The IRA strikes back!

[zephiran]

God, that is a cheesy name for a thread.

Anyhow. It would seem things are not as calm in Northern Ireland as one might think. Seriously, I thought all hostility had died out in Northern Ireland.

I am curious to what you newgrounders think about this, it came as a total surprise to me that there still are so-called extreme republican factions left in Ireland ready to commit acts of violence. To be perfectly honest, I would even go so far as to question "The Real IRA":s involvment in this - "A newspaper gets a call claiming responsibility for the shooting" just sounds too much like hearsay and sensatio-journalism in my opinion. So far it is a bit early to tell, I know, and the IRA are just as good a perpetrator as any other suspect, but the IRA just seems like a convenient scapegoat of sorts, if you catch my drift?

[Dawnslayer]

The hostility in Ireland will not end until the UK cedes Northern Ireland back to it. And this is never going to happen.

[Sajberhippien]

Here's a fun fact: In 2007, 1 out of 498 terrorist attacks were islamistic.
Thought it fit nicely here.

Source

[Tri-Nitro-Toluene]

At 3/8/09 04:41 PM, Dawnslayer wrote: The hostility in Ireland will not end until the UK cedes Northern Ireland back to it. And this is never going to happen.

At which point the Unionist Militias take up arms in a mroe violent fashion than they normally would to make them a seperate country to Eire and not udner the rule of the Republic of Ireland. It isn't a s simple as British troops leaving Northern Ireland. If it was, we'd have done it years ago.

[Jon-86]

After Operation Banner ended in 2007 their was a withdrawal of British troops in the occupied six counties. The garrison was reduced to 5,000 troops who were still battle ready. This was in accordance with the peace process. But members of the Special Reconnaissance Regiment, which has been at the forefront of the intelligence war in Afghanistan and Iraq, have returned at the request of Sir Hugh Orde. These forces have absolutely no reason to be their, they have no reason to return. And so their you have a reason for this.

But folks know the difference. Their are two sides to the republican moment today. You have those who agree with the Good Friday agreement and support the peace process. Sinn Fein and the Provisional IRA and you have those opposed to the peace process and believe an armed campaign is still the way forward. Those groups are known as "dissident republicans" by the media and they are Continuity IRA and the Real IRA (INLA and 32CSM to a lesser extent) Its still unknown what will come of this at this moment in time. Still don't know if the Loyalists will be rearmed by the British government or act on their own in some revenge attack.

Its too soon to say anything.

Info: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_irel and/7930308.stm

[Dawnslayer]

At 3/8/09 05:20 PM, Tri-Nitro-Toluene wrote:

At 3/8/09 04:41 PM, Dawnslayer wrote: The hostility in Ireland will not end until the UK cedes Northern Ireland back to it. And this is never going to happen.

At which point the Unionist Militias take up arms in a mroe violent fashion than they normally would to make them a seperate country to Eire and not udner the rule of the Republic of Ireland. It isn't a s simple as British troops leaving Northern Ireland. If it was, we'd have done it years ago.

My apologies for being so presumptuous. It's kind of difficult to understand the situation when your own country doesn't give a damn. But as I said, it would never happen; it the UK cedes Northern Ireland for any reason, what's to stop Scotland or Wales from following suit?

[Jon-86]

To be honest the British government wont have a choice if their a majority win by republicans in a referendum their. Same as they wont have a choice if Scotland votes for independence when we have our referendum next year. So far its been nothing but stall tac-tics from the Unionists. But now the Provisionals are inactive and SF accepting the PSNI (Which I don't think they should have) Theirs not much Stormontt have to stall on. Then again we have this to think about and what might come of it!

[D2Kvirus]

First the Real IRA, then the Continuity IRA.

Good to be reminded that the only real terrorist threat in the UK isn't from Islamic Arabs, but from White Catholics - we'd been getting a bit off message since about 12th September 2001 in that respect.

[Buffalow]

Fuck the Ulster fucks! The UK needs to cede Northern Ireland back to the Irish.

[zoolrule]

Honestly, part of me wants the situation to deteriorate - Just to see how the great preachers act themselves.

[Imperator]

At 3/8/09 05:20 PM, Tri-Nitro-Toluene wrote:

At 3/8/09 04:41 PM, Dawnslayer wrote: The hostility in Ireland will not end until the UK cedes Northern Ireland back to it. And this is never going to happen.

