At 5/7/09 11:23 PM, EmperorCharlemagne wrote:
I don't know why musical snobbery and elitism always has to be associated with classical and orchestral music. Such 'elitism' does not stay confined to any one genre, and to say such is pretty much saying that you are an elitist, in the fact that you look down on and wish to besmirch the names of other artists writing them off as snobs. On a small note, you say that Beethoven (because that is the only one you could mean) was deaf and made exceptional music, you also have to remember that Beethoven was being trained since age 3, so by the time he was 50, he knew pretty much everything there was to writing music. It seems to me there is little more than angry antagonism in that statement.
Also, the general consensus among the 'snobs' it would seem is that it varies according to how complex you make your music. If you never have any music training, I would think that most likely your songs will stay about as complex as a Coldplay song. Catchy, nice, but not complex. People aren't going to often voluntarily look for new techniques, they will try the techniques that they know and only those; this accounts for a lot of similar sounding songs in the audio portal, because a lot of artists don't quite know yet how to make a song their own, and to be 'different'.
You'll note in my statement I said "more", which the very usage of that implies that all genres have snobs. Thank you ever so much for proving my point, by the way.
:. If you never have any music training, I would think that most likely your songs will stay about as complex as a Coldplay song.
Case-in-point as to snobbery. Allow me to compare music to one of the most complex and, in this case, comparable structures: higher maths. Srinivasa Ramanujan had less than a 3rd grade education yet was able to create his own mathematical structure in number theory and infinite series, two extremely complex realms of mathematics. In the same light, with little to no musical training, anyone can create complex musical pieces. Your statement, on the other hand, would seem very elitist when faced with the MANY musicians right here at NG's AP who have had little to no formal training and yet produce complex, musical pieces with great musicianship.
So, tell me again why you were offended at my assertion that the Classical genre seems to be more elitist than other genres? Because, looking at this thread, the only ones making the assertions that "without any theory coursework and years of training you simply cannot make complex music" are those who represent the aforementioned genre.
Now, again, I will state for you to read quite clearly: everything I've stated here is my OPINION. So need I remind you that, like your opinion, it's equally valid in the framework of this discussion? Stop with the idiocy and bashing a moment and think clearly about the OP's question and the discussion at hand. Even I stated that if one is going to arrange/compose music for more instruments than they have fingers, theory would be a tremendous help. You, on the other hand, have offered little in the way of swaying from your purist's belief that there is no way to make music without training, so which of us is the elitist?