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Moderate Christians are out there, they're usually just more 'quiet' than their extremist counterparts. I went to both a catholic middle school and a catholic high school, and everyone (including most teachers) was reasonable and willing to welcome the ideas of evolution and secularism, they used religion as a source of meaning and spirituality in life. To them, it was a way to find wisdom, inner peace, and community. There was one teacher that was extremely bias, but every catholic person there agreed that it was unfair of her to impose her beliefs on people.

The thing is, we don't see these people in the news. We see the really bad Christians. We see the old men screaming that atheists are 'demons'. The closest thing I've seen to a demon is the hideous old hags screaming into a TV camera that "your soul will burn in hell without Jesus!" With people like that, it should be obvious why the number of religious people in the world is declining.

Like all things in life, religion has to be taken in moderation. If you can use the bible as a source of quiet wisdom and moral homilies, you may find a better sense of spiritual guidance. No one group knows the answer to everything, any religion that claims to know the answer to everything is delusional. Part of being a human being is seeking out many answers and deciding what YOU believe, what answer is right for YOUR LIFE.

Personally, I consider myself a spiritual person, but not a religious one. I think that gives the right balance between faith and reason. Or perhaps it is simply faith IN reason.

PETA may be one of the most two-faced, hypocritical groups in the world.

I honestly hate institutions that put words like 'ethical' right in there name. I mean, who wouldn't want to treat animals ethically? But humans, like most other animals, think other animals are good to eat.

You can always see PETA members outside animals shelters protesting the euthanization of animals. Yet, they have a dirty little secret. PETA purchased a $9370 freezer, which can be seen in their tax returns. Why does this matter? Simple. A freezer that big can only be used for 2 purposes. Meat storage, which wouldn't make sense for PETA, and cadavers. It is said in PETA's mission statement that "sometimes the only kind option of animals is to put them asleep forever" those are the words of PETA's leader, Ingrid Newkirk. PETA killed almost 1325 animals last year at its headquarters, yet they only took in 2103 animals total. Is that clear? PETA, who protests the killing of animals, killed almost 2/3 of the animals they rescued.

The PETA you don't know would outlaw all meats for food, the kentucky derby, no zoos, they even would outlaw farming bees for honey, as well we pets. You have a pet that you love and take care of? In PETA's world, your pet dog is considered a slave because he isn't running free in the wild. If we set all animals in captivity free, they'd just end up in captivity again for killing people or each other, and would be running wild throughout cities and towns. The fact is, life isn't disney garbage where pigs and lions hang out and sing songs.

But perhaps PETA's most hypocritical goal is the hinderance of biomedical research. PETA violently opposes the use of animal testing to save human lives. Millions of people all over the world are dying from potentially curable diseases, and biomedical scientists are fighting to discover the cures. PETA is fighting them tooth and nail, obstructing the process of saving human lives. Millions of people are alive today because of research on animals. In fact, one of PETA's vice presidents, Mary Beth Sweetland, is a type A diabetic, and her medication contains products found by research on dogs. Can you say hypocrit?

Here are a few diseases for which cures were discovered because of animal testing.

Anthrax, Chicken Pox, Cholera, Diptheria, Flu, Inflenza B, Hepatitis A and B, Measles, Mumps, Polio, Rabies, Rubella, Smallpox, Tetanus, Whooping cough, and yellow fever.

Without animal testing, we wouldn't have pacemakers, artificial hearts, or artificial bones. and organ transplants wouldn't be possible, medicines like insulin, penicillin, and pain killers would not exist. Everyone here has taken these medications at least once in their lives. Everyone reading this knows someone who is alive because of animal testing. If it were up to PETA, these people would be denied lifesaving medicine so that a few animals could be out in the wild.

We're all for treating animals humanely, who wouldn't want animals to be happy and safe? But humanity must come first.

See PETA for what it really is, a group of hypocritical and irrational people.

