i stumped a vegetarian.

[darksytze]

at my college there's this group of vegetarians that have meetings and plan out events, go around with a camera asking about people on their stance on vegetarianism, spewing their elitist self-righteous moralistic bullshit around. they thought it was funny to point out and argue with people who were eating meat in the canteen, i was eating a mighty delicious ham and cheese sandwich and then they creeped up on me, shoving a microphone up my nose and commenced the gestapo on me. :(

basically they saw i was eating meat, and pointed their finger at me and labelled me as an anti-christ. i asked what they eat, they mentioned meat substitutes, soy, tofu, fruit and whatever. i brought it up to their attention that eating meat substitutes and what-not doesn't redeem you for the suffering of animals (as they call it), and then they argued i was talking out of my arse, i pointed out that millions of animals die just because of their dieting habits, and i told them that going around pointing fingers at people whilst they're just as responsible and morally-repulsive as any carnivore out there is hypocritical and makes them stupid, i told them that a few million unintentional animal deaths shouldn't get in the way of their moral trip, and told them to continue filming, the next person they spoke to referred to me and they stopped ''filming''.

cool story bro?

[Auz]

Meh.. I got a vegan girlfriend and even she doesn't like it when her fellow vegans/vegetarians try to convert meat-eaters into their life style like that. Mostly because in 9 out of 10 cases they're just being a major annoyance and are just making an ass out of themselves. It's giving vegans a bad name.

On top of that, I think vegetarians are being a little hypocritical when placing arguments about animal cruelty. Eggs, leather, milk etc. are still coming from the same mistreated animals meat comes from. Hence why I support veganism much more than vegetarianism. Although of course there could be other very good reasons to become a vegetarian.

[Fluffington]

At 1/25/10 10:05 AM, Auz wrote: Meh.. I got a vegan girlfriend and even she doesn't like it when her fellow vegans/vegetarians try to convert meat-eaters into their life style like that. Mostly because in 9 out of 10 cases they're just being a major annoyance and are just making an ass out of themselves. It's giving vegans a bad name.

On top of that, I think vegetarians are being a little hypocritical when placing arguments about animal cruelty. Eggs, leather, milk etc. are still coming from the same mistreated animals meat comes from. Hence why I support veganism much more than vegetarianism. Although of course there could be other very good reasons to become a vegetarian.

I'd say go full vegan or just don't.

Also to DarkSytze, I do think you are talking out of your ass, you point out that what they are doing are not helping animals at all and are still damaging animals, and their diets makes them stupid, without any backing up on your arguments, as to exactly WHY and what studies have shown that, don't just believe what you want to believe okay? But by all means, enjoy your meat eating habits.

I don't like it when people go out of their way to convert people ether, as I was once on the receiving end when I turned into a vegan, from "friends" and families force feeding me, forming my prejudice against meat eaters for a period of time.

[darksytze]

At 1/25/10 11:23 AM, Frank-The-Hedgehog wrote: Also to DarkSytze, I do think you are talking out of your ass, you point out that what they are doing are not helping animals at all and are still damaging animals, and their diets makes them stupid, without any backing up on your arguments

vegetarians that do it for the moral aspect chant that not eating meat redeems them from any guilt they should have, as if accidentally grinding wild life into a pulp isn't as bad because it's unintentional and thus isn't as bad as the torturewerks vegetarians claim most places to be.

point is, for vegetarians to enjoy their meat-free diets, millions of animals still die just because they don't want to eat meat, just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you aren't directly responsible for contributing to this entire pollution.

[OneWhoListens]

I have no problem with vegetarians, it's missionaries that bother me. I don't like people telling me what to do or what not to do. But I suppose most people don't, actually.

[Urban-Champion]

I once knew a Vegan who owned a car with a Leather interior.

[Chronamut]

I don't understand - they make it seem like plants don't have feelings..

DO THEY NOT HEAR THE SCREAMS OF AGONY OF THE CABBAGE WHILE THEY ARE BOILING IT ALIVE??

[JesusBukkake]

what if a vegetarian were to say that the voles that get chpped up in wheat threshers live a happy outdoor life before having a quick death, whereas the animals you pay to be killed live a sad life in a cage being fed nutrients, and one is far worse than the other?

and what if a vegetarian were to say that it's impossible to live a blameless life but what a moral person should do is try to limit their immorality, and one way they see of doing this is to limit the amount of animals that die

like if 10 voles die for every field of grain then you're responsible for far more vole death, because you've got to feed the cattle grain as well as feed yourself grain (and then you've got to kill the cattle) - very wasteful

consider damage limitation - maybe you should grow your own food, but since you're not, you may as well recycle your cans

or what if one was to say that you shouldn;'t get all your arguments from maddox, he's a fucking idiot

just like you

fucking idiot

[Sensationalism]

At 1/25/10 11:35 AM, DarkSytze wrote: vegetarians that do it for the moral aspect chant that not eating meat redeems them from any guilt they should have, as if accidentally grinding wild life into a pulp isn't as bad because it's unintentional and thus isn't as bad as the torturewerks vegetarians claim most places to be.

point is, for vegetarians to enjoy their meat-free diets, millions of animals still die just because they don't want to eat meat, just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you aren't directly responsible for contributing to this entire pollution.

