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TheDukeofJuke
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 03:29 AM Reply

I don't know about anyone else, but I came here to talk about audio.

Back-From-Purgatory
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 03:31 AM Reply

At 9/19/13 03:29 AM, SephSound wrote: I don't know about anyone else, but I came here to talk about audio.

And... what's stopping you?


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TheDukeofJuke
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 03:31 AM Reply

At 9/19/13 03:29 AM, SephSound wrote: I don't know about anyone else, but I came here to talk about audio.

Wait, shit. Nevermind what I said. Posted in the wrong thread. My bad.

Mich
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 06:32 AM Reply

At 9/17/13 06:34 PM, Quarl wrote: Facebook stalking. I thought I saw a picture of brit on a horse. Maybe I was dreaming it. Sometimes I dream about my digital chums riding horses :/

That picture you saw on Facebook was exactly of when we were in Scotland. :3

Sequenced
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 08:53 AM Reply

At 9/19/13 03:31 AM, Back-From-Purgatory wrote:
At 9/19/13 03:29 AM, SephSound wrote: I don't know about anyone else, but I came here to talk about audio.
And... what's stopping you?

I agree... if you want to talk about audio go ahead! You'll probably get a few replies from reasonable people...


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Mich
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 02:02 PM Reply

Account birthdays

I just noticed: @Chronamut 's account turned 10 years old 9 days ago and I don't think he even noticed it. Happy belated account birthday, Chron. 10 years is a long time.

Mich
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 02:04 PM Reply

At 9/19/13 02:02 PM, Mich wrote: Account birthdays

I just noticed: @Chronamut 's account turned 10 years old 9 days ago and I don't think he even noticed it. Happy belated account birthday, Chron. 10 years is a long time.

Wait shit, that's in October. Hurgh.

Pouble dost.

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loansindi
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 02:10 PM Reply

Lousy Smarch weather.

Chronamut
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 06:02 PM Reply

At 9/19/13 02:04 PM, Mich wrote:
At 9/19/13 02:02 PM, Mich wrote: Account birthdays

I just noticed: @Chronamut 's account turned 10 years old 9 days ago and I don't think he even noticed it. Happy belated account birthday, Chron. 10 years is a long time.
Wait shit, that's in October. Hurgh.

Pouble dost.

I noticed - I thought it was originally in september too.. planning on making a 10 year anniversary song on that day.. itll probably be a big one :)


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Breed
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 19th, 2013 @ 07:10 PM Reply

At 9/19/13 02:10 PM, loansindi wrote: Lousy Smarch weather.

Uncle loans youre alive. I'm not sure many people will catch your simpsons reference though.

PoonPun
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 09:16 AM Reply

Sorry for posting this here, but it's better than making a thread just for stupid questions.
I'm struggling with time signatures, I can wrap my head around the simple ones like 4/4 and 3/4, but more complicated ones just don't really make any sense to me, like, 6/8, I can't even begin to comprehend it, it's probably really simple but my brain just can't into it.
How does it work?
The reason I ask this, is because the Max Payne theme, it interests me, but I can't work out its time signature, how do they work?

InYourDreams
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 10:05 AM Reply

At 9/20/13 09:16 AM, PoonPun wrote: Sorry for posting this here, but it's better than making a thread just for stupid questions.
I'm struggling with time signatures, I can wrap my head around the simple ones like 4/4 and 3/4, but more complicated ones just don't really make any sense to me, like, 6/8, I can't even begin to comprehend it, it's probably really simple but my brain just can't into it.
How does it work?
The reason I ask this, is because the Max Payne theme, it interests me, but I can't work out its time signature, how do they work?

6/8 is actually the same as 3/4... you are only counting it with six 8th notes instead of three 4th notes. The trick is to count only the first number. Like if you do an odd time signature like 7/8, you count like this:

1..2..3..4..5..6..7..1..2..3..4..5..6..7.. and so on... There is nothing much to understand actually... It's also dificult to explain it in text form. It's only counting until you think the bar starts again.

But you have to notice, there are songs that have more that one time signature... for example a song where the first four bars are in 3/4, but the following four are in 4/4.

Dream Theater plays a lot with this. Some of their song are like one bar 7/8, but the next 11/8 and then 3/4 followed by 4/4...

Breed
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 10:06 AM Reply

At 9/20/13 09:16 AM, PoonPun wrote:
How does it work?

Meters arent that complex. The bottom number determines the type of beat (half notes(2), quarter notes(4), eigth notes(8), etc), and the top number is the number of those beats you count per measure. Its just telling you how much is in a measure man.

