Domestic Abuse

[mikailus]

How would you deal with this vile epidemic?
(NOTE:BritZombie's excluded from this thread, following this incident)
Also, how can we ensure that chicks don't abuse it, so that real victims stay credible and innocent men don't get royally fucked by the system over nothing?

[Killing-joke]

At 1/10/09 02:58 PM, mikailus wrote: How would you deal with this vile epidemic?
(NOTE:BritZombie's excluded from this thread, following this incident)
Also, how can we ensure that chicks don't abuse it, so that real victims stay credible and innocent men don't get royally fucked by the system over nothing?

alas a lot of girls abuse a lot of things that people can do against them. People abuse everything if they get half a chance.
And also alas no one will be able to stop it, unless you wanna ban Alcohol which is actually the main cause for it and wanna castrate a lot people.

[RubberTrucky]

The same goes for child abuse and pedophilea a bit. I recall an entire French village being locked away and the lives of the villagers totally ruined because a local girl told that she was used in an orgy and raped by her fellow villagers.

The fact remains that, of course, noone should accept any form of wanton violence and I'm sure most of the cases are real. (men are more violent than women by the way)

[thedo12]

At 1/10/09 04:06 PM, RubberTrucky wrote:
(men are more violent than women by the way)

from what ive seen its the exact opposite,
for example , my sisters have been in multiple fights while ive never been in one.
and my mom has hit my dad over the head with a frying pan and ive never seen my dad hit anyone.

[mikailus]

At 1/10/09 04:15 PM, thedo12 wrote: from what ive seen its the exact opposite,
for example , my sisters have been in multiple fights while ive never been in one.
and my mom has hit my dad over the head with a frying pan and ive never seen my dad hit anyone.

Family issues don't represent the world outside. Plus frying pan? Too good to be true.

[thedo12]

At 1/10/09 05:09 PM, mikailus wrote: Family issues don't represent the world outside. Plus frying pan? Too good to be true.

well, its true :P

anyways, ive actualy heard from a sexuality presentation thgat a higher rate of women admit to being violent in a relationship then men.

heres some actual data.

[Conspiracy3]

At 1/10/09 02:58 PM, mikailus wrote: How would you deal with this vile epidemic?
(NOTE:BritZombie's excluded from this thread, following this incident)
Also, how can we ensure that chicks don't abuse it, so that real victims stay credible and innocent men don't get royally fucked by the system over nothing?

There are legitimate cases of domestic abuse, but the way the law has been used recently is bad. Several problems. Among these problems are in my opinion the three biggest.

1. It is very rare that women go to prison for abusing their husbands
2. Many women lie, or even cause bruises to themselves and say it was their husbands
3. Juries get overemotional and almost always side with the abused women, regardless of evidence or lack thereof

[InsertFunnyUserName]

At 1/10/09 02:58 PM, mikailus wrote: How would you deal with this vile epidemic?

Militant dictatorship or recreation of mankind.

We can't stop it, we can only try to prevent it to the best of our ability. All we can do right now is arrest known offenders.

(NOTE:BritZombie's excluded from this thread, following this incident)

It was a joke. A poor one, but a joke nonetheless.

Also, how can we ensure that chicks don't abuse it, so that real victims stay credible and innocent men don't get royally fucked by the system over nothing?

More thorough and less lenient courts.

Women tend to get away with these things because they're given the benefit of the doubt. It's their word again the man's. Coincidentally, a lying man and a man telling the truth tend to sound exactly the same.

[mikailus]

C'mon, people! More ideas!

[Tancrisism]

At 1/11/09 10:20 AM, SevenSeize wrote: Links to credible sources that these issues outweigh authentic cases.

Yes, agreed. Given the amount of abusive relationships I have seen I have never seen any of those three take place. Perhaps I have lived in exceptional places, but I would like some back-up to that claim.

[RubberTrucky]

Also, in case a woman who's clearly injured tells you her man went slaphappy on her threatening to kill her if she tells anybody about it, you're not gonna say "Yeah right, go back home, we'll ask the guy if it's true and then we'll investigate it. take care."
Chances are she will be dead when the police arrives.

[Conspiracy3]

At 1/11/09 10:20 AM, SevenSeize wrote:

At 1/10/09 06:45 PM, Conspiracy3 wrote:

There are legitimate cases of domestic abuse, but the way the law has been used recently is bad. Several problems. Among these problems are in my opinion the three biggest.

