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As for the story, I don't think we really need anything as complicated as some of the suggestions, we need something simple that lays the premise for the game, something like this:

"after a numbingly long day of school, homework and awful television programming masquerading as "family time" your head finally hits the pillow, your sanctuary, your place of dreaming and imagination. 'Life is for squares,' you think, 'dreaming is where the action is.' Your mind becomes hazy as you... drift... off... to... zzz..."

I'm no writer, but I think that's the kind of thing that can set the stage. Simple and direct, the reader knows what's going on and, hopefully, can identify with it.

as similarly mentioned with by jonny,
I would like both upgradeable skills threw levels and a shop to buy enhancements
A good example of what I am thinking of is here in this game Sky Fyre, it was on the front page a little while ago, I'm sure some of you played it, the only thing is with the stats I want them to be much more in depth and alot more to the shop.

• 
  SkyFyre by soybeansoft

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  Game

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At 10/20/09 03:38 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote:

Night-terror world.
Wet dream land.
Fantasy.
Memories-Cannon fodder anime (An industrial country devoted to artillery - wait til they go down the lift for better example) (think this could really work, I don't want to say steam punk, but ...)
Wonderland (kind've hope for this kind of surrealism throughout the game) (place devoted for people without Flash or PS)
Tiki jungle ... :) (no idea how to make this a flying shooter)
Disease world, or microscopic world
"Honey I've shrunk the kids" world
Deep-sea clock work fish world.

Just want to underline I reckon abstract designs would be much better. Say the dragon in fantasy land isn't a typical one, but maybe like a mockturtle, or looks like a gigantic wooden cupboard (bedroom references)

I think we should also make a list of what will be required in each level. I think at this stage before we have an ASer we should stick with things that can be aplied even if some of the ideas can't be implemented, such as background images and concept sketches of enemies and whatnot.

I don't think much work should be put into finished pieces before you've gotten feedback from everyone else, first. Save you putting in alot of effort and it not fitting in or needing to make some changes. Stick to ideas and sketches.

At 10/20/09 10:17 AM, TomFulp wrote: I wonder if it would be a total disaster if a unique programmer took on each level, with a core engine the drives the game. I've been wanting to do a programming contest for years now where people can create the boss routines to challenge a common player... The only tricky thing here is that most programmers would rather make their own engine from scratch, and if I made the engine a lot of programmer would probably laugh at it, although I think I could make something that would be flexible for people to have fun with... Or maybe I could just try programming it but I'm not totally reliable. I do wanna program a new shooter though... 60fps with all raster art and 24 bit pngs... with crazy explosions and fancy glowing bullets. Madness Accelerant was slowed down by all the vector art, but 100% raster would be blazing fast.

I don't know enough about actionscript to know if that would work well or not, but if you want to work with us on getting this project realized that would be fantastic.

Blazing fast sounds great to me, so 24 bit pngs it is, that'll be perfect for those who work with Photoshop, Gimp, Painter, Flash or whatever.

At 10/20/09 10:18 AM, TomFulp wrote: Should we consider a contest for aspiring game designers... All the "idea guys" who don't draw or program... Let them come up with inventive boss routines, at which point the artists try to visualize what those bosses would look like and the programmer interprets the routines into code?

That works for me too, I like the idea of getting as many different kind of talent as possible involved. A contest would be a good way to drum up more interest.

I really appreciate you supporting this project and bringing in some ideas. Thanks a lot.

I think having different programmers for each level would be a total disaster... I mean, you could pull it off, but you`d need to have quite talented programmers. I`d rather have a team of programmers (4?) that can work together on everything and divide some tasks... Compare it to building a lego castle; If one guy makes one wall, and the other guy makes a tower, and yet another guy makes the gate, you would end up with a wall thats wider than the tower, and a gate thats higher than the tower....

okay bad comparison, but you get what I mean right?

In the same light, I think a contest for programmers/game designers (two seperate contests that is...) would be totally awesome, but I think they should be seperate from this project.... It is going to be difficult enough to get this thing together as it is. I mean, we will have a few dozen artists working on this... getting a dozen programmers as well is only going to make things extremely complicated.

some other points:
I still think making groups is a good idea, every group would do a level....
Seeing as how a lot of poeple are against the whole story idea (and you guys do have some valid points), I suggest just making it really random...
well not really random but just have a selection screen like below:
You can have different dreams (episodes) all with multiple levels (stages). You start in the level selection screen. You then choose a certain episode. Once you have finished the first stage of that episode, you go back to the level selection screen. You can now play the same episode again, and will be taken to the second stage in that episode, or choose another episode and do the first stage in that episode.
The stages increase in difficulty but the episodes dont; stage 3-1 is as difficult as stage 7-1. Stage 3-1 is easy, 3-2 moderate 3-3 hard.

Succesfully completing a stage makes your sleep deeper, but when you die, you come closer to waking up.... die three times in a row and you wake up, game over.
Certain episodes might be unlockable for completing episode 3 and 5, or for completing an episode by killing all/no enemies.
Upgrades could be bought from the menu select screen, and would make it easier to complete the later stages.
Goal is not story related, just keep on dreaming as long as possible. so maybe there could be an unlockable neverending dream, which is like exhaustion mode.

holy hell we got Tom to post in here!
I am so under dressed >.> (bad time to be surfing in my boxers )
I didn't think this project was gathering this much attention

I'd love to take part in this.

