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Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable

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MillsApparatus
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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-09-04 23:50:35 Reply

Obama should never have been president in the first place. It's the White House for a reason.


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Camarohusky
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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-09-04 23:57:33 Reply

At 9/4/11 11:50 PM, MillsApparatus wrote: Obama should never have been president in the first place. It's the White House for a reason.

Because it was burnt during the War of 1812 and they hasitly white washed it to cover the char, and everyone liked it?

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-09-05 00:03:00 Reply

At 9/4/11 11:57 PM, Camarohusky wrote:
At 9/4/11 11:50 PM, MillsApparatus wrote: Obama should never have been president in the first place. It's the White House for a reason.
Because it was burnt during the War of 1812 and they hasitly white washed it to cover the char, and everyone liked it?

That's an urban legend. A few seconds on Snopes and you'd have saved yourself the embarrassment of making such an ignorant and childish post that has no foundation in actual history.


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Camarohusky
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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-09-05 01:57:50 Reply

At 9/5/11 12:03 AM, MillsApparatus wrote: childish

I would say this is like the pot calling the kettle black, but this is more like the pot calling the porcelain tea cup black.

Regardless of exactly why it is called the White House, your first post is still just as useless.

gumOnShoe
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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-09-05 09:59:16 Reply

At 9/4/11 11:50 PM, MillsApparatus wrote: Obama should never have been president in the first place. It's the White House for a reason.

I.

We hold these truths to be self-evident,that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

II.

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Section 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

III.

Civil Rights Act of 1964:

Title III
Prohibited state and municipal governments from denying access to public facilities on grounds of race, color, religion or national origin.

itle VII of the Act, codified as Subchapter VI of Chapter 21 of 42 U.S.C. § 2000e [2] et seq., prohibits discrimination by covered employers on the basis of race, color, religion, sex or national origin (see 42 U.S.C. § 2000e-2[31]). Title VII also prohibits discrimination against an individual because of his or her association with another individual of a particular race, color, religion, sex, or national origin. An employer cannot discriminate against a person because of his interracial association with another, such as by an interracial marriage.

In other words. Shut your stupid fucking mouth, you stupid fucking racist.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-03 17:13:00 Reply

Anyway, back on topic. Since there has been some movement in the race so far, it seems a good time to re-visit the question first posed by Mason.

What are Obama's chances?

He still hasn't shaken the weak leader persona tirelessly crafted by the Congressional republicans (and himself, to be fair). His approval numbers are still significantly below 50%.

But. His poll numbers are rising, and rather steadily. He got obvious bumps from Bin Laden and Gaddhafi's deaths, the announced withdrawal from Iraq, and the success of the Arab Spring. OWS has been a boon to Obama, who has been canny enough to not try to co-opt the movement like the GOP did with the Tea Party, but rather trying to campaign on the issues that OWS has brought forth. OWS still coould be a backfire, though, if the trend towards more violence continues.

Obama's polling at about 47% favorable right now, and is beating all of the republicans in the primary race by 16% or more in head-to-head matchups. His rise has been gradual enough to avoid bubble-bursting due to flagging interest in international matters. Also, he is beginning the part of the whole shebang at which he is best: campaigning.

His opponents face some serious challenges if they truly want to unseat him. Romney has issues with the base which make a primary win for him difficult, even though he would have (aside from Huntsman, whose base issues are even larger, and who also doesn't have the infrastructure to compete with an establishment icon like Romney) the best chance of beating Obama in the general. Cain's bubble is about to burst, and the Tea Party is looking like they're going to try out Gingrich next.

While overall Democrat approval sits about equal to Obama's at 47%, GOP approval is at about 40% and falling. It seems like the GOP, after having been set up for the easy win in '12 may be on the verge of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.


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Camarohusky
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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-03 21:05:22 Reply

At 11/3/11 05:13 PM, Ravariel wrote: It seems like the GOP, after having been set up for the easy win in '12 may be on the verge of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

In the Pacific Northwest, we call this phenomenon "Couging it"

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-03 21:25:26 Reply

I'm glad to see this topic back. I have been disillusioned by Obama and it depends on who's running if I vote for him again. If, say, Michelle Bachmann was running, I'd vote for Obama in a heartbeat. But anyone else...I'd have to think.

