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At 8/12/09 12:27 AM, MagicalSarai wrote: Of course we vote, but we British do try to live more civilized... not to say that it always works, but hopefully the way we do things will keep unnecessary deaths from happening. It comes down to... will more lives be saved this way or that way? You americans have your way... we have our way. It's not so much as a right to life as a right to PRESERVE all life. You don't have to kill... you can call and subdue and you can self defense... murder/killing should be an option left to war.

We try to do the same. I won't say the US doesn't have some sort of fascination with violence. But we do attempt to preserve life here too. Anytime something like a home invasion happens where someone other then the criminal gets killed, oh boy, that gets the people furious.

There was one invasion in Connecticut where two teenagers and their mom were raped and then killed when the house was lit on fire. Shit, ever since then, Practially everyone has been out for blood. Everyone wants the two suspects killed. I'm talking about the "Petit Family" have you heard of them?

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/
timestopics/people/p/petit_family/index.
html

At 8/12/09 01:00 AM, OddlyPoetic wrote:

At 8/12/09 12:27 AM, MagicalSarai wrote: Of course we vote, but we British do try to live more civilized... not to say that it always works, but hopefully the way we do things will keep unnecessary deaths from happening. It comes down to... will more lives be saved this way or that way? You americans have your way... we have our way. It's not so much as a right to life as a right to PRESERVE all life. You don't have to kill... you can call and subdue and you can self defense... murder/killing should be an option left to war.

We try to do the same. I won't say the US doesn't have some sort of fascination with violence. But we do attempt to preserve life here too. Anytime something like a home invasion happens where someone other then the criminal gets killed, oh boy, that gets the people furious.

There was one invasion in Connecticut where two teenagers and their mom were raped and then killed when the house was lit on fire. Shit, ever since then, Practially everyone has been out for blood. Everyone wants the two suspects killed. I'm talking about the "Petit Family" have you heard of them?

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/
timestopics/people/p/petit_family/index.
html

No... I can't say that I pay much attention to news... it is a bit depressing no matter where you are. I will say that it is a horrible occurrence. It's also part of the reason why Great Britain has some of the laws it has... to discourage people from doing such things. The knife law for instances... people aren't supposed to carry blades around. There are heavy fines levied and jail in some cases. There is no perfect system because sick people will always exist, but we can try to do something that doesn't encourage death on either part. At least that's what I believe my government is trying... whether it is the best course of action? I cannot say, but I can say that I hope they are doing the best the can. It's not a perfect world we live in... I doubt it ever will be, but anything that tries to keep all life from perishing... even if it's the lives of evil people--that just shows that some good people still remain in the world.

You don't win by acting like your enemies... you win by sticking to your principles and overcoming the adversity. That's my belief... it's what I try to do and I think that if the government is trying it this way... they deserve my support. Perhaps it won't work and we'll end up getting the laws repealed... it won't be the first or last time, but I'm going to stand with my country until they stop standing up for me. Right now I feel safe and I enjoy life... I can't complain. Other people have it much worse that I do.

At 8/11/09 08:27 PM, Jon-86 wrote: The way it i seen here is, nobody needs to carry a sward, machete, hunting knife or any knife with them. If their found with one then what other reason have they got to carry it other than to slash someone's face?

I carry a swiss army knife with me nearly all the time. It's a tool with myriad uses.

At 8/12/09 08:51 AM, Elfer wrote: I carry a swiss army knife with me nearly all the time. It's a tool with myriad uses.

Read my other posts, I'm basically in the same potion as you with that. But a swiss army knife isn't a lock back and you have a reason to carry it around. Would you say a teenager 13-14 has a good reason to be carrying around a 4 inch lock-back knife or something bigger all the time?

At 8/12/09 02:11 PM, Jon-86 wrote:
Read my other posts, I'm basically in the same potion as you with that. But a swiss army knife isn't a lock back and you have a reason to carry it around. Would you say a teenager 13-14 has a good reason to be carrying around a 4 inch lock-back knife or something bigger all the time?

Sure, but there's a lot of stuff for which people do for no "good" reason. Are you going to ban EVERYTHING that could possibly harm somebody, that you can't see a good application for?

At 8/12/09 06:36 PM, b0b3rt wrote: Sure, but there's a lot of stuff for which people do for no "good" reason. Are you going to ban EVERYTHING that could possibly harm somebody, that you can't see a good application for?

