Forum Topic: Put your money where you mouth is.

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SHIT-TANK

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Posted at: 11/2/09 12:42 AM

SHIT-TANK LIGHT LEVEL 18

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You may remember Proposition 8 that was past last November in California which banned gay marriage within the state. Recently a very religious group that has ties with the Proposition 8 movement is now pushing for a new initiative thatwillbe voted on in 2010. The bill is entitled the "2010 California Marriage Protection Act." and it has a very simple objective.

No party to any marriage shall be restored to the state of an unmarried person during the lifetime of the other party unless the marriage is void or voidable, as set forth in Part 2 of Division 6 of the Family Code.

source

Quite simply this group aims to ban divorce indefinably within the State of California. Mind you this is not some halfhearted attempt by a few religious radicals it's a full blown movement, they even plan to have A Wedding March on the Capitol. As a recent resident of California I can tell you that I see movement everywhere; PSAs and Billboards ect.

Religious or nonreligious, agree or disagree is of no relevance that's not my point. My point is the irony, the sweet delicious irony that's so thick you could drizzle it over steak and have it for dinner. If you're a Catholic of any denomination that opposes gay marriage this bill should make perfect sense to you, because getting divorced is against the word of Jesus seriously look it up, Mark 10:9-11.

However there are many people that oppose gay marriage that have no religious affiliation, they simply deem it unnatural and when it comes to child rearing there belief is having a same sex parental influence is damaging to a child's development and at it's worst just yields more homosexuals as it is their belief also that homosexuality is a lifestyle choice and not of biological origins.

It's these people who's opinion on this matter I'd like to hear.

We saw this happen with the recent Presidential election, many people voted for Barrack Obama without actually knowing what he stood for, and now that the deed is done they find themselves realizing that they don't actually agree with his policies.

So for those of you that oppose gay marriage but are not of a practicing religion or frankly not religious at all how do you feel about this bill? How do you feel when somebody else tells you what you can and cannot do with you're personal life? What do you think is next? Banning single parents? Marriage screening processes or child licenses?

2010 California Marriage Protection Act: Website

PSA

rawr

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ReiperX

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Posted at: 11/2/09 12:59 AM

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I don't see how enforcing this could be constitional, as far as a federal level.

But I don't see this passing, at least people passing it that know what it actually says.

I'm not a huge fan of divorce, and I think many people rush into it (although they rush into marriage just as fast) but forcing someone to stay married even in an abusive or adulterace relationship, sorry that's wrong on so many levels.


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BetaOrionis

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Posted at: 11/2/09 01:40 AM

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Eh, I don't know about this one.

While I do see it as another limitation on personal freedom, so's marriage. You enter into a marriage willfully, so you are voluntarily giving up some freedom in exchange for companionship. If the state made that companionship more permanent, I'd hope it would lead people to stop rushing into it, but knowing people, this would probably be a rare occurrence.

I think there would be an increase in murder / inexplicable deaths for spouses.

All in all, I can't seem to bring myself to care, since marriages to me are for people who want to stop putting effort into their relationships; Now you're stuck with the other person, instead of staying together just because you want to be together.


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ReiperX

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Posted at: 11/2/09 01:54 AM

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At 11/2/09 01:40 AM, BetaOrionis wrote: Eh, I don't know about this one.
All in all, I can't seem to bring myself to care, since marriages to me are for people who want to stop putting effort into their relationships; Now you're stuck with the other person, instead of staying together just because you want to be together.

I have to disagree on the marriage aspect. My wife and I are best friends and we put a lot of work in our relationship. But with marriage you get actual benefits that help tremendously (tax break in certain circumstances, easier to get a house, easier/cheaper on health insurance, and many other benefits). I don't feel stuck with her, but I have no desire to be with anyone other than her for the rest of my life.


Resigned

POOPIES

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Posted at: 11/2/09 02:26 AM

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I looked through your topical post to make sure, and I'm fairly certain now that you were serious when you wrote it, and not holding your tongue firmly in your cheek. Now that we've established that you were serious, it's my duty to inform you that that this group is expressly making fun of the Prop 8 campaign and the tactics that were used last year to pass it. Rather than being an addendum to the conservative movement, this is a dissidence against it, seeking to show the ridiculousness of banning something that should be the individual's decision to make and not the law's.

Put your money where you mouth is.

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darkrchaos

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Posted at: 11/2/09 02:57 AM

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I'm so sick of these religious freaks telling other what they want them to do. I'm all for believing in god or whatever or have morals, idc. But when u run around telling others how to live there lives that's taking away the freedom in America. This is America the land of the Free where you can do what ever you want as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, well that's what use to me. But all these religious people have to get in everyone elses business. Sorry for being so pissed off, im just so sick of these people telling us what to do just because it in the stupid bible.

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Memorize

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Posted at: 11/2/09 03:06 AM

Memorize FAB LEVEL 21

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Just one more reason why the Government shouldn't even be involved in marriage.


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darkrchaos

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Posted at: 11/2/09 03:13 AM

darkrchaos DARK LEVEL 09

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At 11/2/09 03:06 AM, Memorize wrote: Just one more reason why the Government shouldn't even be involved in marriage.

yea or stop the religious people people from telling others what to do.