Obama said he supported OWS, and I think he needs to distance himself from them, especially considering what just happened in Oakland. The fact is, there were a lot of people against the movement to begin with, but if they continue to do boneheaded things like that, they'll lose supporters, and if Obama or any Dems align themselves too closely with OWS, well...it won't be good. OWS is basically a left-wing Tea Party in that it too has been co-opted by the crazies. If I'm wrong PM me but that's a debate for another topic.

At the same time, a lot can happen between now and November 2012. Remember, McCain had a shot at the presidency until the economic meltdown. I view the pullout of troops in Iraq with a grain of salt. How do I know they won't be redeployed to Iran?

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-03 22:32:46 Reply

Afghanistan would be more likely than Iran. I'm not saying the president doesn't like spreading democracy; but Iran is a different cupcake than Libya.

And just because troops are pulling out, doesn't mean contractors are going too. I have a feeling the u.s. will still have a presence there in some form. Maybe it'll just be CIA & mercs.

As for OWS, its another topic but they aren't nearly as bad as they've been made out to be. From what I heard police in Oakland have a history of over reacting in particularly violent ways. i'm pretty sure mayor sent the police home and apologized to the protestors. Anyone else see the video of the former marine having a flash bang go off near his head after being wounded by police? Nasty stuff.

Obama certainly isn't poling as well as he did. And he's still not my favorite guy. At this point, however, I don't think I can vote for a Republican. My views are just too far away from theirs.

Perry & Cain are imploding. And they would raise taxes on the middle class, which is probably a DQ in a republican primary.

Bachman's out officially if anyone missed that.

Pawlenty is in it, but no one likes him.

Huntsman is being ignored. I think I saw 0% approval.

Gingrich will probably bubble up and then drop when people find out who he is again.

And that leaves Romney, eternal #2. He's maintained 23% of the republican electorate, but he's never managed to move up. He's Mormon, which I don't care about, but evangelicals (neocons) hate. And he looses to Bloomberg in polls. If you didn't know, Bloomberg isn't even running.

Aside from that, Romney has the flip flopping label, will do anything to get elected vibe.

Republican aren't trying very hard to win.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 07:52:09 Reply

At 11/3/11 10:32 PM, gumOnShoe wrote: Afghanistan would be more likely than Iran. I'm not saying the president doesn't like spreading democracy; but Iran is a different cupcake than Libya.

And just because troops are pulling out, doesn't mean contractors are going too. I have a feeling the u.s. will still have a presence there in some form. Maybe it'll just be CIA & mercs.

As for OWS, its another topic but they aren't nearly as bad as they've been made out to be. From what I heard police in Oakland have a history of over reacting in particularly violent ways. i'm pretty sure mayor sent the police home and apologized to the protestors. Anyone else see the video of the former marine having a flash bang go off near his head after being wounded by police? Nasty stuff.

Obama certainly isn't poling as well as he did. And he's still not my favorite guy. At this point, however, I don't think I can vote for a Republican. My views are just too far away from theirs.

Perry & Cain are imploding. And they would raise taxes on the middle class, which is probably a DQ in a republican primary.

Well Perry already imploded, his debating abilities are horrible. It was almost as if he was trying to get Romney to win...

I anticipate Cain will suffer the same fate as Perry and Bachman, with his poll numbers back down to 'unconsidered' status within a week or two. However he doesn't have the same debating issues as Perry or Bachman.

Bachman's out officially if anyone missed that.

"Officially"? I can't find that anywhere, i google searched Bachman Drop out and all i got was this...

http://www.newser.com/story/132092/tea-p arty-group-to-michele-bachmann-drop-out-
of-election-2012.html

Pawlenty is in it, but no one likes him.

No he dropped out, you're thinking about Santorum.

Huntsman is being ignored. I think I saw 0% approval.

He might get more recognition if the other candidates decide to give up, or Huntsman might get i

My impression of republican voters is that they are desperate to find someone who they could imagine as president, who isn't as much of a plastic man or as uninspiring at Romney. It would be a huge blow to conservatives [not neoconservatives but those tea party people] if After all of their effort over the last 4 years, they end up with Mitt Romney.

Gingrich will probably bubble up and then drop when people find out who he is again.

Probably.

And that leaves Romney, eternal #2. He's maintained 23% of the republican electorate
Aside from that, Romney has the flip flopping label, will do anything to get elected vibe.

Republican aren't trying very hard to win.

They're all pretty relaxed as far as campaigning effort goes, because they all believe that any of them could beat Obama. Only Paul seems to be actually trying to win.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 08:34:58 Reply

At 8/10/11 10:30 PM, redzone wrote: Bad idea for him to be re-elected because the republicans will do the same shit again, which is stopping him at every turn and rather see the country burn than see it be saved by a black man.