At which point the Unionist Militias take up arms in a mroe violent fashion than they normally would to make them a seperate country to Eire and not udner the rule of the Republic of Ireland. It isn't a s simple as British troops leaving Northern Ireland. If it was, we'd have done it years ago.

yeah that seems to be the problem. Everyone and their mother knows that simply ceding NI is not the end goal. Complete autonomy is the ultimate prize, booting the brits is just step 1.

[Jon-86]

At 3/11/09 11:08 AM, D2Kvirus wrote: Good to be reminded that the only real terrorist threat in the UK isn't from Islamic Arabs, but from White Catholics - we'd been getting a bit off message since about 12th September 2001 in that respect.

Ah that word again terrorist, same could be said for the British and their state sponsored terrorism through the ages, but of course its never reported as a cowardly ambush if they do it!

At 3/11/09 12:50 PM, Buffalow wrote: Fuck the Ulster fucks! The UK needs to cede Northern Ireland back to the Irish.

Read the thread first!

At 3/11/09 12:53 PM, zoolrule wrote: Honestly, part of me wants the situation to deteriorate - Just to see how the great preachers act themselves.

Who are the "great preachers" ???

Anyway their was a small riot in Craigavon the other night about 30-40 lads throwing bricks and had a barrickade brining in the middle of the road, their is still helicopters circiling the sky and police stopping and searching anyoneon the stret or in a car.

Thats no the worrying part, the worrying part is that some loyalists have been circulating this text message as a call to arms again "To all Ulster men and women. Two of our British soldiers were slaughtered and 4 others critically wounded by republican filth last night. This text signals that the war has begun. We must be ready to fight once again. Send to all loyalists. Let the battle begin," thats what it said. link

Now a message which has been said to be from the UVF was spraypainted on the walls in lurgan, claiming a catholic will be killed on St Patricks day. It read "An eye 4 an eye - back 2 war" and with St Patricks day celebratins being on the weekend as well as a Rangers/Celtic game theirs every chance something will happen. A reaction from the loyalists is all the RIRA would need for an escalation.

Nobody wants this! Not the majority, not the people living their. It will be a tense weekend!

[Ledgey]

I hope we don't delve back into another Troubles era, after so much has been done to keep the peace. It'll be hard clamping down on these IRA idiots without creating further tension in the region, and that's probably exactly what they want.

Must we return to a dark age...

[D2Kvirus]

At 3/11/09 04:39 PM, Jon-86 wrote:
Ah that word again terrorist, same could be said for the British and their state sponsored terrorism through the ages, but of course its never reported as a cowardly ambush if they do it!

You might notice I didn't say White Irish Catholics.

[Jon-86]

At 3/14/09 11:12 AM, D2Kvirus wrote: You might notice I didn't say White Irish Catholics.

And I wasnt assuming you were taling about Ireland, the way terrorism is used as an excuse for invasion and occupaiton these days is idiotic, What I said could very well be applied to what the Brits / US / anybody else involved are doing in the middle-east and other places at the present, past or even future.

Terroism is used as a propaganda tool, oh "look at them, their terrorists" their instantly wrong and were reporting this to you without telling you the why, the backgorund, the context and expect you to be shocked and appaled so you also dont like them and dont care how we retaliate.

Its just wrong, and gives fascists material to use to support the shite they come up with!

[Brick-top]

Personally I think the UK should just cut the leg off (figuratively speaking).

Allow Ireland to be a completely independent nation and see what happens next.

[Jon-86]

Old Ian Paisley would throw a hissy fit and scream "NO PLEASE NOOOOOO. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD AND ULSTER" or words to that affect, mind you if they paid him enough he might say "AH GO ON THEN, WHY NO" Mrs Doyle would love that father!

*aye go ahead and laugh at my bad attempt at humour, you know you want to*

[Centurion-Ryan]

At 3/14/09 07:21 PM, Jon-86 wrote: *aye go ahead and laugh at my bad attempt at humour, you know you want to*

I don't think many people will get this.

At 3/14/09 06:54 PM, Brick-top wrote: Personally I think the UK should just cut the leg off (figuratively speaking).

Allow Ireland to be a completely independent nation and see what happens next.

Shit would blow up, fuckers would get shot, someone would have to intervene.

It's been that way for years and I doubt anyone's in the mood for change. Or common sense.

Well, the Unionists aren't, anyway.

