ETA are sons of bitches

[DanAbnormal]

ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/11/04 12:41 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote: ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

What's ETA? I think we should all club together to get you lessons in how to form comprehendable sentances.

[DanAbnormal]

At 3/11/04 01:56 PM, bumcheekcity wrote:

At 3/11/04 12:41 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote: ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

What's ETA? I think we should all club together to get you lessons in how to form comprehendable sentances.

its a group in spain dat want to be their own nation like da IRA in ireland

[StatiK]

At 3/11/04 01:56 PM, bumcheekcity wrote:

At 3/11/04 12:41 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote: ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

What's ETA? I think we should all club together to get you lessons in how to form comprehendable sentances.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/03/11/spain.blasts/index.html

[CapitalistSocialist]

At 3/11/04 01:56 PM, bumcheekcity wrote: What's ETA? I think we should all club together to get you lessons in how to form comprehendable sentances.

And bcc makes a fool of himself....
Ever heard of the Basque separist group ETA? You know... the ones who might have set off 10 bombs killing over 190 people?
Look before you leap BCC... you don't know everything.

[Flesh-shredder]

At 3/11/04 12:41 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote: ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

Talk properly before you start a thread.

It's been on the news everywhere this Spanish Terroists Bombing trains. Man would I hate to be in spain right now

[Dante]

Actually, no one has taken responsiblity for the bombs yet. It is very possible that it's the ETA, but it could be small, unknown group for all we know.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/11/04 02:32 PM, -Jamster- wrote: Ever heard of the Basque separist group ETA? You know... the ones who might have set off 10 bombs killing over 190 people?
Look before you leap BCC... you don't know everything.

Well... I don't know everything... Kinda why I asked the question "What's the ETA?"

To be honest, to deal with the ETA, i'd give them what they want. It is the only way to deal with terrorists, unless the people of Catalonya (The area they're fighting for, I think) want to be with Spain

I went to Catalonya two years ago, and the locals there wanted to be separate, I'd say, and there was graffiti everywhere "Catalonya no es Espagne!" [Catalonya is not Spain] We were constantly reminded that we were NOT in Spain. If this is the area they want, I say give it to them.

[DanAbnormal]

At 3/11/04 03:44 PM, bumcheekcity wrote:

At 3/11/04 02:32 PM, -Jamster- wrote: Ever heard of the Basque separist group ETA? You know... the ones who might have set off 10 bombs killing over 190 people?
Look before you leap BCC... you don't know everything.

Well... I don't know everything... Kinda why I asked the question "What's the ETA?"

To be honest, to deal with the ETA, i'd give them what they want. It is the only way to deal with terrorists, unless the people of Catalonya (The area they're fighting for, I think) want to be with Spain

I went to Catalonya two years ago, and the locals there wanted to be separate, I'd say, and there was graffiti everywhere "Catalonya no es Espagne!" [Catalonya is not Spain] We were constantly reminded that we were NOT in Spain. If this is the area they want, I say give it to them.

i live in malaga (south spain) and they piss about down here aswell cos of tourists. like one of u guys said 'i would hate to be in spain at the moment' i dont even wanna be in spain at all.

[DanAbnormal]

At 3/11/04 03:10 PM, Dante wrote: Actually, no one has taken responsiblity for the bombs yet. It is very possible that it's the ETA, but it could be small, unknown group for all we know.

yeah, they say that some arabian group could be suspects but there all idiots anyway. and anyway jose maria aznar is a bit of a prat himself. good job its da elections on sunday.

[A-Carrot-By-Dr-Riot]

Does anyone know where I can hear an audio recording of someone speaking Basque, I've heard it is quite unique in the world.

[Salato]

At 3/11/04 03:44 PM, bumcheekcity wrote:
To be honest, to deal with the ETA, i'd give them what they want. It is the only way to deal with terrorists, unless the people of Catalonya (The area they're fighting for, I think) want to be with Spain:

First ETA are for the independence of the Basque region in the north, not Catalonia.
Also it would be impossible for the Spanish government to give them want they want as, firstly every other region that wants independence (like Catalonia) would go even further in trying to gain independence. It could cause the collapse of Spain into many smaller, weaker states. Also to be shown bowing to the wishes of terrorists would not only be completely immoral it may also lead to more terrorism as other groups think that they can force the government to do things through violence.