Its not about banning everything! I am actually against that. But the fact of the matter is "in Scotland" or "in Scottish cities" for hundreds of years, young men get drunk and go looking for a fight. People die or get seriously injured because of this every week. Their is even a specialist plastic surgery unit in Glasgow's royal infirmary whose job it is to stitch up peoples faces etc.

This is a social problem and even though it is not really effective, making knives less accessible or the punishment for carrying one severe enough as to put people off I agree with. Now if your a carpet fitter and are stopped in the street your no gonna do 6 months for carrying a Stanley blade as its part of your tools. If your an electrician and you have a few screw drivers that are sharpened to a point, again your not gonna get done.

If your a guy with nothing but a knife on him walking down a street, you have no reason to be carrying a knife. You get done. People know this is the way it is, and it still doesn't put them off knife fighting or gang fighting hell of they were over in Belfast they would be at it with petrol bombs.

I honestly don't think the laws we have in Scotland will solve the problems in England as its a different society. Knives are used as tools by criminals in England, in Scotland young lads do this because most of the time they want to!

Its kinda similar to what the OP is saying except the motives behind it are different and that's what matters when your talking about punishment and what's allowed to be done about people!

Read my other posts, I'm basically in the same potion as you with that. But a swiss army knife isn't a lock back and you have a reason to carry it around.

I have a lock-back 7' Swiis Army knife....bought it in Switzerland and went through (ferry) customs with it. It also has a saw and a gutting knife.......for all your hunting/living off the land/crazy libertarianism needs.

At 8/12/09 08:44 PM, Slizor wrote: I have a lock-back 7' Swiis Army knife....bought it in Switzerland and went through (ferry) customs with it. It also has a saw and a gutting knife.......for all your hunting/living off the land/crazy libertarianism needs.

Sure take it with you camping, that is what its for. But their no need to be carrying that around you scheme or street or area. Its not as if their is even activities up here and in most parts of the UK (other than kicking a ball around the street) for people to do. Certainly none that requires a knife.

At 8/12/09 02:11 PM, Jon-86 wrote: Read my other posts, I'm basically in the same potion as you with that. But a swiss army knife isn't a lock back and you have a reason to carry it around. Would you say a teenager 13-14 has a good reason to be carrying around a 4 inch lock-back knife or something bigger all the time?

Depends. Some of them might just want to have a sturdy knife handy for any cutting needs. Not horribly likely, but not entirely implausible either. Personally, I hate being stuck in a situation where I want to use my knife but I forgot to bring it with me.

However, you said the ban for all knives, and you're only allowed to carry blades of under one inch if you have a specific reason to have them (not just "it's a useful tool" I presume). That's a far cry from a simple ban on lock-backs.

Ok I admit I kept it simple. I didn't think their was a need to go into as much detail but I was wrong I guess. I'm sure years ago it was no longer than 4 inches. But then the folding/lock knives became popular because they got around that, so it was reduced further.

But to be honest its extremely rare for a kid in or around the city or housing scheme to be in a situation where they need to have a knife to cut something, I can't honestly remember a situation where I wished I had a knife or couldn't do something because I didn't have a knife.

Their main use here is stabbing and killing people. The police even have regular knife amnesties where people hand in loads of knifes and are not prosecuted, but kids just go out and buy more...

At 8/13/09 01:42 PM, Elfer wrote:

At 8/12/09 02:11 PM, Jon-86 wrote: Read my other posts, I'm basically in the same potion as you with that. But a swiss army knife isn't a lock back and you have a reason to carry it around. Would you say a teenager 13-14 has a good reason to be carrying around a 4 inch lock-back knife or something bigger all the time?

Depends. Some of them might just want to have a sturdy knife handy for any cutting needs. Not horribly likely, but not entirely implausible either. Personally, I hate being stuck in a situation where I want to use my knife but I forgot to bring it with me.

However, you said the ban for all knives, and you're only allowed to carry blades of under one inch if you have a specific reason to have them (not just "it's a useful tool" I presume). That's a far cry from a simple ban on lock-backs.

I was pretty sure that the limit was 3 inches, as most pen knives sold in actual shops are 2.5 inches. I think the idea is - if it is a weapon then it is illegal, if it is a tool then it is not.

Its changed a few times, all I know is I'm safe with my little 1in pen knife thing that also has a small file, scissors and a lighter that I use at work.