Iran's Election

[LordJaric]

The Islamic Republic of Iran is now battling over their election were it appears that Ahmadinejad has won.

The major opponent to Ahmadinejad has declared that the election was corrupted. It does seem strange that at the time of the election that communication was difficult for some people and that sites that supported Mousavi were unexcuseable or hard to get to. It is hard to tell because this article is one sided.

[Tomsan]

At 6/13/09 07:33 PM, LordJaric wrote: The Islamic Republic of Iran is now battling over their election were it appears that Ahmadinejad has won.

I know some Iranians and they are as liberal s you can get... they voted for ahmed

[Memorize]

When the counting is done by all Ahmed supporters and what was looking like a close race ends up in a landslide so huge in his favor that his opponent lost his hometown...

I can perfectly see why they're rioting.

[LordJaric]

At 6/13/09 08:19 PM, Memorize wrote: When the counting is done by all Ahmed supporters

Was that in the artical, if it was I must of missed it.

I can perfectly see why they're rioting.

agreed

[RydiaLockheart]

I highly doubt that Ahmedinejad won the election fairly. Also, I'm wondering if we'll soon see the opposition's supporters disappear.

[Memorize]

At 6/13/09 08:26 PM, LordJaric wrote:

At 6/13/09 08:19 PM, Memorize wrote: When the counting is done by all Ahmed supporters

Was that in the artical, if it was I must of missed it.

I can't find where I read that, but I did read that in an article today.

The election and riots prompted me to read further on about the challenger who is claiming fraud.

Mir Hossein Mousavi is the former Prime Minister who was only removed because of constitutional changes. He is seen as a great leader during the Iran-Iraq war who is credited with building up their economy during those times.

He runs on the reformist campaign who opposes Ahmed greatly and supports equal rights for women and minorities.

He seems to have the reputation of being honest and humble while having the support of the workers and laborers of the country.

He also wishes to remove Ahmed and take Iran towards a role of having a more friendly and supportive relationship with Europe and the US.

Part of the reason why I believe the results were tampered and was fraud is because Mir is a well respected, well known former leader of the country. So I consider it HIGHLY UNLIKELY he would LOSE his hometown in the election.

[animehater]

I wish this would become more than just a few angry protesters clashing with police, but it wont.

[Jizzlebang]

I smell a revolution !

:D

[TheMason]

In a perverse way, Ahmed being re-elected could be a positive for the Arab/Israeli peace process.

* Iran is a Persian country, not an Arab one so there are historical/ethnic tensions.
* Iran is a Shiite nation. Shi'ism makes up 15-20% of the world's Muslims, Sunni the other 80-85%. A vast majority of Arab Muslims are Sunni. So there is a very significant religious tension (possibly greater than the Jewish/Islam tension).
* The fall of Saddam in Iraq (who was a secularist) is giving Iran a foothold in the Arab world.
* A possibly nuclearizing Iran (although Tehran clerics have issued fatwas against nuclear weapons) may reduce the perceived threat from Israel.

Now if the Israelis, Palestinians, Arabs and Westerners can come up with a solution (probably a two-state one)...we could see positives from Ahmed's re-election.

However, if Mir had won we could have seen a modernizing, moderate Iran which is more concerned with working towards normalization rather than chanting "Death to America".

[ThePretenders]

I don't know if this election is significant because the Presidency is a puppet post surbordinate to the Ayatollah, who really pulls the strings and he's in turn elected by the Council of Experts, which comprises Islamic judges etc. I highly doubt Mir Hossein Mousavi would have fair and square becuase of the conservative nature of the clerics.

It seems like the Presidential election was one big PR stunt for Iran to show the outside world that they are continuing the same path as before and that there will be no change.

[adrshepard]

At 6/14/09 06:37 AM, TheMason wrote: In a perverse way, Ahmed being re-elected could be a positive for the Arab/Israeli peace process.

* Iran is a Persian country, not an Arab one so there are historical/ethnic tensions.
* Iran is a Shiite nation. Shi'ism makes up 15-20% of the world's Muslims, Sunni the other 80-85%. A vast majority of Arab Muslims are Sunni. So there is a very significant religious tension (possibly greater than the Jewish/Islam tension).
* The fall of Saddam in Iraq (who was a secularist) is giving Iran a foothold in the Arab world.
* A possibly nuclearizing Iran (although Tehran clerics have issued fatwas against nuclear weapons) may reduce the perceived threat from Israel.