[Newt]

At 3/11/04 12:41 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote: ETA set off 3 bombs in madrid 2day in da mornin and killed 170 approx peple. if u kno bout dis stuff wot do u fink we should do

I think we should look at the facts.

In the past, ETA's attacks have been:
*Nowhere near as large as this
*Targeted at political/business leaders (Very rarely civilians)
*Preceeded by phone messages telling when and where the attacks are going to take place

This was a highly organized attack over a good sized area. No warning was given and no group has taken responsibility.

It's highly unlikely that this was the work of the ETA, and even the news agencies are leaning more and more towards Al Queda now.

Theres some report going on now about police finding a note in London talking about the attack in Spain and some large scale attack on the United States being 90% ready.

I hope your all ready to be bombarded with 'Al Queda' 100 times a day again.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/11/04 04:47 PM, Salato wrote: Also to be shown bowing to the wishes of terrorists would not only be completely immoral it may also lead to more terrorism as other groups think that they can force the government to do things through violence.

How do we deal with terrorists then? Kill them? Nope, for every one you kill another two join the cause. Imprison them? Well, that'll be useful.

How on earth can you fight was is effectively an idea?

[StatiK]

I was just watching a story about this on CNN, and the woman reporting pronounced "ETA" as "ehtah" instead of "ee-tee-ay".

[Reverend-Kyle]

Terrorism is effective, but I think a referendum might be more useful. It seems like the political leaders don't like giving people what they want... not since the 30's, at least.

[shazzam]

They still aren't sure if it was ETA, since they've found a van with Muslim stuff in it, very close to some of the stations.

[JoS]

At 3/11/04 05:18 PM, bumcheekcity wrote: How on earth can you fight was is effectively an idea?

TV?

I heard Al-Qaida claimed responsiblity for it,a nd a truck was discovered with bomb stuff and taped parts of the Koran in Arabic.

[D2Kvirus]

At 3/11/04 02:04 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote:
its a group in spain dat want to be their own nation like da IRA in ireland

Basque speratists, actually - NOT like the IRA in Northern Ireland.

However, as usual in ANY case of massive terrorism, some dumb FUCK has to try and label al-Qu'ida for doing so, as demonstrated here. Take a look at the cover of (who else?) The Daily Mail, and it has a picture of the carnage, and a picture of Ob-L.

Am I the only one that finds such a practise offensive, callous and cold-blooded in the extreme? It happened after the Bali bombings, and even when a plane crashes the first thing they do is suspect terrorists rather than such nominal things as weather or pilot error. If the Spaniards are blaming ETA, who have - in the past - assassinated top Government officials, used carbombs and so forth, than I think their comment holds more weight than some off-the-cuff attempt to once again prove that Osama bin-laden is responsible for every act of international terrorism.

I've heard people saying the date holds meaning (11/3, in US dates), forgetting the fact that you can give anything a meaning if you make some shit up - just watch The Matrix for a good example. Didn't anyone notice the Spanish elections are this weekend, and if you want to make a bold and brassy statement, do so with high explosives in well populated areas. Yes, the political wing of ETA (Batasuna) have denied being involved in this act, which is unusual of them, but it's actually highly unusual for terrorist organisations to admit responsibility - 9/11 an obvious exception.

But look at it - 192 people are dead, countless injured - do you think they care if you point fingers at whichever Islamic boogyman takes your fancy? Spaniards know the threat of ETA, while the US put them on their Terrorism List to make it look like they cared - while buttering them up to go to Iraq.

Wake up - terrorism is closer to home than you make it out to be. But if there are people on this site that think Iraqis were responsible for 9/11, and Osama for Bali, while Blair is making it out as a godsend for his Terrorism Bill (yes, we had lockdown in London until it was clearly a pointless exercise in trying to scare us), we're doing their job for them. After all, when were you more scared of al-Qu'ida: August 2001, or October 2001?