Not millions. They save more than is inadvertently killed, it is worse to intentionally kill something, and things have to die in order for us to eat. I don't think they deny that, they just want people to create less harm to animals which are more sentient. Plus gardens, and buying local=huge reduction of rodents ground up in farming equipment.

BUT they were being total stupid smug assholes so good on you for showing them up, whether what you said was true or not :P

[Saxturbation]

I met a vegan the other day and they were trying to argue about how much more healthy it is. It isn't. You don't get the proper proteins, fats, or even some minerals that you get from meats. There is a tip for you. But JUST meat is bad too.

[HazeStigma]

Im fine with vegetarians, the person i admire is one, i can perfectly understand why you wouldn't eat meat because you feel guilty for those poor cuddly things.
Although, in my point of view, the animal is already dead, there's nothing we can do about it and there is no way to stop the world from eating meat, the meat itself is tasty, usable in lots of dishes and is required for a balanced diet, and hey.. its a way of nature.
Although, if you don't eat your meat, the animal's death will be in vain, and its life would had been ended to be dumped in a land fill and corrupt our earth even more.
Although i can't stand vegens/vegetarians who strut around saying im a murderer because i eat meat, they're arrogant and think they're always right and don't listen to a single argument you give them... Ugh.
We leave you alone, leave us alone, kay? Lets kill Om nom nom our food peacefully...

[Chronamut]

At 1/25/10 11:59 AM, HazeStigma wrote: stuff

couldnt agree with you more man - I've never really come across any vegans - but if I did - I could argue with them that since they only eat vegetables I could kill them and eat them, and I don't think anyone would care..

they might as well try to convert animals that eat other animals to eat plants too - see how well that turns out for them.

oh and here's a thought - if everyone in the world only eats plants - what happens when you turn the world into a desert because you've farmed every single fucknig acre of the planet to death? Better not use manure, thats an animal product - and thats baaad...

[Sensationalism]

At 1/25/10 11:59 AM, Saxturbation wrote: I met a vegan the other day and they were trying to argue about how much more healthy it is. It isn't. You don't get the proper proteins, fats, or even some minerals that you get from meats. There is a tip for you. But JUST meat is bad too.

Protein-gotten very easily from MANY sources, including vegan ones. Some examples include: nuts, beans, grains, sprouted seeds.
Fats-meat has what, saturated fat and cholesterol. THose are bad. Polyunsaturated and monounsaturated are the good fats, and those are found in things like nuts and canola or olive oils.
Minerals- B12 and B6. Found in modified cereals and soymilks, can come from plant sources like lentils, produced in the body so a deficiency can take years to occur

Vegan diet is healthy and not lacking in anything thank you very much. How hard is it to do a little research before being prejudice?

At 1/25/10 11:59 AM, HazeStigma wrote: Although, in my point of view, the animal is already dead, there's nothing we can do about it and there is no way to stop the world from eating meat, the meat itself is tasty, usable in lots of dishes and is required for a balanced diet, and hey.. its a way of nature.

ANIMALS DIE TO KEEP YOUR FAT ASS ALIVE. I love that saying. Anyway, they are manufactured and killed because you want to eat them. If everyone thought changing the world was impossible, nothing would have ever changed.

Although, if you don't eat your meat, the animal's death will be in vain, and its life would had been ended to be dumped in a land fill and corrupt our earth even more.

Supply and demand. Demand goes down, they kill less of them. Wouldn't be cost effective to produce a bunch of extra that end up not selling.

Although i can't stand vegens/vegetarians who strut around saying im a murderer because i eat meat, they're arrogant and think they're always right and don't listen to a single argument you give them... Ugh.

Meat is murder. Not untrue. And they probably don't listen because your reasons are shit.

We leave you alone, leave us alone, kay? Lets kill Om nom nom our food peacefully...

Not true.

At 1/25/10 12:04 PM, Chronamut wrote: couldnt agree with you more man - I've never really come across any vegans - but if I did - I could argue with them that since they only eat vegetables I could kill them and eat them, and I don't think anyone would care..

That doesn't even make sense.

they might as well try to convert animals that eat other animals to eat plants too - see how well that turns out for them.