None of these outcomes are good, and the one about Shiite/Sunni tension surpassing Israel/Palestine tension is absolutely wrong.
Hostility towards Israel has nothing to do with Israel being a threat. They just hate Israel for what happened decades ago and turn a blind eye to everything that justifies Israeli policy or undermines the "justice" of the Palestinian cause.

Now if the Israelis, Palestinians, Arabs and Westerners can come up with a solution (probably a two-state one)...we could see positives from Ahmed's re-election.

I don't see how those two things could possibly be related. If anything, his reelection shows that people support Iran's support of Hezbollah fanatics, who aren't going to be appeased by anything short of absolute victory.

[TheMason]

At 6/14/09 11:01 PM, adrshepard wrote: None of these outcomes are good, and the one about Shiite/Sunni tension surpassing Israel/Palestine tension is absolutely wrong.

At this point, nothing is absolutely wrong. I get the sense that the Israel/Palestinian issue is something that Arab governments pay lip service to for the sake of domestic constiuents. But in the end, they don't really care about the plight of the Palestinians. If they did, why hasn't Saudi Arabia, Jordan, etc given land to the Palestinians?

On the other hand, Iran having a toe-hold in Iraq puts the Shi'ite denomination closer to home. In fact if you look at the history since the founding of Islam...more blood has been shed between Sunni & Shi'ite than Islam & Judaism.

I don't think it would be beyond belief to think that Arab capitals are more concerned with developments in Tehran than in Tel Aviv.

Hostility towards Israel has nothing to do with Israel being a threat. They just hate Israel for what happened decades ago and turn a blind eye to everything that justifies Israeli policy or undermines the "justice" of the Palestinian cause.

"Now if the Israelis, Palestinians, Arabs and Westerners can come up with a solution (probably a two-state one)...we could see positives from Ahmed's re-election."

I don't see how those two things could possibly be related. If anything, his reelection shows that people support Iran's support of Hezbollah fanatics, who aren't going to be appeased by anything short of absolute victory.

A two state solution to the Palestinian question gives the Arabs a way out. The Palestinian diaspora would now have a place to go. Arab leaders would no longer be distracted by having to pay lip service to the Palestinian cause. This frees them to unify against Iran. That is how they two are related.

As for Hezbollah fanatics, a Palestinian state takes much of the wind out of their sails. Promises of $25K (a fortune over there) to one's family is very attractive when you have no other options...but give someone options for one's future and religious zeal is no longer that great of a recruitment tool.

Furthermore, there is a precedence for Israel's existence. I believe it was the fourth Sunni Caliph (after Muhammed) who took to heart the Prophet's death bed dictate that no two faiths should live in the Holy Land (Mecca & Medina). So over the course of years the Jews who lived in Medina (and had provided Muhammed sanctuary when his fellow Meccans wanted him dead) were paid fair value for their lands and given lands in the North (I think in the area around Modern-day Israel).

Finally, if Israel would agree to provide aid to the Palestinians and we could call it a Dhimmi, which would further take the wind out of the fanatics sails.

Leaving the Arabs to unify against the theologically and racially different Iranians (the Israelites & Arabs are both Semite people).

[mikailus]

At 6/13/09 07:51 PM, Tomsan wrote: I know some Iranians and they are as liberal s you can get... they voted for ahmed

Oh yes! Right! Just as Americans "voted" for Bush!

[mikailus]

At 6/13/09 09:11 PM, RydiaLockheart wrote: I highly doubt that Ahmedinejad won the election fairly. Also, I'm wondering if we'll soon see the opposition's supporters disappear.

I second that motion.

[RubberTrucky]

At 6/13/09 09:54 PM, Memorize wrote: Part of the reason why I believe the results were tampered and was fraud is because Mir is a well respected, well known former leader of the country. So I consider it HIGHLY UNLIKELY he would LOSE his hometown in the election.

Hmm, though you shouldn't forget the impact of Ahmadinejad's ways. It are not the minorities who control the votes. Someone wanting to change a lot for the more western-friendly and minority support will not get a lot of votes with the conservative people in the nation.
So perhaps a lot of people are plain conservative and will keep voting for the conservative party.

So being progressive might have in fact strengthened the votes and qo there was no ned for corruption.

[Diederick]

At 6/13/09 07:51 PM, Tomsan wrote:

At 6/13/09 07:33 PM, LordJaric wrote: The Islamic Republic of Iran is now battling over their election were it appears that Ahmadinejad has won.

I know some Iranians and they are as liberal s you can get... they voted for ahmed

It's quite simple: "Is the enemy of my enemy my friend, or my enemy?" The concurrent of Ahmed. might be different, but change is not always for the better. Look at Obama, whose promises are yet to be fulfilled... then again this was good change, from horrible to less horrible.