[mikailus]

You know, 30 or so years of violence in NA would've been avoided if Ireland became completely secular. All violence in NA is between Protestants and Catholics, and Ireland is a Catholic Republic. Why can't Ireland become secular? No problems, then! The government and nation favours neither religion and suppresses neither religion.

[Squigley]

At 3/8/09 05:56 PM, Jon-86 wrote: After Operation Banner ended in 2007 their was a withdrawal of British troops in the occupied six counties. The garrison was reduced to 5,000 troops who were still battle ready. This was in accordance with the peace process. But members of the Special Reconnaissance Regiment, which has been at the forefront of the intelligence war in Afghanistan and Iraq, have returned at the request of Sir Hugh Orde. These forces have absolutely no reason to be their, they have no reason to return. And so their you have a reason for this.

But folks know the difference. Their are two sides to the republican moment today. You have those who agree with the Good Friday agreement and support the peace process. Sinn Fein and the Provisional IRA and you have those opposed to the peace process and believe an armed campaign is still the way forward. Those groups are known as "dissident republicans" by the media and they are Continuity IRA and the Real IRA (INLA and 32CSM to a lesser extent) Its still unknown what will come of this at this moment in time. Still don't know if the Loyalists will be rearmed by the British government or act on their own in some revenge attack.

Its too soon to say anything.

Info: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_irel and/7930308.stm

Hmm, actually... the SRR has every right to be there. They were in london in the aftermath of the 7/7 bombings, for one. NI doesn't have the intelligence gathering capabilities to apprehend RIRA, or CIRA. There was intel which suggested that an attack was coming up, hence the SRR's redeployment to the province. It's much the same as if MI5, or MI6 agents were deployed again. Just different in name, to be honest.

And, saying that the loyalists will get re-armed by the British government? Are you out of your mind? The loyalists want feck all to do with this, and aren't going to attack. Too much work has been done, and nobody, apart from those who thrive on chaos, want a return to the violence of the late 70's/late 80's.

6 have been arrested - 3 in relation to the 2 sappers shooting, and the 3 in regards to the PSNI officer's shooting. The situation isn't going to deteriorate, as neither RIRA, or CIRA, have the capacity to waste men, as in total, they only number maybe... 70-80 people?

I have respect for some of the PIRA members - they actually didn't enjoy causing loss of life, but these people... I detest. The Omagh bombing, which claimed the lives of 28 people, was caused by RIRA, for instance. Disgusting.

[Jon-86]

At 3/15/09 05:32 AM, mikailus wrote: You know, 30 or so years of violence in NA would've been avoided if Ireland became completely secular. All violence in NA is between Protestants and Catholics, and Ireland is a Catholic Republic. Why can't Ireland become secular? No problems, then! The government and nation favours neither religion and suppresses neither religion.

First of all it had been going on for longer than then, the troubles were just the height of the violence and when the world learned about it. Its not as simple as blaming it all on religion because its not about that. Republicans are fighting for land. Thats what its really about. Many of those fighting for the six counties opposed the free-state after the uprising and after the civil war. And thats why the republic had the border campaign up until the split in the IRA when the Provisionals were formed.

Why where they formed? Because the Official IRA were not protecting communities in the north. Partition had been established and it was the British when the Protestants were in power who wanted to discriminate against the Catholics. Then after they unsuccessfully tried to stop the civil rights moment 'bloody Sunday' happened and the troubles started.

At 3/15/09 11:59 AM, Squigley wrote: Hmm, actually... the SRR has every right to be there. They were in london in the aftermath of the 7/7 bombings, for one. NI doesn't have the intelligence gathering capabilities to apprehend RIRA, or CIRA. There was intel which suggested that an attack was coming up, hence the SRR's redeployment to the province. It's much the same as if MI5, or MI6 agents were deployed again. Just different in name, to be honest.

No they dont and this is in accordance with the Good Friday agreement. Which has seen the withdraw of troops and the dismantling / closing of watch towers and interment camps / prisons. Not only that its already well known and accepted that both the Continuity and Real IRA have been infiltrated by British informants. Even if they were gonna be brought in. Their was no need to make that public knowledge.

And, saying that the loyalists will get re-armed by the British government? Are you out of your mind? The loyalists want feck all to do with this, and aren't going to attack. Too much work has been done, and nobody, apart from those who thrive on chaos, want a return to the violence of the late 70's/late 80's.