From what I see, the consensus here is that if Mexico attempted to annex American territory, the US Army would kick the living hell out of them. That's no doubt a reasonable statement...if the Mexican's used conventional warfare. What if they used conspiracy, assassination, and deception? What if...(this is hypothetical, I'm pretty convinced that Mexico won't gain land)..the illegals revolt, and they use guerilla warfare and caused enough bloodshed that anti-war sentiment grew among the rest of the country. Could the seperatists drag the war long enough that the nation literally gave up?

At 5/31/05 04:06 PM, eyeknowstuff wrote:

:Our country is not as unified or nationalistic as it used to be. Our morals, our ideals, our very way of life is questioned at every turn (gays, fat people, oil crisis, etc.) Like all empires that last a certain time, ours is beginning to show it's age. And unless some reforms or reorganization of the goernment occur, it's only going to get worse.

What we should remember is that America is still a relatively young country. We've been around for almost 300 years, but compared to nations like China or European nations, that's a short time. Also, I think that the problem is not with the government system, the basic system in the constitution is very effecient and well organized, but the problem is the people voting and the people being elected. Too many politicians are elected for the wrong reasons, such as they look younger or are of a paticular spiritual belief. The American people as a whole need to become more educated, more aware, less ignorant, less arrogant, and less complacent. Americans need to realize that short term benefits do not compare with long term benefits. Americans need to stop dismissing issues saying 'the government will handle it' and then crucify the heads of state for not solving problems in 4 years without causing them any problems.

Plain and simple, Americans need to stop being so selfish, and stop dishonoring the men and women who have died for our freedoms.

At 5/29/05 04:57 PM, fli wrote: There were attempts in the 60s to legally reunite the Southwest back to Mexico. After all, these were stolen lands.

I wouldn't agree with the term 'stolen lands'. The states of California and Texas legally left Mexico and later joined the United States as sovereign nations. That is because of free will, not American armies stealing the land. The remaining areas, New Mexico, Arizona, and parts of Nevada, were all legally bought from Mexico in a treaty that the Mexican government agreed to.

If Mexicans act indignant (and rightly so), don't interprut this as some cause to worry. There isn't anything going on in the Mexican community saying, "Let's raid Texas!"

I think the sources I have listed at least offer some reason for concern, even as ridiculous as it sounds.

You are surrounding yourself with info that you want to hear--
This is from the horse's mouth: Atzlan isn't anything what you're construing.

I'm not drawing conclusions here, I'm just reacting to what I've seen and heard from sources. If you choose not to believe this can happen, that's fine. I'm merely trying to create discussion about this topic that nobody seems to want to consider.

At 5/29/05 04:49 PM, Hyperdragoon wrote: Look, the only thing we have to worry about from mexico right now is a drop in the number of available jobs here.

I'd hardly call that a concern, many immigrants come here and do the worst jobs for the worst pays, and as long as they are here legally, I see that as something to admire.

Okay, theoretically let's say your conspiracy theory was true. Between the reaction of our government, the time and difficulty to put down the populace, and the fact mexico is in no shape to go after the U.S, it would be an exercise in futility.

Like I said earlier, this would not be conventional warfare, if would be secession supported by those working within the regions.

Out of curiosity, do you have any mexican friends IceWraith?

As a matter of fact, YES, I have many friends of hispanic descent. This is not about ethnicity. I would be nothing short of a racist bigot if I were trying to stop illegal immigration because of the larger hispanic population that will result. Many of the websites I listed are in fact racist I will admit, and many of the people working to stop illegal immigration are racists. I am not. My concern is that Mexican nationals are attempting to enter the United States in order to gain land for Mexico, or perhaps to create an entirely new nation. This is not about skin pigmentation or culture, it is about simple politics.

Here is another website which includes maps of the area that would be affected in this scenario.

http://alpinesurvival.com/illegal-mexican-immigration.html

If you read some of the websites I posted, you will see that mexican soldiers have already conducted covert operations where they have often pointed armed weapons at US border patrol.