[Dante-Son-Of-Sparda]

Ajmed only one because his followers were the vote counters.

[zephiran]

At 6/13/09 09:11 PM, RydiaLockheart wrote: I highly doubt that Ahmadinejad won the election fairly. Also, I'm wondering if we'll soon see the opposition's supporters disappear.

It would indeed seem as if something like this is already happening...

Linkity link.

Granted, they are not "disappearing" but rather being arrested...

I wonder if there will be an open conflict between the reformists (the most powerful being ex-president Rafsanjani, ex-president Khatami and president candidate Mousavi) and the current president and the ayatollah (Ahmadinejad and Khameini)?

[Dugh]

At 6/15/09 08:35 AM, Dante-Son-Of-Sparda wrote: Ajmed only one because his followers were the vote counters.

Seconded.

[ReiperX]

At 6/15/09 08:23 AM, Diederick wrote:

At 6/13/09 07:51 PM, Tomsan wrote:

At 6/13/09 07:33 PM, LordJaric wrote: The Islamic Republic of Iran is now battling over their election were it appears that Ahmadinejad has won.

I know some Iranians and they are as liberal s you can get... they voted for ahmed

It's quite simple: "Is the enemy of my enemy my friend, or my enemy?" The concurrent of Ahmed. might be different, but change is not always for the better. Look at Obama, whose promises are yet to be fulfilled... then again this was good change, from horrible to less horrible.

He's been President for less than six months. He made a lot of promises, some of which were not realistic (both candidates did this). But you gotta give people some time to work some of these things out, on top of inheriting a huge recession.

[Idiot-Finder]

At 6/14/09 05:48 AM, Jizzlebang wrote: I smell a revolution !

D

We wish.

[Korriken]

At 6/15/09 02:38 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote:

We wish.

watch what you wish for, someone even crazier may end up in power who has the balls to actually nuke israel.

[Dawnslayer]

Watched Nightly News this evening; Tehran's up in arms over the election, and a protestor was killed. The protestors burned a building down in response.

So, Newgrounds: Iranian civil war, yes or no?

[Dante-Son-Of-Sparda]

ajhemd is the one who sent Irans economy to hell. under his terms unemployment is over 30% and people and people 40 and under in iran are obessed with Western culture and and they wanted a reformist. plus people are tired of the Iranian government censoring the internet (IE wikipedia, Youtube AOL, New York Times) and sick of there dress code.

it was rigged.

[TimeLordX]

There are allegations that they used a computer program to crank out "realistic" results beforehand. The people (mainly younger folk) are royally pissed at the outcome of this election. There are mobs running in the streets of Tehran. I, for one, hope Obama has the balls to reject the outcome of this election and call for an investigation and/or a new election with international monitors in place (but I'm not holding my breath).

[Dawnslayer]

At 6/16/09 12:01 AM, TimeLordX wrote: I, for one, hope Obama has the balls to reject the outcome of this election and call for an investigation and/or a new election with international monitors in place (but I'm not holding my breath).

They're already on it; Biden said a few words on the matter on Meet the Press (we miss you, Tim). Thing is, how far can you really go investigating the elections of another country? Do you arrive to look at the votes only to find they've been "misplaced?" Do you ask the people and hope you don't get anyone imprisoned? How exactly is this investigation supposed to proceed?

[SolInvictus]

apparently all the hoopla about a fraudulent election may be based on hype over the perceived popularity of Ahmedinejad's opponent. an external poll had indicated that a landslide victory for Ahmedinejad would be the likely outcome.

saw it in the paper, not sure where i would find a link for this.

[MultiCanimefan]

At 6/16/09 10:36 AM, SolInvictus wrote: apparently all the hoopla about a fraudulent election may be based on hype over the perceived popularity of Ahmedinejad's opponent. an external poll had indicated that a landslide victory for Ahmedinejad would be the likely outcome.

Perhaps much of it is due to the fact that Ahmedinejad's opponent lost in his own hometown. As hyped up as he was, it does raise some suspicions that he couldn't even win that area.

[RubberTrucky]

At 6/16/09 08:47 PM, Contipec wrote: The trully bad guys in the World are: USA, Israel, and the European Union, all of who should mind their own business instead of getting involved in other countries.

Oh go stuff it.
You should see those South Americans as an American/European tourist comes by and their eyes open wide and the dollar signs go kaching.

we're evil like that.

[LordJaric]

At 6/16/09 08:49 PM, Contipec wrote: The Iranian people are WITH Ahmadinejad, and this is the truth, no matter what the imperialist press wants to say.

got any evidence for that claim.