Election night.

[Complete]

Not sure if another thread was created, so go ahead and lock it if there was.

Today is election day in America.

Currently, two governor races in New Jersey and Virginia. So far the Republicans won Attorney General, Lt. Governor, and Governor of Virginia. New Jersey (My home state) is still pending, so far it seems we are leaning to Chris Christie, a Republican candidate. I am surprised how great he is doing, considering New Jersey is very democratic and Obama came here and endorsed Corzine, the democratic governor a lot.

Thoughts on any of this? Does this mean Americans are starting to lose confidence in Obama?

[Yorik]

I don't really see how the elections of several unrelated people imply that people are losing faith in Obama. However, the answer is basically yes... People ARE losing faith in him.

[Korriken]

well...

McDonnell pretty much slaughtered Deeds in the Virginia race, which was interesting to see. The New Jersey race is shaping up to be interesting.

the race in New York is fun to watch. Rino drops out, knowing she's got a snowball's chance in hell of winning when running against a Liberal Democrat and a Conservative, so she endorses.... the Liberal Democrat, as if that was really surprising.

people screaming and fighting on whether these elections are a referendum on Obama and I say... nah. This is a possible taste of the fun times to come next year, which will be more of a referendum. If this Conservative momentum keeps up, and several of them (or at least moderates who don't support the public option) win, Obama's plans and the Liberals bills may as well be used as toilet paper.

It's just part of the natural cycle of American Politics. one idea rises, the other falls, then it turns around and reverses. once someone does something really really stupid, the opposing view begins to grow. Eventually a conservative will make a bonehead move and Liberalism will rise again.

[Complete]

At 11/3/09 09:49 PM, Yorik wrote: I don't really see how the elections of several unrelated people imply that people are losing faith in Obama. However, the answer is basically yes... People ARE losing faith in him.

The reason why so many people bring that up is because in the presidential elections, Obama won New Jersey by so many votes. Now Obama is advertising for Corzine like hell, and if Corzine loses, it goes to show you people are not as behind as Obama as they once were.

[Dawnslayer]

Statistics time: according to NBC, 24% of polled Virginia voters said they chose their governor as a message of disapproval of President Obama.

Picking a governor...because you don't like the president. Picking a governor because you do like the president. Either way, the governor is NOT the president.

Who else thinks this is a stupid reason to vote for someone?

[Yorik]

At 11/3/09 10:28 PM, Dawnslayer wrote: Picking a governor...because you don't like the president. Picking a governor because you do like the president. Either way, the governor is NOT the president.

Who else thinks this is a stupid reason to vote for someone?

It's about as dumb as voting for someone because they are black.

[Complete]

Just in: Christie won the election.

[ToddM]

At 11/3/09 11:00 PM, Complete wrote: Just in: Christie won the election.

That was unexpected for him to win.

[aviewaskewed]

Based on what I'm hearing my fellow Jersians say (and the reason I voted for Christie personally) is we saw it as not being able to afford another 4 years of John Corzine and Christie was the lesser of two evils. There's hope that Christie might make some changes (he is a former US Attorney who has gained fame for his tough stance on corruption, something Jersey badly needs cleaned up), but in the end I think Christie won simply because he wasn't John Corzine, or affiliated with John Corzine.

Apparently the Democrats and everyone else badly miscalculated just how hated this Governor was, it's amazing to me how over this guy was with the national press though up until now. I imagine you'll be seeing some outlets outside of New Jersey spinning this story wrong as some kind of revolt by Jersey to the right, or a mandate on Obama, or some crap like that. Which it's not to my mind, it was the citizenry tossing out a politician who broke every single promise he made and screwed the citizenry over. Good work Jersey!!

[drDAK]

At 11/3/09 10:48 PM, Yorik wrote: It's about as dumb as voting for someone because they are black.

No one brought that issue up, dude.

[Korriken]

At 11/4/09 02:37 AM, drDAK wrote:

At 11/3/09 10:48 PM, Yorik wrote: It's about as dumb as voting for someone because they are black.