Remember that it is also possible for the southwestern US to become so overrun with illegals that they secede from the US from the inside out. Don't believe me? Just ask anyone in San Diego or Los Angeles about 'Aztlan', I'm sure they'll inform you.

At 5/28/05 11:45 PM, Hyperdragoon wrote: By the way, your sources are questionable to say the least.

Would you care to elaborate? Some may not be credible true enough, but I think there is enough evidence to suggest some substance behind the idea of secession. Considering that one source is not a newspaper making claims but rather websites run by seperatists themselves. The first website I posted is such a webpage.

One more website. Notice what some of these people are saying about California, I live there, and I will die long before a single Mexican flag waves over my homeland.

http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/6/5/154335

Think this idea is pure nonsense? Well, you're not the first. The majority of America doesn't even conceive such an idea. Even worse, the US government is well aware of this, but simply refuses to do anything about it. Before you mock this suggestion anymore, I highly recommend you read this article.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/3/7/134033.shtml

At 5/28/05 09:59 PM, FAB0L0US wrote: HAHAHAHA

Thats funny. But also, if it would be a war of America versus Mexico, how would that be a civil war? Or what, are the Mexicans gonna revolt and want to join their country they ran away from?

Ermm. Ya.

The Mexican president himself has publically stated his support for 'returning' the so-called 'stolen' land to Mexico.

Perhaps I need to rephrase this, it is unlikely that Mexico will invade, but what if they were getting help from within the country? With websites like this http://studentorgs.utexas.edu/mecha/archive/plan.html

I'm surprised people aren't a little more alarmed.

http://www.aztlan.net/homeland.htm

http://www.tacklingthetoughtop.../eberhart_silent_invasion.html

I have recently seen websites and read articles which all hint towards the Mexican annexation of southwestern US states. I'm sure similar ideas have occured in other topics, but I am creating this thread for discussion of this specific idea. Let's keep this mature please.

For an idea of what I am talking about, type the word 'aztlan' into a search engine or view this website. This is not an advertisement. www.aztlan.net

Here is an artice elaborating on my earlier argument. I am in no way attempting to support or advertise this website. I am only showing the article. I urge all of you to read this with an open mind.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/3/7/134033.shtml

Here is a website which shows an article elaborating on my earlier point, I am in no way trying to advertise nor support the website. I am only attempting to show the article. I urge you to read it.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/3/7/134033.shtml

At 5/28/05 01:41 AM, HoodedLynx wrote: Can someone remind me why illegal immigration is a problem in the first place?

I really haven't heard any consistant or proven problem with the whole illegal immigration deal.

From everything I've read in the past it seems that it always comes down to some racist opinion or something about immigrants taking "american" jobs, which by the way, is a load of crap : /

Please elighten me, great ones

It's quite simple really, there are illegal immigrants who seek to annex American territory to Mexico, as you can see in the map below. Simply go to any search engine and type in the words 'new aztlan'. Then you will see why so many are forming militias like the one in Arizona.

"Mexican President Ernesto Zedillo said in Chicago on July 23, 1997, "I have proudly affirmed that the Mexican nation extends beyond the territory enclosed by its borders and that Mexican migrants are an important – a very important – part of this. For this reason, my government proposed a constitutional amendment to allow any Mexican with the right and the desire to acquire another nationality to do so without being forced to first give up his or her Mexican nationality."

Now that just scares me, I'm not exactly interested in seeing California become a part of Mexico because of a so-called 'theft' of Mexican territory that happened decades ago.

I know I've probably said this same message many times, but indulge me. I feel that immigration is a necesarry part of any healthy nation, however, this does not mean we can allow for hundreds of people to come swarming across the border a day. My opinion is simple, and I hope that people understand this. I have absolutely nothing against LEGAL immigrants, in fact, I admire them. What I do have a problem with is ILLEGAL immigration. I have got no problem with immigrants, just as long as they obey our immigration laws. We have to know who is coming into the country. In my country, the United States, literally hundreds of illegal aliens swarm across the border daily. I live in California, and frankly, I'm a little concerned that so many illegal immigrants are coming in that I almost never see a single conversation in english outside my house. I have nothing against cultural diversity, and I believe that the latin American immigrants deserve a place in America too. However, I find it troubling that so many illegal immigrants are gathered in the areas that were given to the United States in the treaty following the Mexican-American war. There are some that seek to return these states to Mexico. I find this troubling that people across the southern border don't even recognize western states as American states.

