voting system entirely... And that will likely never happen, so just suck it up, move on, and help improve the portal in other ways.

Not true, and I already gave the suggestion of moving the review bot that the movies and games have over to audio. Whatever automated system keeps crappy reviews off those portals can be moved to audio.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 10:46 PM Reply

At 6/16/12 01:54 AM, NorskeDrittsekk wrote: I have a feeling this isn't the first thread about this system changing stuff. Well I'm new here. Let's see how this goes.

Don't act so tough new guy. You're up against mods here.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 17th, 2012 @ 11:17 PM Reply

At 6/15/12 07:03 PM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: You can't leave shitty reviews on games and movies...this little thing called M-bot or H-bot or FuckYou-Bot will come by, erase the review, and annoy your email saying that your review sucked.

Well, the difference between this system, and the system I described was that you have to leave a review for why something was bad in order for the 0 bomb to take place. I assume that anyone can straight up 0 bomb a movie or game without having to comment.


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Response to Ways to improve the Audio Portal? Jun. 18th, 2012 @ 09:36 AM Reply

At 6/6/12 07:19 PM, BrokenDeck wrote: How about audio authors can group particular tracks of their own into an "album" group, instead of the songs only being grouped into years?

This is probably my favorite idea.