That's retarded. You have no understanding of the reasoning behind vegetarianism or veganism if you think something as stupid as that.

oh and here's a thought - if everyone in the world only eats plants - what happens when you turn the world into a desert because you've farmed every single fucknig acre of the planet to death? Better not use manure, thats an animal product - and thats baaad...

Hmmm. WELL eating animals harms and uses more land than eating plants does. Those animals you eat, well we farm plants for them to eat. Plus you eat plants, so that's more land. And your animals need to graze. And the cows produce too much methane.
Eating just plants cuts down on the amount of land used. Think harder next time.

[Balazeal]

At 1/25/10 11:47 AM, Chronamut wrote: DO THEY NOT HEAR THE SCREAMS OF AGONY OF THE CABBAGE WHILE THEY ARE BOILING IT ALIVE??

Ya know that sound that water makes when it boils?

[vow2thou]

The human mind has been able to develop so rapidly due to the proteins inherent in meat.

In the natural world, mammals are readily identified as the most adaptable creatures; mostly being carnivorous, they are intelligent hunters and/or scavengers. I would not consider it a coincidence that the dominant species are as such: the nutrients provided by meat grant potential for both physical and mental development.

It would not be an exaggeration to state that our current dominance as a species is, in part, due to our omnivorous heritage. For most animals, meat is a necessity, else they suffer malnutrition. Fortunately, humans are in a position whereby they have a choice in the matter.

Yup, just an unbiased factual dump. Sorry for contributing little to the thread.

[Conal]

Hey brah, that is a c00l story!

[darksytze]

At 1/25/10 11:47 AM, JesusBukkake wrote: what if a vegetarian were to say that the voles that get chpped up in wheat threshers live a happy outdoor life before having a quick death, whereas the animals you pay to be killed live a sad life in a cage being fed nutrients, and one is far worse than the other?

i'm all in for better treatment of animals, but if by that means i should stick to an inconvenient lifestyle which doesn't suit me i would rather eat meat, besides that; i really can't be arsed. would you eat meat knowing the animal you are eating lived a happy life?

and what if a vegetarian were to say that it's impossible to live a blameless life but what a moral person should do is try to limit their immorality, and one way they see of doing this is to limit the amount of animals that die

that's their cause, if they feel like a morally good person by not eating meat it's their business, my topic was also more about a bash pelted towards vegetarians that try to pry their way of thinking onto people who really can't be damned.

consider damage limitation - maybe you should grow your own food, but since you're not, you may as well recycle your cans

then again i don't have a moral qualm it. i'm in for better treatment of animals, but i don't need some self-righteous dipshit telling me that i'm a bad person for eating meat whilst they feel like they're a saint just because they stick to another diet. i'm not a vegetarian, i eat meat, i buy meat that's probably been produced from one of the million cows that are up to slaughter, i don't get a moral heartache every time i see a burger or something, get off my nuts?

or what if one was to say that you shouldn;'t get all your arguments from maddox, he's a fucking idiot

i did read maddox his article, and i found some similarities (maddox has a nice eloquently, if not harsh way of saying vegetarians that force their ways onto other people should get bent) in the arguments, but maddox is spot-on. i knew that during harvest season animals die, even more so now since there's more need for grain and what-not. i would suggest reading the article.

[ZeldaFreak701]

I had a vegan friend and I found myself trying to convince him to not be one more or less because he seemed to just want to lose weight, little did I know it was really for the ethical aspect of it. Hey do what you want with your body but don't tell me what to do with mine. I think vegan is a great idea if you're all for it, but I'm doing my own part for animals by not hurting them.

[Matt1010]

I have a few vegan friends which are ONLY girls, not one guy. It's really more of a trend for the whole "one person makes a difference" mentality.

[Slug-Gunner]

I decided not to eat meat simply because when I was 9, I saw a cow getting slaughtered.. it gave me the creeps so I stopped eating meat.

I really don't care about others, I never go around tring to convert people into a vegetarian, its all a waste of time. everyone has a choice

[Auz]

At 1/25/10 12:37 PM, vow2thou wrote: The human mind has been able to develop so rapidly due to the proteins inherent in meat.
Yup, just an unbiased factual dump. Sorry for contributing little to the thread.

Contributing very little indeed. I know this protein thing is a very popular argument to use against vegetarians and vegans. But if you would have bothered to look into it a little further or would've bothered to reach Sensationlisms post above, you would find out that that argument is nothing more than bullshit. There are other, much healthier ways to get protein which do not involve the slaughter of animals.

[JesusBukkake]

At 1/25/10 12:38 PM, DarkSytze wrote: i'm all in for better treatment of animals, but if by that means i should stick to an inconvenient lifestyle which doesn't suit me i would rather eat meat, besides that; i really can't be arsed.