As for upgrades, we could go with a kind of "Upgrade workshop" You cant BUY upgrades, you FIND them, just floating around after killing certain types of enemy e.g a golden version of a normal enemy. This is a similar idea to the gummi ships in Kingdom Hearts. You could choose where parts go, like in http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/49 0290

At 10/20/09 11:46 AM, J-qb wrote: well not really random but just have a selection screen like below:
You can have different dreams (episodes) all with multiple levels (stages). You start in the level selection screen. You then choose a certain episode. Once you have finished the first stage of that episode, you go back to the level selection screen. You can now play the same episode again, and will be taken to the second stage in that episode, or choose another episode and do the first stage in that episode.
The stages increase in difficulty but the episodes dont; stage 3-1 is as difficult as stage 7-1. Stage 3-1 is easy, 3-2 moderate 3-3 hard.

Succesfully completing a stage makes your sleep deeper, but when you die, you come closer to waking up.... die three times in a row and you wake up, game over.

I really like this idea. I can see an awesome cut scene when you enter a level of you falling asleep, then when you die waking up a little, waking up a little more each time you die and then violently wake when your lives are up.

Beginning the game could even be falling asleep. Winning the level means you have an awesome dream and wake up in a great mood. Each new level could be the next day's sleep. Mini-games could be naps in work\school.

Tom's idea about the independently programmed stages seems pretty cool, it's be more labourious but if we round up a bunch of programmers it won't be.

I think we should take stock of whom is actively willing to participate, who's leading the stage groups and what kind of stage everyone wants to make so we'll know who belongs in what group.

I want to do one of those fantasy type dream stages, a playful one, with some abstraction and a childishness to it.

I'd probably redraw my old character here as the boss if that was permitted.

At 10/20/09 02:53 PM, Knocturne wrote: I'd probably redraw my old character here as the boss if that was permitted.

Kid A much?

I know it looks a bit like the Radiohead bear. But I think it's just the teeth.

The point of your reply was?

For deciding on the number of levels we should figure out how many different themes we want to pack in since we can equate each theme to a level. I don't think we should pack in a TON of levels, but rather a few really polished ones 5 or 6, maybe.

I do like the idea of going from happy/dreamy/safe levels early on to scary/nightmare levels near the end but I don't know how realistic it is, if we can develp some themes around that progression then we can do it.

Anyway here are some of ideas for themes that might work, some of which were suggested by others, I took the liberty of assigning where I think they might fall in the dream-nightmare progression:
1) Bumblebee/insect level (easy)
2) Fish/underwater/dolphin level (easy)
3) Circuitboard/computer virus level (medium)
4) Space shooter level (medium)
5) Steampunk level (hard)
6) Hell level (hard)

We should make a list of all the ideas for themes that people have and whittle it down to 5 or 6 good ideas and then we can decide on teams for making the art and level layouts.

Sound good?

At 10/20/09 05:41 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: We should make a list of all the ideas for themes that people have and whittle it down to 5 or 6 good ideas and then we can decide on teams for making the art and level layouts.

Medieval/fantasy level
Prehistoric level

At 10/20/09 11:46 AM, J-qb wrote: Certain episodes might be unlockable for completing episode 3 and 5, or for completing an episode by killing all/no enemies.

How about some rpg-features?
like when you kill enemies/victims you become evil or you save them to become good, last level could change between heaven and hell (destroy the other side)
evil/good could also affect the ship's look and the specialpowers

some story ideas:
like mentioned falling a sleep in class:
first level is a "doodle-level" on your paper, then you fall asleep and dream of your drawn game

What if the last level is just a mix of all the other levels? The previous levels merge into one twisted insane one that makes no sense whatsoever.

At 10/20/09 06:38 PM, big-jonny-13 wrote:
We'll already have rpg features of upgrading your ship, but the good/evil thing is just too complicated.

the good evil thing sounds more like a concept all all on it's own, it would be kind of difficult to add in to our present choices

At 10/20/09 06:04 PM, J-qb wrote:

At 10/20/09 05:41 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: We should make a list of all the ideas for themes that people have and whittle it down to 5 or 6 good ideas and then we can decide on teams for making the art and level layouts.

Medieval/fantasy level
Prehistoric level

How about a mountain level?
Hm?

I demand a penicorn boss.

I definitely am liking the idea of having it switch from overview to sideview scrolling shooter. I'd like a level with a much darker theme to be included.

At 10/20/09 08:33 PM, SirNightOwl wrote: I demand a penicorn boss.

Lol. That could go with the Newgrounds themed level someone suggested earlier.

I think we just need a few more ideas before we decide which ones we want to do and then we can assign teams.

Bumblebee/insect level
Fish/underwater/dolphin level
Circuitboard/computer virus level
Space shooter level
Steampunk level
Hell level
Medieval/fantasy level
Flash portal/Newgrounds level
Surreal level
Prehistoric level
Feudal japan level

If someone draws all the parts of their character (arms, legs, torso, etc.) I can animate it, if you want...

At 10/20/09 08:39 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: Bumblebee/insect level
Fish/underwater/dolphin level
Circuitboard/computer virus level
Space shooter level
Steampunk level
Hell level
Medieval/fantasy level
Flash portal/Newgrounds level
Surreal level
Prehistoric level
Feudal japan level

Here is a test ship for a space themed level, although I do like LegolaSS's ship better.
PerhapsI should model it :P