[Slizor]

I think we should look at the facts.

In the past, ETA's attacks have been:
*Nowhere near as large as this
*Targeted at political/business leaders (Very rarely civilians)
*Preceeded by phone messages telling when and where the attacks are going to take place

Just to play Devil's Advocate......There has recently been a crackdown on ETA, they've had like 650 members jailed and 4 (suspected) bombings foiled recently. Maybe this bombing is a backlash, they've been provoked into terrorism (before it could be argued that it was a guerrilla war since they rarely targeted civilians, as you said.)

Personally I don't think we should guess, or blame people out of hand. I wouldn't want to see a repeat of the 9/11 trial by hysteria.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/12/04 08:24 AM, Slizor wrote: Just to play Devil's Advocate......There has recently been a crackdown on ETA, they've had like 650 members jailed and 4 (suspected) bombings foiled recently.

Big deal. Terrorist groups only have to get lucky once. Let's say The ETA planned 36 bombings in a year. Let's say the police had a 97% Success Rate. They've still won, because they've succeeded in the attack and the targets have been hit.

[Reverend-Kyle]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, terrorism is effective. It's a really good way to agitate those in power.

[TheMason]

At 3/12/04 08:00 AM, D2KVirus wrote:

At 3/11/04 02:04 PM, darkmaster2000 wrote:

Yes, the political wing of ETA (Batasuna) have denied being involved in this act, which is unusual of them, but it's actually highly unusual for terrorist organisations to admit responsibility - 9/11 an obvious exception.

I'm not sure where you have gotten your expertise in terrorist behavior, but you are quite wrong on this count. After most major and minor attacks MANY groups clamor to claim responsibility. Even if they had no part in the attack. In fact there is so much "noise" from groups that it makes the job of investigators and intelligence gatherers that much more difficult.

As for the ETA there does appear to be an Islamist connection, yes there are the upcoming Spanish elections but there was also a recent attack at a Masonic Temple in Turkey by Islamists just days ago.

Also BCC, it would be nice if we could sit down with UBL and solve our differences like civilizied people. However, that would only contribute to more terrorist attacks. It is in their mindset that political ends can be accomplished through terror and force, and in UBL's case he sees the West as weak and corrupt needed to be removed so that the Sha'ria (7th C. Islamic law) may flourish.

In short BCC, if we conducted ourselves according to your way of thinking we would probably be living in a savage kill or be killed world. Are you ready to kill to stay alive?

[TheMason]

At 3/12/04 12:38 PM, Kyle_22 wrote: I've said it before, and I'll say it again, terrorism is effective. It's a really good way to agitate those in power.

Read Caleb Carr's The Lessons of Terror, it is a historical perspective on the use of terror to further political means and its consequences.

In the end Terrorism fails.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/12/04 02:38 PM, TheMason wrote: Also BCC, it would be nice if we could sit down with UBL and solve our differences like civilizied people. However, that would only contribute to more terrorist attacks.

Don'#t think it would: Bin Laden hates the US because of it's blatant hypocracy and lies to the world for the past say... 40 years. Maybe showing him you're willing to change woul take the fight out of him. Well, probably not, but it would definately gain you piblic support.

It is in their mindset that political ends can be accomplished through terror and force, and in UBL's case he sees the West as weak and corrupt needed to be removed so that the Sha'ria (7th C. Islamic law) may flourish.

Purely out of interest, how else is a small group of Fundamentalists going to accomplish their means? Well, now we've finished talking about the KKK, what about Bin Laden?

In short BCC, if we conducted ourselves according to your way of thinking we would probably be living in a savage kill or be killed world. Are you ready to kill to stay alive?

My way of thinking being that if we step back and drop less bombs, the world woiul dbe a better place?

Yes, I'm ready to kkill to stay alive, I just dont think the threat to myself is so great as to warrant the killing.

[FUNKbrs]

At 3/11/04 03:44 PM, bumcheekcity wrote: To be honest, to deal with the ETA, i'd give them what they want.

