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At 9/1/10 08:09 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote: Well said though Waggs made a better point but still, you got it as well.

Too bad for John Lenin though...

Sad little troll. I think you just 'found' yourself, although that probably happens quite often for you.

No point debating with someone who's clearly not interested in the facts.

At 9/1/10 08:34 PM, VladimirLenin wrote:

No point debating with someone who's clearly not interested in the facts.

Coming from someone who have been around for 3 years and has only 27 posts so far.

At 9/1/10 11:59 PM, SomeGuyInSomePlace wrote:

At 9/1/10 08:37 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote:

At 9/1/10 08:34 PM, VladimirLenin wrote:

No point debating with someone who's clearly not interested in the facts.

Coming from someone who have been around for 3 years and has only 27 posts so far.

I really don't think NG status has anything to do with how smart you are...

Except when someone has a low post count, it's hard to take the said person seriously. To be fair I wasn't taking this topic seriously either since it's going to be the same thing anyway. As I said, too bad for Lenin, he was a great musician.

At 9/1/10 02:38 PM, RWT wrote: Here were the options the United States had, as they presented themselves in the late 60's:

A. Pull out
B. Kill everyone in Vietnam with communist sympathies and burn down all of the region's forests, using gunship brigades and missile cruisers to rain down holy hell on everyone within a hundred miles of Tôn %u0110%u1EE9c Th%u1EAFng

A guerrilla war can only be won by killing all of the guerrillas.

Pull out, yes. Failure is always an option. However, kill the entire Vietnamese populace with communist sympathies? No.

Remember, the objective of American intervention in Vietnam was to protect South Vietnam. South Vietnam had asked for US help, and the US was glad to answer because we did not want another communist country in the region.

It's a bit difficult to grasp, but we were not there to defeat the North Vietnamese, but instead we were there to stave off the North Vietnamese until the South Vietnamese military was strong enough to handle the situation with minimum US help. What went wrong was the US ended up becoming one of the main belligerents, while South Vietnam did not improve as expected.

The US lost a war it was meant to loose because we had expected the South Vietnamese to win it. We could not have possibly "won" because our mission was not to win.

War is a balance. Killing everything in sight doesn't work in today's world. Unfortunately, politics and civilians run the US military.

At 8/31/10 09:07 PM, Crayzorder wrote:

At 8/31/10 09:07 PM, Valor56 wrote:

At 8/31/10 08:47 PM, LoliTastic wrote: Nah we lost. You can never win a guerrilla war. Think American Revolution

The Americans won you idiot!So GTFO

Horrible, horrible troll.
You coulda made it less obvious.

Actually, and unfortunately, he's not a troll. He's just 12.

If you were to argue the measure of victory in warfare is that the number of bodies you lay waste to in the enemy's ranks is significantly higher than the number of bodies you send home in flag-draped coffins, then I think you can pretty well say that the US won the war. If you argue victory in terms of objectives being accomplished, I think you can say it was a partial US victory, given that Communist Vietnam was in no position, and had no desire after the war, to expand its borders beyond that which it possessed after its final 1975 invasion (containment strategy success). The fact that the Communist power structure was basically dismantled 11 years after the consolidation may be as much a reflection on the absolute devastation that the US occupation inflicted on the country as much as the ill-timed collectivization of the economy instituted by the inept postwar government. I agree that the Vietnam War took a lot of life, possibly unnecessarily, but it's hard to argue that the resulting political conditions that took root in Vietnam were anything other than a resounding success for the United States. We have better diplomatic relations with Vietnam than we do with Cuba, and we've never even really had a war with Communist Cuba.

No damn crazy vietnamese can build traps and they suffered too, war is just a huge sufferable thing that just makes people die,cry and pretty much feel like crap after they kill someone.

Nobody wins when people turn to violence.

The Vietnam was pretty pointless, they lost so many lived for a horrible reason and so much of those people were also tortured, the people that did come home, I hear alot of them weren't sane when they came home!