Why do so many people insist upon having a 'right or wrong' view of religions? Why do so many conservative religious people feel a need to prove every other believe system false? Why can't we just view each person as an individual? I view a religion the same way I view ethnicity, it doesn't make you a better or worse person, it doesn't entitle you to special treatment, it's simply who you are, and there is nothing wrong with that.

I consider myself deeply spiritual, but I feel that doesn't necesarily mean believing in a specific God. If their is a God, what he/she/it represents to me is love, justice, truth, knowledge, and peace. I don't believe God is a man on a throne in the clouds who has a white beard. The main reason I at one point considered myself to be an Athiest WAS an act of rebellion, but not against society, or the government, or anything of that nature. I was an Athiest because of my own disgust for Religious Dogma. I felt that it was simply unreasonable that a select group of people could claim such an arrogant position as 'God's people'. Especially when they partake in the killing of 'non-believers' and each other. I also had a problem with the Christian God (I never had a chance to study many other faiths because I went to a catholic school). I thought that if this christian God was so merciful, all-knowing, and all powerful, than why does he condemn people to eternal punishment for not believing in him, especially when there are many other faiths in the world and there is no evidence to support any of them. I believe that if their is a judgement after we die, I will stand before God himself and admit that I was not Christian, but I served mankind as best I could. If that puts me in Hell, then I will remember that 'all-merciful' definition of God and laugh. I believe that we should all just remember one common goal that many faiths try (and sadly fail) to acheive = Do the Right Thing.

A world government is quite simple to achieve. We don't need to immediatly abolish all national governments and expect the world to follow suit, we need to first create a confederation that allows for independence of nations yet also has representation. Similar to the current UN, except it acctually has real power. Eventually, nations become provinces, and thus a worldwide republic is formed.

A big factor in this scenario is the question "What kind of nation is invading us?" Is it a totalitarian regime determined to destroy America as an act of war against all democratic nations? Or...lets say in the future a president somehow gains imperial power, and a coalition of allied nations invades in order to liberate the American people. If it were the first option, I'd organize a resistance and fight to the last man, killing as many invaders as humanly possible. If it were the second, I would join a resistance against the imperial government in order to liberate the country from it's own government.

At 5/17/05 06:41 PM, JusticeofSarcasm wrote: Congradulations, you have realized why the Iraqis are fighting you. They wanted to mount the F up. Now if only you could accpet that.

I wouldn't consider 10,000 insurgents (many of which are foreign to Iraq) out of a country of millions to be all Iraqis. But you do raise a good argument, however, what you fail to acknowledge is that before the war, Iraq was a dictatorship, now, it is a democratic republic. I think that is an improvement.

I think the overall stereotype of the British is that they are intellectual and articulate (to a level that it's simply wierd) and that they have a very stingy code of conduct. That's quite an improvement over the American stereotype = Fat, stupid, ignorant, arrogant, war-mongering, greedy, over-sexed, and unscrupulous.

At 5/12/05 09:46 AM, Andre66 wrote:
These are facts of WW2 in Europe and the war in Iraq. The Russians made all the countries they had occupied speak Russian, threw over the government and changed they way things were run! The Americans tortured the Iraqis. Would you really have that instead of the current government?

Could argument but don't forget that the 'torture' of having nude pictures taken is actually called 'abuse' not torture, torture is having your arm cut off until you speak up. Don't forget that the soldiers responsible for the abuses of Iraqis have been brought into court.