So you would reward murderers? Doesn't that legitimize the actions? DOESN'T THAT ONLY ENCOURAGE THEM?!!!

People gave Germany what they wanted too. It was called "appeasement". No suprise, but it didn't stop the world war, it only allowed Germany to become more powerful before it.

[D2Kvirus]

At 3/12/04 02:38 PM, TheMason wrote:

I'm not sure where you have gotten your expertise in terrorist behavior, but you are quite wrong on this count. After most major and minor attacks MANY groups clamor to claim responsibility. Even if they had no part in the attack. In fact there is so much "noise" from groups that it makes the job of investigators and intelligence gatherers that much more difficult.

20 years of the IRA bombing my country, thank you. Can you compare with that one? If not, don't assume you're an authority on the subject, OK?

As for the ETA there does appear to be an Islamist connection, yes there are the upcoming Spanish elections but there was also a recent attack at a Masonic Temple in Turkey by Islamists just days ago.

Pity it wasn't Eta - Basque Separatists, who concentrate their efforts for the past 30 years solely in Spain, and Spain alone? Stop it, you're killing me. An Islamist group claimed responsibility for that one, and there aren't any arguments.

Also, look at the aftermatch of the Bali bombing - while Bush was jumping up and down stating it was Osama who did it, the Australian investigators took charge and found the real culprits (not al-Qu'ida, sorry), while not trampling over the Indonesian authorities to do their job.

Anyway, ill-informed jackasses aside, I've spotted a MASSIVE difference between this and 9/11.

For a start, after this happened, both the King of Spain - and the rest of the Royal Family - and Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar appeared in public to try and restore some semblance of calm and order amid the chaos, and to reassure the citizens. On 9/11, Bush ran and hid for a long time, no-one knowing where he was, as he jumped from one place ot the next to protect himself.

Also, the aftermath.
Last night, Spainish streets were filled with people mourning and showing solidarity against Eta. There were two million in Madrid, one million in Barcelona (capital of the Catalan region), and hundreds of thousands in Valencia and other large cities. However, even Basque cities, like Bilbao and San Sebastian had large protests against Eta. There was nothing like this post 9/11 in the US, as most people were running like headless chickens before hiding under the bed.

So, I would appreciate no more of this one-upsmanship crap from people like TheMason. It's offensive to those in Spain, and I don't recall you appreciating it when the world told you to stop exploiting 9/11 for your own ends last week.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/12/04 04:24 PM, JudgeFUNK wrote: People gave Germany what they wanted too. It was called "appeasement". No suprise, but it didn't stop the world war, it only allowed Germany to become more powerful before it.

Then, AFTER the First World War, we did our best to crush them into dust... Which caused the Second World War...

[Reverend-Kyle]

At 3/13/04 10:26 AM, bumcheekcity wrote:

At 3/12/04 04:24 PM, JudgeFUNK wrote: People gave Germany what they wanted too. It was called "appeasement". No suprise, but it didn't stop the world war, it only allowed Germany to become more powerful before it.

Then, AFTER the First World War, we did our best to crush them into dust... Which caused the Second World War...

Did anyone try to stop Russia from getting what it wanted (that "buffer-zone")? Did a war start? Not really.

As for terrorism failing, I don't think it will. How can it? It's cheap, and it gets the point across. Like... beer, I guess. Has beer failed? Maybe I shouldn't make such foolish comparisons, and maybe I should read the book.

[lapslf]

I highly doubt it was ETA. First of all, the attack wasn't anything like ETA, like others explained before, but secondly, it would be really stupid for the ETA to launch an attack now, with the elections on sunday. I mean, the current government is very anti-ETA, and would never give the Basques any more independence, so why committing such an act, wich increases the hate towards the ETA and the Basques? More people will vote for the government party now, making matters for the Basques only worse.

Al Quaida could be behind this. I mean, the Spanish government is constantly kissing Bush's butt, and sent a lot of troops to Iraq. After the US and the UK, Spain would be the most logical target for an Al Quaida attack.