What's the big deal with marriage anyways i don't get why they make such a big deal on it all.

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SadisticMonkey

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Posted at: 11/2/09 05:40 AM

SadisticMonkey FAB LEVEL 17

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LOL THIS ISN'T ACTUALLY REAL U KNO

The only thing more delusional than faith in god is faith in government.

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drDAK

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Posted at: 11/2/09 10:36 AM

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Marriage can be defined as anyone wants to define it. If two men or two women desire to get married who are you to fucking judge?

.

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estrago1

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Posted at: 11/2/09 05:19 PM

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Why can't these religious people just care about themselves? Why do they find it necessary to try and change everyone's life because it is different than theirs? It seems as though these people aren't happy unless others are suffering. Religion shouldn't have any part in government or marriage. I always thought religion was just a way for humans to answer those questions that we don't have answers to.

Now, I know all religious people aren't like this. I know many people who practice their religion to some extent but they aren't fanatics. Its these religious fanatics that give religion a bad name. These people need to be separated from society, quickly. Then we can let the government get to work with what is really important.

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aviewaskewed

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Posted at: 11/3/09 03:46 PM

aviewaskewed EVIL LEVEL 44

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Ok, now if people don't stop just reading the first post and replying, I'm gonna shut this. THE LAW IS NOT REAL!!!! IT HAS BEEN SHOWN TO NOT BE REAL!!!

So stop debating it like it is, if you want to debate the MERIT or non-merit of such a law hypothetically passing, cool, ok. But this particular movement has been proven to be something other then the topic starter is reading it as.

You don't have to pass an IQ test to be in the senate. --Mark Pryor, Senator
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TheStonePilot

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Posted at: 11/3/09 10:26 PM

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EXCLAMATION MARKS!!!!!

I, for one, am glad that this is fake; however the fact that it's plausible shows that something is very wrong with our society.


Happy

morefngdbs

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Posted at: 11/7/09 06:38 PM

morefngdbs NEUTRAL LEVEL 36

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At 11/2/09 12:42 AM, SHIT-TANK wrote: 2010 California Marriage Protection Act: Website

;;;
I love the line in the third cartoon picture, the one with a styalized jesus...
quote " Jesus still loves you if you get divorced, just not as much as before "

For the win lol !
You said "til death do us part...Your not dead yet"
L M F A O ! ! !

Those who have only the religious opinions & thoughts of others in their head. Have no room for their own thoughts & no room to contemplate anyone elses ideas either.- More


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SmilezRoyale

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Posted at: 11/7/09 10:27 PM

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Statists should support this bill. After all, is proposition 8 not the will of the people?

Do not the majority have the right to pass laws which affect the whole of society, minorities included?

If the state has the legitimate authority to claim de-facto ownership over nearly half of the product of one's labor, and already establish numerous laws and statues governing human behavior, why shouldn't the government decide who gets to run around with the title of 'marriage' and who doesn't?

See what i love about social issue debates is that people tend to be far less prone to authoritarian tendencies, and argue with much cooler heads than topics of economics or foreign policy.

a pragmatic person interested in the 'rights' of minorities while at the same time fearful of trying to undermine democracy by saying that 'certain things the majority cannot vote away' might say to leave the issue of gay marriage to the states, because people in the same state probably have similar social veiws to those in other states.

More socially liberal states can allow for gays to feel happy because they can run around with the title of marriage and all of the ego benefits it brings, and socially conservative states can feel secure knowing that the sanctity of the term marriage (Which has itself been completely discredited over the years) is left in tact.

but then it might make more sense to do it on a per county basis, since the people living in one part of one state, (for instance, California) probably have different social views than those in other parts of the state, and people living in the same county probably have more uniform social views. This has the added benefit of radical changes in social policy being less potentially ruinous to individuals living in those counties, if they ever had to move, it might not require moving very far.

of course if you took this to it's rational conclusion, one would have to say that the most optimal solution to the social problem is to have these issues done on the most local of levels, to that of villages or hamlets, and in this way home buyers can factor in social law legislation in those towns when they move, and not be forced to live in other states or worse, other countries, just to live in a place that is more tollerant of their lifestyles. You are far more likely to get a consensus of 90% of people or more agreeing to a particular proposal because they all share a similar social background, in a hamlet, then a conesnsus of 90% of everyone in a country of 300 million, where the cultural differences amongst Americans are nearly comparable to that of European states.

This solution also makes the issue of gay marriage less of a psychodrama. You wouldn't have people going insane trying to impose their 'system' upon millions of total strangers because individual sovereignty is maximized.

In reality what i have just described is perhaps a crude model of what occurs in a market, individuals or small groups deciding amongst themselves and only themselfs what the arrangements will be, rather than forming 51% percent gangs and forcing other people who have nothing in common with them, to live and act the way THEY want them do.

"Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else." - Bastiat


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danicos

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Posted at: 11/9/09 07:59 PM

danicos LIGHT LEVEL 15

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My money tastes like colors!

Only a rapist has the ability to read this

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