No one brought that issue up, dude.

same idea. voting for someone not based on their policies, but instead voting for someone based on something that has little or nothing to do with what they believe.

[Complete]

At 11/4/09 02:11 AM, aviewaskewed wrote: Based on what I'm hearing my fellow Jersians say (and the reason I voted for Christie personally) is we saw it as not being able to afford another 4 years of John Corzine and Christie was the lesser of two evils. There's hope that Christie might make some changes (he is a former US Attorney

It is relieving to have Christie, though he might be another politician and break his promises.

[Korriken]

At 11/4/09 02:59 PM, Complete wrote:

It is relieving to have Christie, though he might be another politician and break his promises.

depends, you gotta keep a sharp eye on how things are working out. some politicians try to fulfill their promises, but get blocked by their opposition, who later point out he failed to get his promises done.

then, you got the times when they simply fail to deliver.

[Warforger]

At 11/3/09 10:28 PM, Dawnslayer wrote: Statistics time: according to NBC, 24% of polled Virginia voters said they chose their governor as a message of disapproval of President Obama.

Picking a governor...because you don't like the president. Picking a governor because you do like the president. Either way, the governor is NOT the president.

Who else thinks this is a stupid reason to vote for someone?

That's not to mention the fact that Obama won in that state during presidential elections.

This happens all the time, people expect a leader who can magically fix there problems, so when there problems aren't gone the media turns on them. So far the only thing Obama did that I do not agree with is increase our national debt, the rest is all fine to me and personally I like him.

[aviewaskewed]

At 11/4/09 02:59 PM, Complete wrote: It is relieving to have Christie, though he might be another politician and break his promises.

I'll have to double check how the two houses are composed, but I think they're still heavily democrat, which might hamper some of Christies efforts. I'm not sure he can actually shrink the state government size since I believe he'll get fights on both side of the aisle there from people who are either looking to collect multiple pensions, or who have a long history of sticking cronies into state jobs for the pensions. We'll see.

Right now yeah, I'm happy to have a change in Trenton, now let's see if it's a change we can live with, after all we thought Corzine was going to be good for us when he was elected.

[Stoicish]

I think people making a bigger deal out of these elections are just blowing smoke out of their asses.

If the Democrats had won I am sure people would say, "This means people still support Obama." I would have said they were full of shit.

The Republicans, of course, won and I still find people to be full of shit when they say this is the end of Obama.

State elections count for exactly nothing. New Jersey was just pissed at their governor because he hadn't done much to fix the unemployment rate and they wanted him out of office.

In Virginia, they picked the Republican because they just liked him better.

This is all so stupid.

[ArtGuy9]

At 11/5/09 01:00 AM, Stoicish wrote:

In Virginia, they picked the Republican because they just liked him better.

I saw David Axelrod say that the NY-23 election was a "referendum" while the White House called Virginia and New Jersey "purely local".

Yeah, it would've been either way depending on who won.

[Korriken]

At 11/5/09 01:24 AM, ArtGuy9 wrote:

I saw David Axelrod say that the NY-23 election was a "referendum" while the White House called Virginia and New Jersey "purely local".

Yeah, it would've been either way depending on who won.

thats politics for you, especially the style of politics we see in washington today. Anything positive that happens for Obama is a nationwide trend, anything negative that happens to Obama is either just local, or somehow a victory for Obama anyway, for example the new york race could be seen as a double victory, "not only did we win! (barely) We also see the republican party fighting each other! (don't bother mentioning the war going on in the democrat party)

next year will be interesting to watch.

[Stoicish]

At 11/5/09 05:47 AM, Korriken wrote:
thats politics for you, especially the style of politics we see in washington today. Anything positive that happens for Obama is a nationwide trend, anything negative that happens to Obama is either just local, or somehow a victory for Obama anyway, for example the new york race could be seen as a double victory, "not only did we win! (barely) We also see the republican party fighting each other! (don't bother mentioning the war going on in the democrat party)

Oh yes, I find it incredibly stupid that anyone could make these elections seem like they mean something on a national level. They do not, but the media is going to make us think that they do.