Oh well, well done you. Never argue again, you just conceded. It's not that vegetarianims is wrong, it's that you couldn't give a shit about animal welfare. The gall of you for challenging vegetarians on animal welfare issues when you couldn't care less.

[JesusBukkake]

Oh and btw half of fucking India lives a vegetarian / vegan lifestyle, if you reckon a veggie diet is intrinsically lacking something

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_pr otein

if someone once told you otherwise and you believe them sans any actual research, you're a gullible fucking moron and you shouldn't be allowed to vote

[JesusBukkake]

At 1/25/10 11:59 AM, Saxturbation wrote: I met a vegan the other day and they were trying to argue about how much more healthy it is. It isn't. You don't get the proper proteins, fats, or even some minerals that you get from meats. There is a tip for you. But JUST meat is bad too.

just so there's no confusion, I think you are a gullible fucking moron and shouldn't be allowed to vote. No research skills, no thought-out opinion, just shooting your fucking mouth off about shit you know nothing of.

[gamekillereater]

Goddamnit, let a man enjoy his meat!
These control-freaks nowadays are getting out of hand.

[vow2thou]

At 1/25/10 12:46 PM, Auz wrote:

At 1/25/10 12:37 PM, vow2thou wrote: The human mind has been able to develop so rapidly due to the proteins inherent in meat.
Yup, just an unbiased factual dump. Sorry for contributing little to the thread.

Contributing very little indeed. I know this protein thing is a very popular argument to use against vegetarians and vegans. But if you would have bothered to look into it a little further or would've bothered to reach Sensationlisms post above, you would find out that that argument is nothing more than bullshit. There are other, much healthier ways to get protein which do not involve the slaughter of animals.

It's a matter of economy. There's more protein in x amount of meat than x amount of something else. The amount of substitute food required is quantitatively more. Now, humans being humans, this is fair enough, and one can produce those substitutes in sufficient quantities to render the point moot. Statistics available from: http://www.weightlossforall.com/protein_
content_from_good_source.htm

Do consider, however, the impracticality of sustaining every human on a non-meat diet, considering this.

Furthermore, meats provide a better source of protein, which vegetables and other plant sources cannot provide because of their inherent processes. To quote: "Vegetarians rely on plant sources for their daily protein. Plants don't contain the full range of essential amino acids and so are not as high in nutritional value as animal protein. But by eating a well-balanced diet that contains a variety of different foods, it's possible to consume the required amino acids." As quoted from BBC Health. Further citing this source, "You should eat two to three servings of protein every day from both plant and animal sources". Both yours, and Sensationlisms, argument that there are healthier methods of obtaining proteins other than meat is actually flawed. Meat is necessary for an optimal diet, as that is how the human body functions.

However, before you think I'm kicking off a shitfest, I will reiterate that you can live a healthy lifestyle without eating meat. If you prefer that, I implore you to do so. But please do not assert something as fact when it simply is not.

[Chronamut]

if i ever catch a vegan eating cakes, or jello, or even most candies - I will kill them for their hypocritical actions - as all those things are made from either byproducts of meat, or things that come from animals.

I also dont understand why vegans won't drink milk - if you lived on a farm 500 years ago - do you really think you'd have access to half the stuff you do now, like soy milk? No! You would ALSO have to slaughter your OWN animals to survive - your lifestyle choice is only convenient because society makes it convenient for you - if society ever tanked and we all had to fend for ourselves - or if a genocide happened like did in countries in the past - guess what - your cute little helpless pets would be the first to get axed so you could SURVIVE. I concede that animals are fatty - but a vegetarian diet is also super expensive - and hell - half your vegetables prolly don't even contain half the nutrients they should because when people grow vegetables now- the fertelizer only contains nutrients for 2 things - one to make your fruit look nice and perfect, and the other to make them really big - those hot house tomatos you buy in the store? Completely nutritionless.

if you wanna be a true vegan - rent out a giant bit of land and grow enough food to sustain yourself - or have communal lots. Alot of vegans these days are just trendy upstart shits that think theyre better than everyone else.

[vow2thou]

At 1/25/10 01:03 PM, Chronamut wrote: ...or even most candies

I thought that was candles for just a second.

[Dragoonwing]

Eh, my girlfriend is a vegetarian so I honestly don't care by this point. She's quietly trying to convert me into a vegetarian but it's not working.

[Chronamut]

At 1/25/10 01:08 PM, vow2thou wrote:

At 1/25/10 01:03 PM, Chronamut wrote: ...or even most candies

I thought that was candles for just a second.

actually funny enuff old candles used to be made of beeswax.. which is an insect product.. thus animal prod.same with honey - regurgitated plant pollen :)