At 5/12/05 06:38 AM, MagicFenixx wrote: wouldnt it be a better ID not to do anything at the start and jsut watch how your new rulers would behave? if they leave the country as it is i wouldnt have any problems with being ruled by another country

Would YOU allow your country to be taken over like that? I don't think you would enjoy submitting to a foreign ruler. If they promised to leave after a certain 'goal' was acheived, then I'd remain calm as long as they didn't do anything that I would disprove of like violating rights or killing innocent civilians intentionally.

At 5/11/05 03:51 PM, mike323 wrote: YO FUCK THAT!!!
What stupid country would ever even try to invade the states. The only country that could maybe pull it off would be china or Russia. But then again, why the fuck would u invade a shit country like the states. YAY!! they're a white supremicist country (True Fact) YAY theyre the richest country in the world( True fact) YAY! theyre all inbred gay fucks (true fact)

1. White supremacy? And Germany isn't?
2. Richest nation in the world, true but what does this prove? The majority of Americans are not wealthy.
3. Inbred gay fucks? True fact? Would you care to provide evidence? Or is that too straining on your pathetic mind?

This country does nothing to provide ofr itself, everything they have is imported form other countries. cool, they make some materials, but not enough. And they also rely on their currency to exceed. Their dollar is worth what now, like 50 million anything in the world!!

...Are you aware that America is the largest exporter of food in the world?

They are overpopulated and over taxed. HONESTLY who pays to go to the hospital.... c'mon!!!

Hospitals are privately owned you repugnant degenerate. Overpopulated? Look at China, that's overpopulated.

In conclusion, I think even if God were to come down and even think of invading the states.....he would just fucken sit their and do nothing, becuase thats what invading the staes is worth....NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!

Lets see here, the US has tons of natural resources, the US has tons of strategic cities, the US has tons of facilities that are of great economic value. I think that's worth something. Oh and I would go further and insult your country of Canada, but I'm better than that. I'm not like you, I respect other nations.

At 5/11/05 11:55 AM, MagicFenixx wrote: ow and did you amaricans ever think of the video osama let the world c a few months ago where he claims the USA wil be strook by another terrorist attack. you cant do anything but watch and c your cevillians DIE. think about it then your MIGHTY army and al your guns are jsut useles

You are sick. I guess you're still pissed off that a nation exists where you can express your own opinion and choose your own leaders. If you want to take pleasure in watching civilians die then I challenge you to walk over to America and say that in the middle of New York. Is that what you'd say to the people who lost fathers, mothers, sons and daughters in the World trade center? Those people weren't arrogant, fat, or sitting around watching TV! They were going to work to try and earn a living so their children didn't have to sleep on the streets. Whatever country you're living in, I assume that it has an even worse education rate than the United States, you are a living example of such. I am simply appauled that anyone can harbor such hatred that your would say something like that, the only person you are hurting is yourself. You are sacrificing your own humanity by wishing death upon so many people. I pity you.

Virtually every person has a different idea of what a 'perfect world' is. My idea of a perfect world is a world where the world community is united in the common interests of freedom, hope, honesty, and the pursuit of a better tomorrow. In my perfect world, people act not out of what will bring the most profit or the most money, but what is the right thing to do. In this world, it does not matter what beliefs you follow, be they religious or non-religious, the only thing that matters is that in your heart you act upon what is best for mankind. In this world laws are based upon fairness and reason. In this world economies are based upon allowing for people to have a secure home, a well fed and clothed family, and allowing for the eternal pursuit of sciences and technologies designed only to better the world. In this world police forces use non-lethal weaponry and high technology for the sole purpose of protecting it's people and assuring that the justice system is fair and effecient to both the affected and the offenders. In this world people do not judge upon race, and people do not ignore differences of culture, differences are celebrated, diversity is celebrated. The past remains the past, people do not judge each other because of what their parents did, but by what they believe and by what they do. In this world, there is no stereotyping and there is no unfair judgement, people see each other as people. In this world, there is difference of opinion but the two opposing opinions share a mutual and fundamental respect for each other.

That is my idea of a perfect world. I hope that it is not impossible.