The reason I ask this, is because the Max Payne theme, it interests me, but I can't work out its time signature, how do they work?

Dont forget that meters can change over and over in a single song, and so can tempo. Best you can do is tap along and determine whats modulating if anything actually is.

InYourDreams
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 10:37 AM Reply

At 9/20/13 10:06 AM, Breed wrote:
At 9/20/13 09:16 AM, PoonPun wrote:
How does it work?
Meters arent that complex. The bottom number determines the type of beat (half notes(2), quarter notes(4), eigth notes(8), etc), and the top number is the number of those beats you count per measure. Its just telling you how much is in a measure man.

The reason I ask this, is because the Max Payne theme, it interests me, but I can't work out its time signature, how do they work?
Dont forget that meters can change over and over in a single song, and so can tempo. Best you can do is tap along and determine whats modulating if anything actually is.

That was a LOT better explanation than mine xD...

mine was like "auuaa ehm 1 2 3 an stuff bro, u know... kbye" XD

PoonPun
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 11:21 AM Reply

6/8 is actually the same as 3/4... you are only counting it with six 8th notes instead of three 4th notes.

But, what I don't understand is, why have two different time signatures, if the timing is the same?

Darkmetroidomega
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 11:34 AM Reply

At 9/20/13 11:21 AM, PoonPun wrote:
6/8 is actually the same as 3/4... you are only counting it with six 8th notes instead of three 4th notes.
But, what I don't understand is, why have two different time signatures, if the timing is the same?

The feeling of the meters is very different. Simple meter (3/4) has 3 strong beats, and compound meter (6/8) has 2. Think of a stereotypical waltz vs. an Irish jig, and you start to see where the distinction is made.

Braiton
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 11:51 AM Reply

At 9/20/13 11:21 AM, PoonPun wrote:
6/8 is actually the same as 3/4... you are only counting it with six 8th notes instead of three 4th notes.
But, what I don't understand is, why have two different time signatures, if the timing is the same?

Mathematically they are the same but rhythmically they are different. Metrics change, how you count them changes and accents change among other things.

Step
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 12:13 PM Reply

At 9/20/13 11:21 AM, PoonPun wrote: But, what I don't understand is, why have two different time signatures, if the timing is the same?

They're not quite the same. The difference is what a beat in each time signature is made out of.

3/4 has THREE beats, and it's what is known as a "simple" time signature. This means that each beat can be divided into multiples of 2 (one beat = 1 quarter note or 2 eighth notes or 4 sixteenth notes etc). Here's a beat in 3/4: pic - audio. As you can see (and hear), a hi-hat is playing every half-beat, meaning 2 hi-hats for each of the three beats. This way you're able to notice that each beat is actually split into a multiple of 2, in this case 2 eighth notes played by hi-hats.

6/8 is what's known as a "compound" time signature. Its beats are split into multiples of 3 rather than multiples of 2 (one beat = 3 eighth notes or 6 sixteenth notes or 12 thirty-second notes etc). There are TWO beats in a bar of 6/8, and each beat is split into three eighth notes (making 6/8). Here is a beat in 6/8: pic - audio. There are three hi-hats playing for every beat, and there are two beats.

As Braiton said, mathematically they're the same. 3/4 = 6/8. However, rhythmically, they're "felt" differently. There are 3 beats in 3/4 and 2 beats in 6/8. Here's an example of a track in 3/4 (up till 1:16), and here's one in 6/8. The beat feels different. In the first the beats are 1 2 3 1 2 3, and in the second they're 1 - - 2 - - 1 - - 2 - -. It's hard to explain.

Stuff gets even more complicated with the less standard time signatures, like 5/4, for example. Songs in 5/4 have five beats as opposed to the three beats of 3/4. An example of music in 5/4 would be the famous Mission Impossible theme. Up till 0:19, the track is in 5/4. If you listen to the first 19 seconds of that theme, you can hear that there are 5 beats per bar. Then, at 0:19, the track does something spectacular and magical called a time signature change (and also a tempo change). It changes from 5/4 to 4/4, and to a slower tempo. If you're able to clap the beat to that song, you'll find that up until 0:19 you're clapping 5 beats in a bar, and then at 0:19 you're clapping 4 beats every bar at a slower tempo. Being able to clap the rhythm to a song is something you pick up naturally.

One thing to add about 5/4 - generally, songs in 5/4 have an accent somewhere in the bar which splits up the beats. 5/4 is usually 3/4 + 2/4 or 2/4 + 3/4, depending on where the accent is. If you hear this track for example, you'll hear that there's a snare on the fourth beat, which naturally splits the bar into 3/4 + 2/4 to make up 5/4. Try counting the beats to that track. Rather than counting it 1 2 3 4 5 - 1 2 3 4 5, try counting it as 1 2 3 - 4 5 - 1 2 3 - 4 5, etc.