As for the infighting in the Republican party it really isn't apparent, but there is some people claiming that moderate Republicans are fighting with the more conservative Republicans. There are also some questions as to if they should take the Tea Party protesters seriously.

What war going on in the Democrat party? You mean the Blue Dogs? HA! Sorry buddy, but they've been around for a while. I'm from Arkansas where Democrats have been in power since the end of the civil war. In fact, Blanch Lincoln is one of the FOUR Democrats who voted against health care reform.

[RydiaLockheart]

I don't see why people are saying the New Jersey governor's race was a referendum on Obama. Sure, Obama campaigned for Corzine, but politicians campaign for other politicians all the time. And, what happened was the voters tuned out Obama and voted for the opposing candidate because Corzine was an absolutely godawful governor. Two of the girls in my class are New Jersey voters, and are lifelong Democrats, but voted for Christie anyways because Corzine did an absolutely abysmal job.

But of course, losing two governor's races is terrible for the Democrats, who have the presidency, majorities in both houses, and just picked up a seat that hasn't been held by Democrats since the Civil War. I don't see the 2009 elections as being a referendum on Obama, but 2010 definitely will be.

[redzone]

There was an election?

[Complete]

At 11/5/09 12:36 PM, redzone wrote: There was an election?

There a few elections every year in the USA, mostly in November.

This year there was a race for Governor in two states, a race for two congressional seats, and a race for Mayor of NYC.

[Korriken]

At 11/5/09 09:10 AM, Stoicish wrote:

What war going on in the Democrat party? You mean the Blue Dogs? HA! Sorry buddy, but they've been around for a while. I'm from Arkansas where Democrats have been in power since the end of the civil war. In fact, Blanch Lincoln is one of the FOUR Democrats who voted against health care reform.

Lemme rephrase and clarify (like I'm always having to do)

the 'war' that is happening in the republican party that the media is yammering about, is the exact same fight that is going on in the democrat party. Neither side wants to acknowledge their side's fighting.

thats what I was getting at.

[Stoicish]

The thing is that for a while it seemed like the Republican party had solidarity and all had a central agenda.

Now it just seems like they are trying to figure out who they are: Moderate or Conservative.

I hope Moderate because the Democrats are just disappointing me every day.

[aviewaskewed]

At 11/5/09 09:42 PM, Stoicish wrote: The thing is that for a while it seemed like the Republican party had solidarity and all had a central agenda.

Now it just seems like they are trying to figure out who they are: Moderate or Conservative.

I hope Moderate because the Democrats are just disappointing me every day.

I think what's happening now is what always is happening within any large group of people, and certainly a large group not in power: Trying to reconfigure themselves and figure out what face to put forward to win votes. Because in the end that's the game, win votes and get offices. It's disheartening how politics seems to have degenerated into like a big game fight between two teams. The points are scored by who has the most offices...for fuck's sake it's supposed to be about representing your country and your values!!! Sadly I don't think we'll ever go back to that.

[SmilezRoyale]

At 11/6/09 01:44 AM, aviewaskewed wrote:

I think what's happening now is what always is happening within any large group of people, and certainly a large group not in power: Trying to reconfigure themselves and figure out what face to put forward to win votes. Because in the end that's the game, win votes and get offices. It's disheartening how politics seems to have degenerated into like a big game fight between two teams. The points are scored by who has the most offices...for fuck's sake it's supposed to be about representing your country and your values!!! Sadly I don't think we'll ever go back to that.

I hate to disappoint you, but politics has always been about getting your men in power. There was never a golden age of government. There were only days when the government was so small that even if it was corrupt to the core, it touched so little of it's country that society as a whole was left unharmed.

Government corruption becomes more evident not because the marks of corruption have become more extreme, but because the marks have become larger.

Keep voting for 'the other guy', keep voting for the other party. Keep getting fed lies about how things are going to change, and keep complaining when they don't.