It's without a doubt a "very" bad idea to re-elect Obama considering the sheer facts he done America more harm then good not to mention the economy has gone downhill since he's been in office.

The weird thing is that prophecies have mentioned about an African American who will one day be elected President of the United States a LONG time ago way before Obama became known, exactly what he was meant to do, I knew not at the time but what I now know is that people don't want Obama to be re-elected for the damages hes done.

It seems God/Goddess wanted Obama to be elected President of the United States to give the American people a "wake-up" call, to determine if we wanted to keep our freedoms and in the case of the American people, we need to keep our freedoms because Freedom is a cause well worth fighting for.

If we the American people want to keep our freedoms then all we must do is simple, don't re-elect Obama a 2nd term, for if he's allowed to be given a 2nd term, it will in no doubt do us a LOT more harm then good.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 10:14:53 Reply

If we the American people want to keep our freedoms then all we must do is simple, don't re-elect Obama a 2nd term, for if he's allowed to be given a 2nd term, it will in no doubt do us a LOT more harm then good.

Sounds like a good idea to me. But it just seems like whoever wins we lose...
What do you think about hermin cain taking his place?


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 10:46:03 Reply

I.....don't know. My brain is computing whether or not it's a GOOD thing if he gets reelected or not.

Hmm, well, at the end of 2016, just imagine how many more dreamers would be finally awakened. What I mean by that is look how far we've come in the last three years. How many people are educating themselves, learning history, the laws of economics, learning the human condition, theology, everything the progressives don't want you to know.

But if we get a watered-down conservative for a president, then it will be just another sleeping pill for people to go back to bed, not to educate and empower themselves with the future and direction of this country. Buuut if there's four more years of this statist bullshit? Then we have millions of more minds ready to take back the tree of liberty.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 12:25:29 Reply

At 11/6/11 10:14 AM, Kackorot wrote:
If we the American people want to keep our freedoms then all we must do is simple, don't re-elect Obama a 2nd term, for if he's allowed to be given a 2nd term, it will in no doubt do us a LOT more harm then good.
Sounds like a good idea to me. But it just seems like whoever wins we lose...
What do you think about hermin cain taking his place?

Highly doubt Hermin Cain will take Obama's place, too many things are already getting banned as is and that is why the independents are already on the rise to power.

This is why people need to one day realize that North America (United States and Canada) isn't just the land of the free but also the land of the spiritual, more and more people will realize the spiritualism that made America for what it's meant to be as people will one day learn to govern themselves and from the national leaders down.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-06 16:21:26 Reply

At 11/6/11 10:46 AM, X-Gary-Gigax-X wrote: How many people are educating themselves, learning history, the laws of economics, learning the human condition, theology, everything the progressives don't want you to know.

Really? Seems like people have fallen back into their old "for me first, for the efficiency second, and for the good last". The whole Tea Party movement is born out of a sheer LACK of education. Knowledge steers people toward liberal policies. The only time it doesn't is when those people are smart enough to exploit conservative politics. The educated always know that the "no taxes" form of government is a sham. The only difference between the red and the blue, is that the red are on the good side of it and selfish enough to watch the system give anal to the rest of society.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-14 13:10:26 Reply

At 11/6/11 10:46 AM, X-Gary-Gigax-X wrote: I.....don't know. My brain is computing whether or not it's a GOOD thing if he gets reelected or not.

Hmm, well, at the end of 2016, just imagine how many more dreamers would be finally awakened. What I mean by that is look how far we've come in the last three years. How many people are educating themselves, learning history, the laws of economics, learning the human condition, theology, everything the progressives don't want you to know.

But if we get a watered-down conservative for a president, then it will be just another sleeping pill for people to go back to bed, not to educate and empower themselves with the future and direction of this country. Buuut if there's four more years of this statist bullshit? Then we have millions of more minds ready to take back the tree of liberty.

This is a silly theory. Just because a Republican could get into office doesn't mean people wouldn't educate themselves. That's just applying correlation without proving causation. People are educating themselves because our system is getting a little bit better, not because a liberal is in office. While this trend may exist, I wouldn't say its as dramatic as "If a conservative gets in office, people aren't going to educate themselves as much anymore."