How big? I'd like to see a percentage of made up cases of these situations compared to real cases.

I never said that they did outweigh the legitimate cases (although that definately is possible)

1. It is very rare that women go to prison for abusing their husbands
2. Many women lie, or even cause bruises to themselves and say it was their husbands
3. Juries get overemotional and almost always side with the abused women, regardless of evidence or lack thereof

Links to credible sources that these issues outweigh authentic cases.

I never sad they did outweigh authentic cases, but the first one might. Women who abuse their husbands will almost certainly get away with it. Men who abuse their wives will almost certainly not get away with it assuming that the case is reported.

[Conspiracy3]

At 1/11/09 10:40 AM, RubberTrucky wrote: Also, in case a woman who's clearly injured tells you her man went slaphappy on her threatening to kill her if she tells anybody about it, you're not gonna say "Yeah right, go back home, we'll ask the guy if it's true and then we'll investigate it. take care."

A good friend of mine went to prison because his wife was a gold digger who beat herself up and had him sent to prison so she would get all of the assets from his bank account. The second she got the money she disappeared. There was a similar case with a woman matching her description being "beaten" a few months later. When that case came up my friend was released, but women doing things like this isn't exactly rare.

Chances are she will be dead when the police arrives.

If it is a legitimate case then yes she will be dead, but unless there is very strong evidence against the man the police should do nothing more than putting her into protective custody.

[homor]

At 1/10/09 06:45 PM, Conspiracy3 wrote: 2. Many women lie, or even cause bruises to themselves and say it was their husbands

thats crap made up by defense Lawyers to try and create reasonable doubt, but there isn't so much as a shred of it.

then again, all i know of the legal system is what i saw on Law and Order.

[homor]

At 1/11/09 11:13 AM, Conspiracy3 wrote: A good friend of mine went to prison because his wife was a gold digger who beat herself up

oh shit.

i re-tract my last statment,

[RubberTrucky]

At 1/11/09 11:13 AM, Conspiracy3 wrote: but unless there is very strong evidence against the man the police should do nothing more than putting her into protective custody.

I agree with this.

I wonder how newgrounds really feels about women and their antics. In topics like these, I almost get the idea that a lot of people think domestic abuse can be relativised to an accptable form to stand up to a complaining woman. It's more like "Well, it isn't nice, but hey, if the bitch wont shut up..." This may be a cultural thing though. Some countries allow more punching then others. some countries still hold on to the authority of the man in a family and the traditional idea of the woman in the kitchen and being the mother of the family.

I, myself, like a woman who speaks up to things and has the guts to stand up to me. I hate the idea of becoming the man of the house and having a woman who takes full care of me and who shuts up the rest of the time.

[morefngdbs]

A friend of my brother just got 14 years for stabbing his girlfriend with a sword. She then miscarried their baby. I knew him & I had met her. Neighbors talk about how much these two fought/argued. My brother couldn't understand why they stayed together, it was a real love hate relationship.
When he was in remand , my brother visited him to see if he needed anything, & he said he really didn't remember much he just snapped.
Even so, no matter how big a bitch she was, no one deserves to be stabbed a half dozen or more times with a sword.

[naronic]

At 1/12/09 02:53 AM, morefngdbs wrote:

Even so, no matter how big a bitch she was, no one deserves to be stabbed a half dozen or more times with a sword.

a sword?

your brothers sort of old fashioned isn't he?

[elscridi]

look no one should be abuseing anyone in anyway-.-
women/child abuse:really bad,and should be stoped
guy geting beat up by chick[lol]:but if your a dude geting beat on by your girlfriend or wife,dont hit them back,just sit on them until they clam down,and dont hit them back at all cause if you punch them any were in adodmin thats the stuff that knocks them off blance and causes them to hit there head on a coffe table...and if its that bad just leave

[nehemiah135]

if your wife continually beats you then you have a problem. men usually can stand up to there wife's but chose not to. however a lot of women can't stand up to there husbands because there husbands belittle them.usually men are stronger then women, notice the usually, so that means that they probably could stand up to there wife. oh and i say wife because if your girlfriend is beating you then you should break up with her no matter how "in love" you are.

