At 9/28/11 09:59 AM, Camarohusky wrote:
You say try to fix these things because it's easy.
No, I say it IS easy to fix these things. That is not an argument as to why they should be fixed. Just that I'm saying the argument that you are putting out that seems to make it sound like it's hard and time consuming is in fact false.
I. and the vast majority of Americans, see this "easy" target as nothing more than nitpicking.
Well, since Argumentum Ad Populum is a fallacy and all...
It becomes really hard to take an activist group seriously when all they do is fight over symbols here and there, but seem to let actual religious discrimination and hatred go unchecked.
I'm sorry, would you like to actually give me some concrete examples of activist groups doing this? Because it seems to me what's happened here is you've read some articles about a bunch of groups who oppose "symbols" and because you don't hear their names popping up on more "serious" issues of discrimination you assume they're active in the former, but not the latter.
I see this as a sign of weakness.
Opinions are neat.
Instead of galvanizing to fight a real problem, the Atheist community sits back and pokes and prods at these little things.
Except when they poke at the Catholic Church and a lot of the other real problems. Because they certainly are doing that very publicly. But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of your hating on and generalizing Atheists. Especially since they aren't really a "community" since they don't really necessarily have anything in common other then their lack of theism.
Also, when it comes to Christians, the erasure of these little symbols becomes the "erasing of God" and thus turns them against Atheists, moreso than they already would be (from apathy the dislike to hatred).
So Atheists shouldn't voice concerns or raise their voices because it might piss off the Christians or hurt thier feelings? Seriously? By this logic then nobody should criticize or point out the flaws in anything because surely they're going to offend some group.
If the Atheists actually focused on the real religious injustices,
Which they do.
such as work discrimination,
Prove they don't.
Prove they don't.
prayers in school,
They definitely have focused on that. Also the Pledge of Allegiance as currently constituted said in schools.
creationism in school,
Again they do.
and left the little things alone then the Atheists wouldn't have so many enemies.
Oh, so you should just pick acceptable battles because it's so terrible to have "enemies" and potentially have your opinions piss someone off. Honestly, go screw. The right to do that is what this country is built on. You see something you believe is an injustice, or wrong, you have a right to stand up and rail against it.
The more I see these tired and futile attempts/calls to remove "God" from certian things, the more I begin to believe that the Atheist community is just creating a ruckus to get attention, and intentionaly provoking a reaction from religions.
Or hey, maybe they're just not willing to accept passive and tacit approval of a certain religious idea into a system that is supposed to be religiously neutral. I don't identify as atheist but I'm certainly sympathetic to those ideals as someone who firmly believes freedom of religion should also mean freedom from religion if one so chooses.
If the Atheists were joined by a large group of another religion on this matter, say Hindus, then maybe they would carry some credibility,
So...they need more numbers to seem credible for you? They need theists to seem credible? That doesn't strike you as even a little discriminatory?
but the fact that so many groups who are not Christian and do not fall under "God" are silent and accepting of the status quo, it makes me think Atheists are rocking the boat just to rock the boat.
So you've decided that because a cause isn't popular, it's bullshit? Really? The American Revolution was a very devisive issue...was that "just people rocking the boat" too? Ugh.
Now I don't mind rocking the boat, but I only tolerate it when there's a purpose.
And you get to decide when it serves a purpose right? Because you're such a great expert on the groups raising the objections and their motives?
Sounds more like you really don't like Atheists and that's really informing your view here. Just my opinion anyway.
Trust me, my family has experienced first hand harm because of the the things I just mentioned, yet has not felt any harm from the inclusion of the word "God" on the Dollar, or in the Pledge of Allegiance.