"those who thrive on chaos" would be the loyalists. Sinn Fein are making progress in Stormont. Recently the things they have used to delay reunification, such as the Provos still being active or republican communities not accepting the RUC have been resolved. They were even thinking about brining down the peace barriers for gods sake.

If their ever was going to be an escalation the loyalists would be re-armed at some point I have no doubts about that. Maybe troops would be deployed on the streets before that happened but it would happen like it did years ago. I would even say their are more loyalist dissidents than republican ones as they still have "shows of strength" in both Ireland and Scotland.

6 have been arrested - 3 in relation to the 2 sappers shooting, and the 3 in regards to the PSNI officer's shooting. The situation isn't going to deteriorate, as neither RIRA, or CIRA, have the capacity to waste men, as in total, they only number maybe... 70-80 people?

And I'm happy for that, glad nobody was killed this weekend because of it, over their or over here.

I have respect for some of the PIRA members - they actually didn't enjoy causing loss of life, but these people... I detest. The Omagh bombing, which claimed the lives of 28 people, was caused by RIRA, for instance. Disgusting.

Nobody enjoyed causing loss of life unless it was a soldier or police officer during the war. As I said I support the peace process so I dont agree with what the dissidents do. Sure go ahead and detest them. At least you seem to differentiate between those opposed to peace and those who work towards it. Instead of the blanket generalisation of "terrorist scum" the media use most of the time.

[Squigley]

At 3/16/09 10:45 AM, Jon-86 wrote: No they dont and this is in accordance with the Good Friday agreement. Which has seen the withdraw of troops and the dismantling / closing of watch towers and interment camps / prisons. Not only that its already well known and accepted that both the Continuity and Real IRA have been infiltrated by British informants. Even if they were gonna be brought in. Their was no need to make that public knowledge.

Hmm, I ain't entirely sure on that. There are/were still 5,000 troops in NI, but that's more like a standard garrison force, than a peacekeeping force. CIRA, and RIRA, actually... MI5/MI6 has publically stated they don't have a great deal of information - they have it on old members, but not the younger lads, of 17-21, which are the majority of their members. Problem is, stuff like that would have come out later, or been leaked to the media, it always is.

"those who thrive on chaos" would be the loyalists. Sinn Fein are making progress in Stormont. Recently the things they have used to delay reunification, such as the Provos still being active or republican communities not accepting the RUC have been resolved. They were even thinking about brining down the peace barriers for gods sake.

Hmm, I would regard a minority of the republican paramilitaries as being in for the chaos - it's the same with any group, there are just people like that. The Loyalists, I'd agree, they're just in it for the fighting. But... the recent comments by Martin McGuiness, have actually been explained - two of those who got arrested, were defectors from PIRA, who went to RIRA, last year - hence the "Traitors to the island of Ireland." comment. As I say - RIRA, and CIRA, are in it for the chaos, nothing else.

If their ever was going to be an escalation the loyalists would be re-armed at some point I have no doubts about that. Maybe troops would be deployed on the streets before that happened but it would happen like it did years ago. I would even say their are more loyalist dissidents than republican ones as they still have "shows of strength" in both Ireland and Scotland.

I don't doubt it - there were a lot less of the weapons by the Loyalists decommisioned, but as the PSNI have said, the weapons used last weekend, weren't any of the old ones, they appeared to have been smuggled in. I wouldn't be suprised at them doing something bloody stupid, however. But, soldiers getting redeployed... Ain't gonna happen. It'd be completely against the agreement of the GFA, and stupid to do so. Nobody wants a return to the past.

I have respect for some of the PIRA members - they actually didn't enjoy causing loss of life, but these people... I detest. The Omagh bombing, which claimed the lives of 28 people, was caused by RIRA, for instance. Disgusting.

Nobody enjoyed causing loss of life unless it was a soldier or police officer during the war. As I said I support the peace process so I dont agree with what the dissidents do. Sure go ahead and detest them. At least you seem to differentiate between those opposed to peace and those who work towards it. Instead of the blanket generalisation of "terrorist scum" the media use most of the time.

There were some who did, but it was a rarity, I admit. Mind you, "collaboraters" were just as good targets, so... Hmm. I want peace in NI, and those bastards that work against it, wanting to replace PIRA, now that they've disarmed - which is effectively what they want to do, and what RIRA said it was trying to do when it formed, as far as I am aware.

At least more of them have been arrested - thankfully, the Loyalists didn't do anything bloody stupid.

[mikailus]

CORRECTION: I meant to say "NI", not "NI".