There's a whole plethora of time signatures out there, and even I have trouble following some of them. It all comes with practice and experience listening to music in obscure time signatures, and once you start "understanding" an obscure time signature of the track, you'll start enjoying it much more and realise that it's a great change from all the 4/4 tracks we find everywhere.

Hope that helped!


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Quarl
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 12:51 PM Reply

Time Signatures

Just make them up as you go. I like to tell people "this song is in 1/8." Technically never wrong. Technically never accurate. Incredibly technical.

so fucking technical.

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johnfn
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 01:04 PM Reply

At 9/20/13 12:13 PM, Step wrote: Stuff gets even more complicated with the less standard time signatures, like 5/4, for example. Songs in 5/4 have five beats as opposed to the three beats of 3/4. An example of music in 5/4 would be the famous Mission Impossible theme. Up till 0:19, the track is in 5/4. If you listen to the first 19 seconds of that theme, you can hear that there are 5 beats per bar. Then, at 0:19, the track does something spectacular and magical called a time signature change (and also a tempo change).

Wow, Step really likes time sig changes eh.

I have to admit that that time signature change was executed so well though. I love how the 5/4 melodies are adapted to fit into 4/4. Sneaky.


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ZipZipper
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 02:08 PM Reply

...I like time sig changes too...


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PoonPun
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 03:34 PM Reply

At 9/20/13 12:13 PM, Step wrote: 6/8 is what's known as a "compound" time signature. Its beats are split into multiples of 3 rather than multiples of 2 (one beat = 3 eighth notes or 6 sixteenth notes or 12 thirty-second notes etc). There are TWO beats in a bar of 6/8, and each beat is split into three eighth notes (making 6/8). Here is a beat in 6/8: pic - audio. There are three hi-hats playing for every beat, and there are two beats.

Well, thank you for your very thorough explanation, I have certainly learned a lot, and it certainly helped.
Thanks everybody.

Blackhole12
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 20th, 2013 @ 09:43 PM Reply

I finally discovered why no one uses FLAC for anything other than end-production compression.

The FLAC decoder is a giant steaming pile of shit.

Whereas almost every other decoder on planet earth gives you a big fat "read()" function where you can get out as many bytes as you want and the decoder will keep track of which frame it's in, the FLAC decoder does not. It gives you a callback for each frame, forcing you to decode the entire frame right then and there, or bail out. It can't keep track of where it is, and has no way of doing accurate sample seeking through the stream. Even better, the seek function it does provide doesn't properly go back to the beginning of the stream, and will randomly call your frame callback in the MIDDLE OF A SEEK CALL, so you need to temporarily disable your callback so you don't accidentally read shit outside of actually parsing a frame.

For bonus points, I could not, for the life of me, get the damn thing to compile in 64-bits, despite having the source code. Even better, it requires 8 different callbacks, including a "length" and "eof" callback, whereas most codecs require 4. The mp3 codec only requires 2.

Just to make things more fun, each frame can have its own frequency sampling rate, its own arbitrary blocksize, and its own bits per sample. You basically have to hope that the FLAC uses a constant blocksize and doesn't randomly change or you're completely boned. The end result is that, despite being a lossless codec, you can't actually do seamless looping while streaming FLAC. You have to decode the entire thing into a WAV file inside RAM (even if its some ungodly huge stream) and then loop that. It is so amazingly broken I am in awe that it's used at all, anywhere.

Fuck FLAC.

InvisibleObserver
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 01:26 AM Reply

A few phistle woints.


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camoshark
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 01:31 AM Reply

At 9/21/13 01:26 AM, InvisibleObserver wrote: A few phistle woints.

Can't find his music reviews... unless you're referring to his movie reviews.

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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 01:41 AM Reply

At 9/21/13 01:31 AM, camoshark wrote: ???

Movie games and art, he has no music reviews...


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Lich
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 03:29 PM Reply

Antares are doing $50 off of all of their plug-ins until midnight tonight. Good excuse to pick up something in the EVO range for vocals or Instrument-work.


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AeroMusic
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 07:14 PM Reply

haven't seen one in a while

AeroMusic
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 07:20 PM Reply

so,

cocks

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LiquidOoze
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Response to The Audio Forum Lounge Sep. 21st, 2013 @ 08:04 PM Reply

At 9/21/13 07:20 PM, AeroMusic wrote: so,

cocks

What does the cock say?


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