[SolInvictus]

At 1/10/09 02:58 PM, mikailus wrote: How would you deal with this vile epidemic?

can it really be called an epidemic?
like a lot of things its likely that increasing number of cases (if they are actually increasing; are they?) are due to a greater willingness to report them, which is in itself a start.
i'd have to say that we are going in the right direction socially, since its gone from being fairly acceptable to being considered criminal (of course we're discussing the same time period where women went from being lesser than men to equals...), its just a matter of time, though i doubt we will be ever be rid of it completely.
people hit people, its inevitable that some of those hit will be spouses, and there isn't much that will stop this completely.

[RubberTrucky]

I don't think you can point the lack of men reporting abuse to be a fault of society only favouring the women and ignoring the men. A man that is being abused can also report this and be helped.
The thing is, male pride often stands in the way of men reporting abuse. It's humiliating as a man to come forth and say your girlfriends beats you. That's why male victims are reluctant to report abuse.
Also, women tend to be less physical and more psychological. Psychological abuse is harder to prove.

[RubberTrucky]

At 7/18/09 10:16 AM, Fyndir wrote:
What charities are there that offer support to men in that situation?

Compare the number, size, distribution, funding etc with that of charities offering support to women.

That's what I was getting at.

Are domestic abuse charities women only? Are abused men being rejected by these charities?
If so, feel free to start an abused men support group.

[Korriken]

At 7/18/09 02:29 AM, nehemiah135 wrote: oh and i say wife because if your girlfriend is beating you then you should break up with her no matter how "in love" you are.

lust is a very powerful force. There is one thing I've noticed is that most cases of domestic abuse. The relationship is based around sex and not love. Most people today cannot tell the difference between love and lust. Once the novelty of sex with the other person begins to fade and the lust dies down, then troubles begin. This is also why somewhere around 50% of all marriages end in divorce. The people begin to lust for each other, after a couple of years it dies.

The whole "macho man" mentality that the seeming majority of men have doesn't help anything. They only search for the physically women who also turn out to be egotistical psychopaths, then the clash of egos begin and trouble starts. both of my brothers insist that its "manly" to be able to coax a woman into your bed, and I laugh at them. why? they're miserable as hell in their current relationships. They constantly argue with their wives, and god knows, every time I see them they are having screaming matches over everything. I predict them both to get a divorce within the next few years. as for me? I'm happily single as I patiently wait on the right woman, a woman that doesn't put up with guys trying to act tough around them. I wait for a woman that won't jump into the bed of every guy with a little money, a fancy car, and a big ego....... I'll probably die single.

[Idiot-Finder]

At 1/11/09 06:05 AM, mikailus wrote: C'mon, people! More ideas!

Communism?

[Ericho]

At 7/18/09 10:52 AM, Idiot-Finder wrote:

At 1/11/09 06:05 AM, mikailus wrote: C'mon, people! More ideas!

Communism?

Dictatorship?

[nehemiah135]

did you notice the quotation's?

[Sajberhippien]

Somthing that is of EXTREME importance in discussing domestic abuse is not to go in the old "men beat women"-trap, because it isn't as simple as that. Men beat women, women beat men, and both beat children. The one incidence that is usually totally ignored (and at least in my country, there is a bad record of police not taking it serious at all) is when women beat men. It is like it doesn't exist.
The latest study I read about this, is from 1979 ("Spouse abuse: incidence and relationship to selected demographic variables." by Irving Bitman and I don't remember who the other chick was). In it, they asked people if they'd been beaten by someone in a close relationship. ~11% of women answered positive, ~15% of men. It was, according to that study, thus more common for men to be beaten in a close relationship than for women. Other findings were:
- When it comes to really brutal attacks and murder, it was more common for women to be the victim, though not any extreme differences.
- Men were four times as likely to have been beaten with objects or weapons, thus negating any physical advantage they would have.

This statistic isn't fresh at all, so it can't be used as a reliable source today. What baffles me, however, is that I haven't been able to find a single study newer than this where they try to get statistics on womens violence against men. One would think that such a dramatic finding as that in 1979 would lead to follow-ups and such, but apparently, it isn't interesting enough.

On a personal note, I've never beaten a woman though I think I've been beaten at least once in every relationship with a woman I've had. Sure, it may not be that I'm left a bloody heap on the floor, but as most know, the psychological damage is often the worst.

Anyways, I think it's better to approach this discussion in a quite neutral way, since it's a free-for-all game in many of the problematic relations we are discussing.