So, yeah, I respectfully think you need to rethink that statement, as it seems somewhat juvenile.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-14 22:59:50 Reply

I think the only person who can stand a chance against Obama is Romney. Just look at all the other canidates!

Herman Cain: Pervert
Michelle Bachman: Idiot
Rick Perry: Stone Face
Newt Gingrich: Who the hell is Newt Gingrich anyway?!

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-14 23:14:04 Reply

At 11/6/11 04:21 PM, Camarohusky wrote:
Really? Seems like people have fallen back into their old "for me first, for the efficiency second, and for the good last". The whole Tea Party movement is born out of a sheer LACK of education.

Funny how things like that work. the occupy wall street has the same humble beginning... except its fallen apart and all thats left are bums.

Knowledge steers people toward liberal policies. The only time it doesn't is when those people are smart enough to exploit conservative politics.

so anyone who isn't a liberal is either dumb or evil? Or perhaps they take on right conservative policies is because they know that trying to take care of everyone, including those who want to be taken care of by others, from the crib to the grave does not work.

The educated always know that the "no taxes" form of government is a sham.

No taxes does not work, this is true. However, over taxation and over spending also does not work. Liberal policies like wasting money on overweight degenerates who want to sit at home watching tv and eating pizza all day solves no problems and placing an unnecessary strain on the system.

The only difference between the red and the blue, is that the red are on the good side of it and selfish enough to watch the system give anal to the rest of society.

...... what?


I'm not crazy, everyone else is.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-17 03:17:55 Reply

OMFG what is wrong with you people!? There's more to think about than OWS and the long history of a dual-party system. Obama breed's socialism in a capitalist society; Fannie and Freddie, the bailouts, Obama-Care, only to name the most prominent examples. Socialism in a capitalist society is counter-productive. It's no wonder our economy is in the tank; we spent all our money bailing out (or should I say buying out) )the banks and car companies, and gearing up for a socialist healthcare system (which won't work anywhere near as well as a free-market healthcare system, no matter how far we bury our heads in the sand and refuse to acknowledge the proof [Europe's prime examples, Canada, and our own military]).

I for one logical thinking mind believe a business-conscious individual with money on the mind is exactly what this country needs right now. Because if we get another four years of this shit (endless, unnecessary spending for nothing more than to fool the people into lining politicians pockets with lobby money), China will own us, and these internet censorship bills and worries about the 1% will be at the bottom of our priority list (you know, the government controls net access in China already, but they have free healthcare :thumbsup: thanks Obama, for paving the way for them).

You know, republicans, business men, and most conservative politicians believe a free-market is the best thing for us, and with that belief come policies like allowing the net to remain uncensored, and letting small businesses sprout up without tons of government regulation and red-tape (small business like Unix and Apple and Microsoft and IBM were at one time, whom are the industry giants that made your precious net possible whether you like them or not), and letting business like GM and Bank of America fail despite their strong ties to the American-Identity (and giving them the opportunity to start over, with a fucking bankruptcy like everyone else!), and encouraging growth, development, and innovation in a healthcare industry not tethered by government involvement in their economic affairs. Conservative politicians believe in a free-market because it works; it may not be fair, but it works. Fucking 99%...wtf? Do you want a job? You need that 1% to be happy to provide you with one...but oh, wait...those stank-ass hippies would probably answer no, wouldn't they? They'd rather take the government dole, pretend to be retarded or act like obesity is a reason for tax-payers to feed them more, and not pay any taxes, and throw their hands up in the air like "wtf happened?" when some other country comes in here and says our laws don't mean shit anymore, we have to do things their way, because they own the government...and, whoops, the government owns the biggest companies in the most important industries to our economy....thanks to who again? Obama.

So yeah...four more years of this shit, i think not. I think we've had about as much as we can stand of Obama. For your country's sake, for your own...please do not vote for socialism...it will end us.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-17 05:45:39 Reply

At 11/3/11 05:13 PM, Ravariel wrote: and the success of the Arab Spring.

That's an interesting way to describe it.

Obama's polling at about 47% favorable right now, and is beating all of the republicans in the primary race by 16% or more in head-to-head matchups.


Say what now


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-17 14:31:08 Reply

At 11/17/11 05:45 AM, SadisticMonkey wrote:
At 11/3/11 05:13 PM, Ravariel wrote: and the success of the Arab Spring.
That's an interesting way to describe it.

Say what you will about how it might end, but for now, the people of Egypt and Lybia are deciding their own direction. Whether or not we like that direction... well it's not up to us, is it?

Obama's polling at about 47% favorable right now, and is beating all of the republicans in the primary race by 16% or more in head-to-head matchups.
Say what now

That's from 2 months ago. I actually can't find the poll where I got my numbers, which make me suspect something was off about them. However, let us take the most recent Gallup Polls:

Against a generic Republican opponent, for the last two months Obama has been losing by 8 points. This month he has pulled even.

Against individual opponents, he is tied only with Romney (I consider anything less than 3 points a tie, and Obama leads by 1.8 on average), and beats the rest of the field by 8 points or more (Except for Paul, whom he only leads by 6).


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-19 12:57:14 Reply

"Electability exists along a spectrum and not in absolutes."
-Nate Silver of the NYT's 538 Blog

Rav, I'm linking to RCP's polling pages. NOTE: these change on a weekly basis so remember an argument made today may not be reflected in the polls tomorrow.

Obama vs. Republican Field

I prefer looking at the Obama vs Republican poll instead of the individual Republicans running. The reason is I think there is too much respondant bias involved with these polls. In short; ppl may not be telling the truth about how they will vote in order to support a candidate.

I think Obama vs Republican is closer to the question: will you vote to re-elect Obama? As of today Obama is ahead but by only 0.4% (RCP average).

Obama Approval Rating

Obama's approval rating is at 43.9% (RCP average). This is significantly below the 48% approval rating that historically guarantees a president re-election.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-19 13:15:41 Reply

Well that's if of course the Republicans find a decent candidate who can get higher than that. Historically you'll find that parties often lose when they can't find a hard candidate to rally around (i.e. election of 1860, 1836).


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-20 15:27:26 Reply

I don't know if it means anything, but as I look at historical trends, I notice that if Obama wins this election, it'll be the first time in ages that three consecutive Presidents have all served eight year terms. The last that happened was when Jefferson, Madison, and Monroe did it back in the early 1800s. Could that be a sign that Obama is doomed to fail? Or are we about to see another shift in Presidential trends?


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-20 23:08:14 Reply

Obama has been worse than Bush on every single issue which is some kind of achievement I guess, too bad it's a bad one.

The only reason he stands a chance to be re-elected is because all the republican candidates are clowns.

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-25 08:40:44 Reply

Fortunately, there's no way Obama can lose to any of those pathetic clowns. Unfortunately, there's no better choice than Obama.

Good thing I'll still be 17 so I won't have to decide between voting for the best of the shit-pile or not voting at all.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-25 10:50:24 Reply

At 11/25/11 08:40 AM, camobch0 wrote: Fortunately, there's no way Obama can lose to any of those pathetic clowns.

I still think there's time for a dark horse candidate to come in and garner enough support to beat Obama. History has shown that some people can have brilliant campaigns within a short period of time, come from seemingly nowhere, and win the Presidency. Isn't that how Jimmy Carter more or less got into office?


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-25 16:14:07 Reply

At 11/17/11 03:17 AM, EoD696 wrote: So yeah...four more years of this shit, i think not. I think we've had about as much as we can stand of Obama. For your country's sake, for your own...please do not vote for socialism...it will end us.

Got any points with examples worth reading? Lurkers like myself loathe rants. Please, stick to the topic instead of launching off on a partisan rant. Boring post is boring.


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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-25 19:32:27 Reply

At 11/25/11 08:40 AM, camobch0 wrote: Fortunately, there's no way Obama can lose to any of those pathetic clowns. Unfortunately, there's no better choice than Obama.

Okay, elect your incompetent dictator one more time. Do it, go to war against Iran, spread your military further, but don't bitch when the USA faces its downfall, and don't whine when more terrorist attempts are made against your declining country because they supposedly hate your "freedoms."

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Response to Obama 12: Invincible or Unelectable 2011-11-25 20:10:15 Reply

At 11/25/11 07:32 PM, Preternatural wrote:
Okay, elect your incompetent dictator one more time. Do it, go to war against Iran, spread your military further, but don't bitch when the USA faces its downfall, and don't whine when more terrorist attempts are made against your declining country because they supposedly hate your "freedoms."

I don't want that asshole as the president, but is it better to have an insane religious asshole who will fuck us up even worse than Obama will? I don't support ANY of the current candidates for president, but we might as well chose the one who will fuck us up the least. Hopefully sometime in the semi-distant future we will be able to elect someone like Elizabeth Warren. But then again, this is Amuricaaa.


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